You're so cool!
This is a discussion on Reality of snubbies/response to 1-liner thread within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; While respecting the wish to keep open informed discussion out of the other thread, I decided to post this in response: It’s a shame how ...
While respecting the wish to keep open informed discussion out of the other thread, I decided to post this in response:
It’s a shame how we criticize Hollywood for unbelievable scenarios, but then refer to fictional characters to back our position, hopefully they were tongue in cheek. Many pro-snubbie remarks can also be applied to small pistols.
Anyone who thinks revolvers are simpler:
1) In design, obviously has never looked inside a revolver or at a schematic
2) In operation, can’t count and/or hasn’t thought it through. Manual controls on revolver are cylinder release, trigger, ejector rod, hammer. Manual controls on Glock are trigger, mag release, slide stop; add a safety on 1911 type guns. More on this later.
All sorts of people learn to drive a car with 16 or more controls, to think those same people cannot learn to fire a pistol, even with one or two more controls (at most) than a revolver, are only fooling themselves and insulting those new shooters.
When, not if, a revolver jams you need a hammer or a gunsmith to get it back in action. When a pistol jams – tap, rack, assess/bang – no ‘smith needed. Cylinders get out of time, cranes get bent, timing hands get bent, etc.
Reloading the snubbie vs. auto:
The ejector rod on a snubbie won’t eject all the empty cases at once b/c its length is restricted by barrel length and the space between the back of the cylinder and the grip is limited by frame size. The result is one must fiddle with not jamming the cases closest to the frame while still ejecting the other cases, then rotating the cylinder to finish ejecting the cases.
With a revolver, when all hell is breaking loose and you need more than 5/6 rounds you must use fine motor skills, which you won’t have, to align 5/6 small rods with 5/6 small cylinders very quickly and simultaneously, or load them one at a time.
With a pistol, you can shoot 3x or more rounds before reloading. When you do have to reload, press mag release button, push big stick into big hole, pull back on large slide and release – almost no fine motor skills needed.
Higher barrel placement torques wrist more than pistol.
I’ve seen many female and elderly shooters struggle with the long, heavy trigger pull of a DA revolver, never with a non-DA pistol. Those same shooters struggling with the DA revolver also struggle with pulling the hammer back first. Good luck to them getting off a quick accurate shot, or follow up shots. Many new shooters are sold airweight revolvers, can’t handle the recoil, and then don’t practice when they are the ones that need to practice the most. With only 5 shots, you can’t afford to miss even though you are experiencing tunnel vision, rapid pulse, loss of fine motor control, and an adrenaline dump. A mid-sized pistol is more comfortable to shoot which results in more practice with one’s carry gun and it’s easier to recover from a miss or two. Police only connect about 10% of the time, or once for every 10 shots.
Pistol sights are usually better than those on snubbies people carry.
Flash from muzzle and cylinder gap is greater than from a pistol.
Can’t shred your hand/fingers by putting them next to the cylinder gap with a pistol.
While a snubbie may be accurate, shooting them accurately is an entirely different matter. I can hit targets at 100 yds with my G23, offhand.
While you may get a piece of brass in the forehead, I’ve had revolvers spit lead in my face/glasses – I’ll pick the brass.
Revolvers are thicker than pistols and speedloaders are thicker than magazines. Speedstrips are slower than either. Who wants to carry a bunch of loose rounds in their pocket. Cylinder can create a pressure point while carrying.
Shooting with Injured hand/arm:
If hand is injured and can’t pull back a DA trigger, most likely won’t be able to pull back hammer either for lighter trigger pull.
Reloading a snubbie one-handed is a tricky juggling act. Try opening cylinder and ejecting rounds (see above) with one hand and then keeping the cylinder open while holding the gun between legs/knees or inside belt and lining up speedloader or individual rounds with a spinning cylinder using one hand. For a pistol, shoot till slide lock, drop mag, put gun between legs, insert mag, release slide with slide stop or hooking on belt/sole of shoe/seam in pants/handy stationary object nearby.
Police, who can call for backup over a radio, on their person, with instant access to all officers (local, county, state) in the area, carry pistols loaded with more rounds than revolvers, plus 2 or more extra magazines. When they carried revolvers, police didn’t carry snubbies.
Private citizens call 911, hopefully not getting a busy signal, who must then dispatch officers, who may be across town, – usually only one or two.
Jamming into other person’s body:
Hollywood nonsense which goes against the importance of weapon retention. If the BG is that close, I’m using my weak arm to create/maintain distance, drawing my pistol, rotating it while keeping it tucked near my hip and firing as soon as it’s horizontal. Why would you put your firearm where the BG might easily get his hands on it.
Grabbing slide of pistol to disable:
BG can also grab cylinder of snubbie to disable or put hand/finger between hammer and frame.
Once a BG obtains your snubbie, game over. With a pistol, he may or may not figure it out before you get your BUG or you may be able to drop the magazine, disabling the pistol or limiting him/her to only one shot.
In the spirit of the other thread: The only time you can have too much ammo is if you’re drowning or on fire.
