G30 and SA 1911; 45ACP Goodness

This is a discussion on G30 and SA 1911; 45ACP Goodness within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Yesterday, I decided to cook off 200 rds of WWB, and 80 rds of Speer Gold Dot HP at the range, alternating between my G30 ...

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Thread: G30 and SA 1911; 45ACP Goodness

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    G30 and SA 1911; 45ACP Goodness

    Yesterday, I decided to cook off 200 rds of WWB, and 80 rds of Speer Gold Dot HP at the range, alternating between my G30 and SA 'Loaded' 1911. In addition to just having fun, I was really trying to decide which was the better firearm. Here's what I observed:

    * They both shoot dead accurate. Both operate flawlessly and get back on target quickly.
    * I honestly don't know how folks complain about the grip angle of the Glock being different from a 1911? Yes it is. You put the front sight on target and line it up between the rear sights, right? The grip angle never crossed my mind, nor affected my shooting, even as I alternated between magazines and shooting hands.
    * The 1911 has better 'controls'. This gun range is indoor and has lousy air-conditioning. I like that because you sweat every time you're in there. The Glock gets slippery. The 1911 sticks to my paw.
    * I suspect that I was getting on target quicker with the Glock due to the shorter barrel length, vs. the full size 1911.
    * With standard magazines, the Glock carries 3 more rds and potentially 6 more with a G21 mag.

    While cleaning them afterward, I was once again impressed by the spell that the 1911 casts. The glock cleaned in minutes - it's almost boring. The 1911 takes half an hour. There are more parts, nooks and crannies. Plus the 1911 just has a substantial 'feel' to it. It reeks of controlled violence . It locks up like a piece of machinery that feels like it will last forever. In the time it takes to clean, it is the most tedious gun that I own, yet I enjoy cleaning it more than any other?

    However, if the purpose of my exercise was to decide which would get the 'nod', it would have to be the G30 based on its ability to deliver more rounds per magazine. 'Incredibly fine firearms, each.
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    kpw
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    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    Incredibly fine firearms, each.
    Exactly! Sounds like a good day at the range.
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
    -- Marcus Tullius Cicero

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    it's almost boring
    That's the problem I have with my Glock 19. You shoot it, it goes bang, and that's about it. I much more enjoy shooting my Kimber, or a Smith J Frame, or even my .45 ACP revolver.

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    The grip angle difference between the two affects how the gun naturally points in YOUR hand. I can bring my 1911 up with my eyes closed, and when I open them, the front sight is level with the rear sights. This enables me to get a 1st shot off quicker, since I don't have to move the gun near as much to get a proper sight picture. I am always muzzle high with the mid and full size Glocks. For other folks, the Glock grip angle may be more repetitive for them when doinig this eye's closed test.

    All in all, what matters is which grip angle fits the owner's hands the best. Keep in mind that when the SHTF in a typical self defense shooting, you might not be using sights at all for your first shot or two. This is where the natural pointability of a firearm in YOUR hand comes into play.

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    "* I honestly don't know how folks complain about the grip angle of the Glock being different from a 1911? Yes it is. You put the front sight on target and line it up between the rear sights, right?"

    Amen to that! Yes, a Glock grip is different. But being different doesn't make it bad.
    I spent a few hours at the outdoor range here in FL Fri. and with the 90+ degree heat and 1000% humidity, I never noticed my G30 getting slippery. Maybe it's just me. I agree with the Glock cleans so easily it gets boring, but I don't find gun cleaning particularly "entertaining," so I'll take boring.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    Quote Originally Posted by gigamortis View Post
    The grip angle difference between the two affects how the gun naturally points in YOUR hand. I can bring my 1911 up with my eyes closed, and when I open them, the front sight is level with the rear sights. This enables me to get a 1st shot off quicker, since I don't have to move the gun near as much to get a proper sight picture. I am always muzzle high with the mid and full size Glocks. For other folks, the Glock grip angle may be more repetitive for them when doinig this eye's closed test.

