I don't understand one serious point in this book.

This is a discussion on I don't understand one serious point in this book. within the Defensive Books, Video & References forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Just finished Handgun Combatives , by Dave Spaulding. Over-all, I think it is right on target and deserves a space in everyone's CCW library. But ...

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Thread: I don't understand one serious point in this book.

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array madmike's Avatar
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    I don't understand one serious point in this book.

    Just finished Handgun Combatives, by Dave Spaulding. Over-all, I think it is right on target and deserves a space in everyone's CCW library.

    But one thing I read really confuses me.

    On page 121 in the Holster Skills chapter, Dave describes re-holstering and says, "A "thumb check" should always be performed on both semi-autos and revolvers to ensure that the gun's hammer is not cocked when pushed it back into the holster."

    I've no problem with the probable typo, "when pushed it back into the holster," that should probably have read, "when pushing it back into the holster."

    But make sure the hammer is not cocked? Earlier in his book, he did state that he prefered carrying in "condition one" with any weapon that was designed to be carried that way.

    After a shooting has occured, you may want/need to re-holster. But you may also have occasion to bring it back into play, should a previously undetected accomplice suddenly pop up.

    Would you want your carry piece at a lower state of readiness than it was prior to the incident? Seems to me it should be restored to your normal carry mode, at least until you must turn it over to an LEO.

    Did I miss something in the book? Or did perhaps Dave make that statement without quite fully thinking it through?

    Other than that one thing, I really liked the book and got a lot out of it.

    mm
    Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

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  3. #2
    Member Array Dingle1911's Avatar
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    I haven't read that particular book, but I have read similar books. In my opinion I think that if you should have to reholster it should be in the same condition that you carry, the same way the gun started. If time allows you should reload so that the gun is pretty much exactly the same as it was before you had to draw. I can understand with a revolver that you would not want to put it in the holster with the hammer cocked b/c then your trigger pull would be very light, but with a 1911 or similar I would think that you would want it the same as before. With a semi auto it might not be a bad idea to preform the thumb check to make sure the slide is all the way forward, but thats all I can think of. Just my $.02

  4. #3
    Senior Member Array madmike's Avatar
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    Yes, that's pretty much what I was getting at. And it would fall in line with what the author calls the "Continuous Motion Principle" and doing the same thing, the same way, to cut down on the number of decisions that must be made.

    I guess maybe he just didn't think that one process, or what he wrote about it, completely through.

    We all have an "off-day."

    Like I said, other than that one item, I loved it!

    mm
    Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

  5. #4
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    Perhaps he doesn't carry a 1911.? Makes sense to lower/decock a DA/SA auto or revolver. Atleast to me. He probably wasn't thinking 1911 or similar.

  6. #5
    Member Array Shekkian's Avatar
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    Sounds odd.
    I carry a Kimber 1911, and I wear a holster with a thumb strap, so I have to carry it cocked. The strap will prevent any accidental discharge.

  7. #6
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    I suspect he had a brain fart!!

    I would say that a thumb check is fine as a confirmation of safety on when con' #1 - that's OK.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

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    Senior Member Array Tom357's Avatar
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    I agree, it sounds like a goof, but it depends on the pistol. I have made decocking an automatic part of taking my pistol off-target. All it means for me is that my first trigger squeeze is DA. I have had the hammer on my P226 pull back during reholstering drills. My SA trigger is light. A thumb check makes sense for what I carry.
    - Tom
    You have the power to donate life.

  9. #8
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    Good point Tom - glad you mentioned it.

    I should maybe amend my previous statement to read more like - 'he should perhaps have elucidated better on the that whole aspect'..... expanded it to cover DA/SA and con #1 1911's etc. Different check aspects.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  10. #9
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    Dave carrys the Hk so what he is saying is to Decock then reholster with thumb on hammer...

    One thing i have seen in a few videos is to decock then hold hammer with thumb as you insert into holster so slide wont push hammer back.

  11. #10
    Senior Member Array madmike's Avatar
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    I makes sense, I guess.

    So, the only reservation I have about the entire book is that one passage. He should have made it clear that the process would be different for different guns.

    He did do that elsewhere, I'd say this was just a slip-up.

    Back to my original, I'd highly recomend this book to anyone.

    I didn't find it as "dry" a read as others did, to each his own.

    mm
    Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

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    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Unhappy Tight leather will do this...

    Quote Originally Posted by Bud White
    One thing I have seen in a few videos is to decock then hold hammer with thumb as you insert into holster so slide wont push hammer back.
    Yeah that's gotta be the case. I have a couple of new leather holsters that are sort of tight, not yet being properly broken-in and I find that when I slide them into the leather, in order to properly seat the gun, there is sometimes a tendency for the slide to move to the rear just enough to push the hammer into half cock or maybe full cock on a Sig which doesn't have to move very far at all to be fully cocked.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  13. #12
    Member Array Kompact9's Avatar
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    Your gun should be carried in the same condition all the time...whatever it is. That way you react and draw without having to think about the condition of the gun...saving you precious time and not breaking your concentration on the matters at hand.
    noli nothis permittere te terere...

  14. #13
    Member Array WAPS's Avatar
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    I do not know the man and have not read the book. However having recently wrote my own book and dealt with crazy editors, it is extremely possible that a miss-type was made which slipped past him in the final review. Please understand, that for me anyway and I expect most that the reading of ones own material is rarely if ever read as it would be by a non-connected person. In other words, because you wrote it and it is something you are intimately familiar with you will be more likely to skip a great deal of the text without realizing it.

    Just a perspective.

    Be Safe

    Bryan S. Williams
    Williams Associates Protective Services, LLC
    www.wa-protective.com
    www.wttrw.com

  15. #14
    Senior Member Array madmike's Avatar
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    Absolutely true!

    That's why I asked for other opinions, it did seem contrary to the over-all message.

    I don't let more obvious typo's bother me, or the occasional spelling errors. (I'd be the last one to criticize a spelling error!)

    I can recommend that book, without reservation.

    Come to think of it Bryan, I'd say it would be a good follow-up to yours.

    Welcome to the Real World is the one I'd suggest to anyone who's considering the prospect of "carrying," and might have some reservations about it.

    The way you laid it out, it would certainly make it easier for them to make an informed decision. I've suggested it to several friends, already.

    Mike
    Political Correctness has now "evolved" into Political Cowardice.

  16. #15
    Member Array WAPS's Avatar
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    Thanks. Anyone who would like a copy and contacts me directly will recieve a $2.00 discount off the cover price.

    Be Safe

    Bryan S. Williams
    Williams Associates Protective Services, LLC
    www.wa-protective.com
    www.wttrw.com

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