July 2nd, 2010 12:33 PM
opinions: single stack 9mm, etc.
Hi folks, new member here. Just introduced myself over at the Back Porch area.
I'm a petite gal, researching CC pistol. I prefer semi-autos over revolvers. I have trouble, however, finding a well-fitting grip. Most pistols I prefer I have to adjust around my hand--which is small. I'm used to compensating but would love to have something with better fit. I usually shoot a CZ 75b 9mm. This is a lovely pistol, but doesn't suit me for CC. I don't mind the weight--but it manages to give me a tail when I CC. I haven't found a truly good way to conceal that on me in any way. I know others seem to do it. I'm 5'3" and weight 105. I just think a full-sized gun is great at the range, but not on me.
Recently I got to hold (but not fire) a Kimber custom cdp compact .45. That thing fit my hand like it was made for me & had a trigger pull I'm in love with. Beautiful melt-down all over. I haven't been able to stop thinking about that darned pistol since I held it. But the only .45s I've shot were in the past, were my dad's (mostly revolvers and a snappy colt commander) and were like shooting hand canons.
My right hand/arm have old injuries: elbow nerve, partially cut fore- & middle-finger mid-knuckle tendons. They bend with some numbness and are pretty good, but will never be 'normal.' I was concerned that practicing with a .45 might aggravate these issues, After 200-400 rounds of 9mm, my arm/hand is usually pretty done in and I have to give it a day or two of rest before I can shoot again. I have been considering switching over to my left hand. I could make it as good as my right. It's just a bummer.
Prior to holding that tempting Kimber cdp .45, I was considering:
springfield emp 9mm
kimber aegis 9mm
(sig 238 because of size, but not sure about ammo)
I generally prefer a compact over a sub-compact.
I'm looking at single stack as a trade-off for slenderness--overall and in grip.
Prefer DA/SA or SA. Used to a thumb safety.
Refuse to carry in a purse or dreaded fanny pack. Will want something IWB.
I like the look and feel of a 1911. Good experiences with Glock & clones but just can't get into them. I have to buy this pistol, shoot it and enjoy it--it makes practice more fun.
Can any of you weigh in with opinions? Maybe I've given too little info, or too much. I'm very open to hearing about your experiences, or if there are ladies out there who have made similar decisions.
Also--sorry if this has been covered to death. Feel free to point me at older posts if necessary. Thanks guys!
July 2nd, 2010 12:44 PM
Take a look at the Kahr pistols, easy to conceal and works well for small hands, I am 5'5" and I can conceal it very easy! they are very accurate and a fun shooter. they come in everything from .380 to .45.
Originally Posted by freestate
KAHR CW45, RIA 1911 Officer, S&W Sigma 9MM, Savage 1907 .32cal(BUG)
July 2nd, 2010 12:53 PM
Slim is good, but if you want to lose the tail, you'll need something with a shorter grip on it.
Maybe consider a Kahr CW45 if you want a 45. Otherwise a CW9 in 9mm.
Another thing that comes to mind is the S&W 908. It is a single stack 9mm that the grip is not really long on it.
Hope you find what you're looking for.
Glock 26 XD9sc
Ruger SR9c Ruger LCP
July 2nd, 2010 01:13 PM
I will admit a bias towards Sig right up front, but I think I P239 might be close to ideal for you. In the SAS trimming, it is VERY "melted" and free of any sharp edges. It is heavy enough to make shooting it (especially in 9mm) a dream, which might be of benefit due to your smaller stature and injuries. With standard mags, it's relatively short (and, of course, thin) through the grip. Sig has a "short trigger" option that may help you get a good, comfortable grip with your smaller hands. They also have the standard DA/SA, DAK, and SRT (short reset trigger) set ups - one is likely to feel good to you. All of Sigs triggers are among the best, in whatever configuration.
Topping it off, the P239 is proven, reliable, common enough that accessories are no problem, accurate, and from a company well known for making very high quality products.
(The downsides to the P239 are that it is heavy and a bit large for the capacity - this might not actually be a detriment in your case, as the weight will help tame recoil/prevent "battering" your hand, and the size keeps you out of that "SUB" subcompact category.)
A man fires a rifle for many years, and he goes to war. And afterward he turns the rifle in at the armory, and he believes he's finished with the rifle. But no matter what else he might do with his hands - love a woman, build a house, change his son's diaper - his hands remember the rifle.
July 2nd, 2010 01:17 PM
If a single stack 9mm in single action is your thing you would be hard pressed to do better than the Springfield EMP, IMHO.
I watched Massad Ayoob wring one out a couple of years ago, over the course of a week, and we did talk about the gun a bit. It would definately be one to consider.
July 2nd, 2010 01:18 PM
Welcome to the forum. I think you are on the right track with the Kimber CDP Compact and Aegis, Springfield EMP 9mm, and Sig P239. I would recommend the Sig in your case since it can be purchased in 9mm. If you like carrying cocked and locked, then by all means the Springfield or the Aegis would be an excellent choice. Otherwise Sig!