    All in all, what matters is which grip angle fits the owner's hands the best. Keep in mind that when the SHTF in a typical self defense shooting, you might not be using sights at all for your first shot or two. This is where the natural pointability of a firearm in YOUR hand comes into play.
    I guess that's where I'm just a clod? Part of my point was that neither grip fit my hand 'best' - they both rock. I've heard this argument before, but to me it just doesn't matter. I'm not going to shoot when my eyes are closed - I'm focused on the front site as I bring the firearm up. I suppose if I was a better shooter, I could tell the nano-difference in the grip angle? Perhaps ignorance is bliss for me, as 'Princess and the Pea' I am not . The 1911 is due much adoration, however I still just don't see how grip angle plays into that?

    I see your point in regards to point-shooting, but even then I'm equally good (or bad) with either platform.

    Respectfully,

    -whec
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    yep, i'm a 1911 guy too that owns a glock. the grip angle makes no difference to me either. i think being this is america, everyone wants things "their way", like the whopper. (hence the gen4)

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    "You put the front sight on target and line it up between the rear sights, right?"

    It's when you are moving and the threat is moving and there is barely any time to physically react and no time put the front sight on the target and FOR SURE no time to line the front sight up in the blade of the rear sight that the grip agle difference takes on a far more critical importance.

    Do I need to elaborate or do I just need to state that SHTF Self Defensive shooting is not paper target shooting?
    They are often two entirely different animals & you need to find the firearm that most accurately points and hits where you are looking because when there is a chance that you may die in 1.5 seconds or less...you'll not be looking at your firearm ~ you'll be focused on the impending deadly threat.

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    Cool

    Your 1911 could be your BUG. A BUG does not have to be a "small" gun. You may have to wear suspenders to keep your pants up though. My glocks all wear grip sleeves. I just do not like the feel of nothing but plastic on the grip of a handgun and for me it is a must have in Florida. And yes there is something about a 1911 that makes it special.
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

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    Quote Originally Posted by QKShooter View Post
    "You put the front sight on target and line it up between the rear sights, right?"

    It's when you are moving and the threat is moving and there is barely any time to physically react and no time put the front sight on the target and FOR SURE no time to line the front sight up in the blade of the rear sight that the grip agle difference takes on a far more critical importance.

    Do I need to elaborate or do I just need to state that SHTF Self Defensive shooting is not paper target shooting?
    They are often two entirely different animals & you need to find the firearm that most accurately points and hits where you are looking because when there is a chance that you may die in 1.5 seconds or less...you'll not be looking at your firearm ~ you'll be focused on the impending deadly threat.
    Granted, a 'real life' scenario will likely be a point-shoot. So, what you're saying is that you should only have one EDC? That's cool if you are, I'll still carry an assortment - but that is the net of your point, is it not?
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    kpw
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    I've seen more than a few shooters that had a difficult time transitioning from one platform to another. I've also seen as many that can without issue. Sighted or not, I can shoot a SAA, Ruger Mk. II, 1911 or Glock interchangeably and be as relatively effective with one as any other. I don't believe there is one pistol that points more instinctively than another. For the most part, experience and muscle memory is what determines what feels natural. If someone overwhelmingly shoots one platform, rarely shooting anything else, what is going to feel more natural to them?
    For those of us that are just addicted to shooting anything with a trigger, there is a lot more that will feel acceptable, if not comfortable.
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
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    Quote Originally Posted by kpw View Post
    For those of us that are just addicted to shooting anything with a trigger, there is a lot more that will feel acceptable, if not comfortable.
    That would be me . Jack of all trades, master of none.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WHEC724 View Post
    That would be me . Jack of all trades, master of none.
    Hey...same here!
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
    -- Marcus Tullius Cicero

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    I've shot Ruger Blackhawks, 1911s, Glocks and now a S&W 4566. I come to the conclusion that I can miss (or hit) just as easily with any or all of them. Much like driving different make cars, you make adjustments so you don't wreck 'em.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
    Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid... "For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield

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    It reeks of controlled violence
    I love this line

    I've got a 1911 and a G23; I carry and shoot both about equally. Yeah, the grip angle is noticeable, but not a detriment to my shooting.

    I seem to get back on target a little faster with the 1911, but that just might be because I've had it longer and am more familiar with it.

    Really like 'em both; almost as much as I like that line

    ETA: when the weather is cooler, I'll make the G23 the BUG in my 5.11 holster shirt, while the 1911 rides strong side. Like already stated, your BUG doesn't have to be bug-sized
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

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