You're so cool!
Entertech AK Centerfire
Daisy Red Ryder
OK but I like revolvers. Also semi autos. Both are good if you take the time to learn and train. The gun by itself is useless. You need an operator with the proper training and mindset. My vote goes to the action you like and the owner who is a warrior with more than a one gun mentality.
"Being PARANOID is just plain smart thinking when they are really out to get you!"
To each his own, I carry both types depending on carry scenerios
Why Waltz when you can Rock-N-Roll
Ha! Revolvers CAN get it done when a semi-auto CAN'T!
They will go bang inside a ladies purse multiple times where a semi auto probably won't. They can go bang inside a cargo pocket, semi's cant, They can go bang being pressed hard against somones body or a hard surface. They'll go bang because there is NO ejection port to be blocked. Timing is rarely a factor on revolvers. No mag issues or really any spring issuses w/ a revolver. Revolvers run dirty AND dry. Revolvers don't fail to eject or fail to feed. The triggers in the SA position are much better. Many can reload a revolver faster than alot of people can reload a semi auto. They RARELY FAIL.... and are used for CQ self defense. Most ammo is cheaper, and their is practically NO maintance. Point and shoot.
That all said, I own many but hardly every carry em'.
All valid points to consider.
Like so many have said before, it's all in the mind of the operator. As long as a person knows the limitations, and strengths of his tools.
Trust in God and keep your powder dry
"A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source
I have both. And even though I prefer my auto, I cant see getting rid of my snubbie. Never know what good uses it still has in store :-)
Glock 26 9mm, Ruger LCR .357mag
"Protect yourself at all times."
"Don't forget, incoming fire has the right of way."-Clint Smith
Revolvers are reliable and less finicky with ammunition. I have 4 speedloaders ready to go. However, if I carry a revolver I usually carry 2 of them.
NRA, Lifetime Member
the title of this thread cracked me up as soon as I read it!
I like both! Each have strengths and weaknesses!!
"Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction."-Einstein
I love my Kimbers, I love my Glocks, but I'm beginning another love of my new Ruger SP101.
One of my Glocks will always be my EDC, but I just purchased one holster for my Ruger, an IWB/SOB, and I'm having a Trijicon front night sight installed...
Proverbs 27:12 says: “The prudent see danger and take refuge, but the simple keep going and suffer for it.”
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
Then use an auto. I'll use my revolvers.
I've fired a revolver far more often than an auto, and never had a failure. I have had failures with autos. But it really boils down to this for me: I LIKE shooting revolvers, and look forward to doing so. I own an auto, but never think to go shoot it - and I didn't like the M9 when I was active duty.
So I'll take the gun I love to shoot and know backwards and forwards, over the one I rarely shoot and have to think about. But I have never criticized anyone for liking or using semiautomatics.
But me? If I ever feel the need for 10 or 15 rounds, I'll go buy another couple J-frames!
I have to say i agree to a degree with the op. If i put my g19 and my 642 on the bed and decide which i want to depend my life on, I go glock everytime. Not to say it can't fail, but i don't own a purse and don't keep it in a coat pocket.
The auto holds more rounds
easier to reload in an emergency situation(for most)
I shoot them better. I can hold tighter groups and am more comfortable with it.
Note all my points are about me?
I like my auto. I'll carry it. You like a revolver? Fine! I'm glad you choose to carry! Hey we are all on the same team aren't we?
The main deal is to make sure you can shoot what you got. A guy with an uzi versus a guy with a snubbie will lose every time if he can't hit the broad side of a barn or his gun is not PROVEN TO BE RELIABLE!!
"In those days, there was a lot more respect for other people and it showed in peoples values.... Today the word value means nothing more than something you get on the $1 menu at McDonald's." -BARK'N
You made some vaild points for a compelling argument but it all comes down to personal preference. Me personaly I carry a Glock 30sf for primary and a J-Frame .357 mag as a BUG. Best of both words If the day ever comes that a Glock AND a wheel gun ever fails me then I guess it's just my time to go
Last edited by DIABLO9489; June 23rd, 2010 at 05:13 AM. Reason: Add
Colt New Agent, Dan Wesson V-Bob, Glock 19,20SF, 23, 26, 27, 29, 30SF, 36, Kahr P380 w/CT, PM9, PM45, CW9(SOLD), Kel-Tec P32, P3AT, PF9(SOLD), Kimber Ultra Crimson Carry II, Stainless Pro TLE/RL II (SOLD), Rohrbaugh R9s, Ruger LCP w/CT, LCR, SP101 S&W J-Frame 638 w/CT, M&P 340 w/CT, Walther PPK/S
You can't limp wrist a revolver. But, I guess if I take your drivel seriously, I need to run all me revolvers through a bandsaw and buy high capacity semis.
All you have to say to be anti snubby is "Interlock" for the smith and wessons. Thats why I sold my snubby, had it lock up on the range one day. Gun had maybe 70 rounds down range at the time.. So until they make the 340pd without a lock I wont buy another snubby.