In The Gravest Extreme
This is a discussion on In The Gravest Extreme within the Defensive Books, Video & References forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hey Ya'll
I bought and am reading this book, I am sure that even though the copyright on this book is 25+ years old it ...
September 15th, 2006 02:22 PM
In The Gravest Extreme
I bought and am reading this book, I am sure that even though the copyright on this book is 25+ years old it is still very applicable.
My question is this, How much is still accurate versus still makes makes good sense but might not be up to the legal standards of the day?
Any recommendations for follow up/ continued reading?
September 15th, 2006 02:22 PM
September 15th, 2006 09:07 PM
First of all, IMO this is a must read book for anyone who carries and/or has a gun at home for defence. I greatly enjoyed the writing style that Ayoob has; I think that he is very down to earth and writes with many years of experience to back up his statements.
With regards to accuracy, I think it is about as accurate as a book of this length can be on this subject. There are so many laws (federal, state, local) and so many changes, that a book written 5 years ago could probably seem "inaccurate". I remember when I took Principles of Criminal Law sophomore year my professor told us that although he was giving us some specific laws and court rulings, what would really help us were the underlying legal principles because of the differences between jurisdictions.
I think Ayoob does a great job in pointing out some of these underlying principles. That being said, it is always wise to check out the laws in your area.
Also, one of the things about this book is the great common sense it attempts to impart on the reader. There were so many things that I had not considered, especially dealing with the mindset and awareness one must have when one carries. In this regard, I think this book is most applicable for today, and will continue to be so in the future.
Now that I think about it MikeV, I think I'm going to read this one again.
As far as recommendations for follow up reading, I too would like to hear some.
September 15th, 2006 09:42 PM
Good Reading...Important Point!
...Also, one of the things about this book is the great common sense it attempts to impart on the reader. There were so many things that I had not considered, especially dealing with the mindset and awareness one must have when one carries. In this regard, I think this book is most applicable for today, and will continue to be so in the future...
"That I cannot do."
"Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks."
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
September 15th, 2006 09:44 PM
September 15th, 2006 09:51 PM
Common sense and reality never go out of style.
Read this book!!!
September 15th, 2006 10:09 PM
I finished reading it a couple of weeks ago and found it an excellent read. I didn't read if for technical legal information, however.
I've now classified my top 3 books, especially for Florida gun owners, and can't really place one over the others in importance, thought I'd sequence the reading as follows.
"In The Gravest Extreme," Massad Ayoob -- food for the brain that has to decide if and when. It helps set proper attitude and philosophy toward the responsibility of CCW.
"Florida Firearms Law, Use & Ownership," Jon Gutmacher -- should be mandatory reading for Florida CCW, and every other state should have such a resource.
"Stressfire Vol I," Massad Ayoob -- food for the body that has to execute the movements to actually use the gun in self defense once we've decided to do so. Makes a darned good case for the differences between military, competition, and self defense use. Doesn't take long for the realization that "draw, aim, fire" isn't likely to be just that simple.
These three books have really shaped my CCW approach and I refer back to each.
MIKEV, your message is yet another of many that make me feel pretty darned good about the CCW community. Anti's have absolutely no idea how much we read and consider the responsibilities of CCW, and that's a real shame. It is such a contrast to their view of us as gun waving nuts running around looking for human targets or as careless carriers who are going to cause an accident/incident at every turn.
Oh! And a copy of Massad Ayoob's "The Truth About Self Protection," 1999 version, goes to each of my living-on-their-own sons this coming Christmas, along with several self defense items. Those copies will arrive here next week.
September 16th, 2006 05:46 PM
I have and read this book 15 years ago. It was the BEST source for information at that time(and for the most part still is). The only thing is some of Ayoob phylosiphies may have changed. The part about keeping a money clip for bribing the bad guys is a grey area. I personally think that times may have changed and that would just put temptation out there(blood in the water) to see what else you have.
-Diplomacy: The art of saying nice dogie until you can find a rock.
-The truth is a three edged sword.
-Your brain is your primary weapon everything else is just a tool.
-When the only tool you have is a hammer then everything starts to look like a nail.
September 17th, 2006 06:39 PM
I really enjoyed reading that book, just recently, before I started carrying. Although technical issues may be out of date (I like how he speaks of a newfangled "9 m/m" round from Europe!) he really sets out to make sure you have a right mindset. For anyone I know who would consider owning a gun for any sort of defence (ccw, home) I would recommend this book...not to teach them practical things (though there is some stuff of value in it, definately) but to start to help them get their mind right.
Overall, a great book! Just don't take all the technical stuff as gospel, necessarily.
October 22nd, 2006 10:52 AM
I got that book not too long after it originally came out. One of the best I have ever read in my opinion. Excellent choice.
The Price of Freedom is Eternal Vigilance
October 22nd, 2006 11:00 AM
I purchased a copy a few years after the initial release. I read/used my original copy so often, that earlier in the year I finally replaced it with a fresh copy. It's the best of its kind, absolutely. Most useful is the way it was written, directly addressing the practical realities of taking responsibility for one's own security. The high moral standards, the high behavioral standards, the practical legal and personal justifications required to take the life of another, the simple "street" tips that work ... all of these are top notch. The author is someone that has BTDT for a lifetime, so it speaks as the voice of reason in so many ways. It's definitely a book of core principles and realities, so there are no surprises that it has stood the test of time. I believe it will be one of the classic summaries on the use of force for decades to come.
Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
self defense (A.O.J.).
How does disarming
the number of victims?
Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos)
NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.
October 22nd, 2006 11:29 PM
Check out, Armed Response: A Comprehensive Guide to Using Firearms for Self-Defense by David S. Kenik, ISBN: 0936783451. Great read.
If you don't protect your self, who will?
October 22nd, 2006 11:57 PM
Massad Ayoob still sells the book. And, the thoughts, concepts and techniques still work for me.
"There is no such thing as too much ammo. Unless you're swimming!"
March 15th, 2007 12:40 PM
I have read this book too and is on my bookshelf. I agree with all of the previous posters. A must have book by Mas Ayoob.
March 30th, 2007 03:46 PM
It's a great book no matter how old it may be.
Everyone who carries a gun should read it.
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