"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
July 2nd, 2010 01:59 PM
I carry a LW Springfield Champion or Government Full size 1911, and I have carried Kahr P9 and a P40. IMO there is a big difference between the two with regards to weight and bulk. I love carrying my 1911s, but there is no doubt that a Kahr P9 is a superb CC weapon. Grip is smaller and narrower than a 1911. Even though it is DAO, it has a really nice trigger. I think they shoot nice without much recoil. YMMV.
July 2nd, 2010 02:08 PM
Sounds like a Commander length 1911 in 9mm would be right up your alley.
Or a Sig 225 (P6 is the European designator for it), if you can find one, a bunch of them got imported in a couple of years back. Although it doesn't have great capacity for a 9mm at 10, its a good, solid shooting pistol. Some of them have European barrels which tend not to like HP ammo, although you can swap that out with a 225 barrel. And it has familiar Da/Sa Sig controls.
Fortes Fortuna Juvat
Former, USMC 0311, OIF/OEF vet
NRA Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun/Reloading Instructor, RSO, Ohio CHL Instructor
July 2nd, 2010 02:26 PM
Originally Posted by OPFOR
Kobra Carry | HK
P7M8, P2000sk, P30s | Sig
P238, P239SAS, 1911 C3, P232, P938 | Colt
Defender, Mustang Pocketlite, 1911 | Rohrbaugh
R9 | Kimber
Covert Ultra II | Browning
HP, Buckmark 22LR(suppressed| Walter
PPK(1966) | Kahr
PM9 Black Rose |
July 2nd, 2010 02:31 PM
I think your on the right track with your choices, let me add one more to the mix. Take a look at the Walther PPS, very slim and light but has a different type of magazine release so you would need to train it a bit to get use to it.
Of the ones you listed I like the P239 and the EMP, both about as different as you can get but both great guns. Unlike the 239, the EMP does not recommend +p ammo which may or may not be an issue for you. As previously mentioned, the 239 has several different trigger options but none of them will be as nice as the EMP's single action. No thumb safety on the SIG but not an issue as you are use to one at this point.
Personally, I don't care for double sided safeties so if I got the EMP I would have to change it. The EMP is not the same as full size 1911's so parts are highly proprietary and unique and holster choices will be limited when compared to the 239, but not un-obtainable.
Try to narrow your search to a couple of guns and see if you can find both of them to borrow or rent in a side by side comparison, that will tell you what you need to know.
July 2nd, 2010 02:32 PM
You've listed a number of small 9mm guns, and the Springfield EMP is probably the best one out of that list for you. Recoil is entirely manageable, the grip is perfect for those with smaller hands, and the gun is extremely lightweight. Fantastic trigger action makes this gun tremendously fun to shoot, too!
Something not on your list that you may wish to consider is a S&W 3913 -- personally I prefer the Ladysmith or Non-Ladysmith models -- I just like the sloping lines on the frame. The 3913 is a single-stack 9mm that handles wonderfully, shoots very accurately, and is lightweight. Finally, seeing that I brought up the 3913, you might be lucky and find a S&W Chiefs Special in 9mm. This could well be the best overall carry piece made (I know, that's quite a statement!). Still, with after-market "Big Dog" grips on it, the gun's grip is just as small as the 3913.
Good luck on your journey to find a carry piece. I guarantee this is a journey that, once started, continues throughout your life! Enjoy it.
July 2nd, 2010 02:36 PM
I'll skip the gun advice, as it seems covered, but have a comment on making practice more comfortable with your injuries:
Try an industrial vibration Damping glove or half glove at the range, possibly combined with an elastic elbow sleeve. It might take just enough pop out of the shots to make it less painful.
July 2nd, 2010 02:38 PM
Thanks for pic. I have looked into that sig too--can't imagine it would ever catch on anything!
The biggest darn problem is that while there are a few gun shops/shooting ranges within driving distance, none have a good selection of the guns I'm interested in to 'try' first, you know? The majority of rentals are glock, XDs, Ruger 22 and glock clones.
I'm really appreciative of the replies. I'm still very much in the research process and will keep reading--and looking for opportunities to try out some of these pistol suggestions, before I commit to buying.
This board is terrific.
July 2nd, 2010 03:23 PM
There have been many good recommendations. Having carried a 9 mm EMP for about a year now I can recommend it wholeheartedly. The only overall dimensional difference between the EMP and any other 3-inch 1911 is the fore and aft dimension of the grip and only parts affected by that dimension are different. If you wanted to replace the ambidextrous safety no "special" part is required. Regarding holsters any holster for a 3-inch 1911 is a perfect fit. (Assuming the holster actually fits anything. I've had some that didn't.)
Clinging to my faith and my guns.
July 2nd, 2010 04:50 PM
Another vote here for the emp.
Such a nice gun to handle and shoot.
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