Defensive Carry Handgun Capacity - Page 2

Defensive Carry Handgun Capacity

This is a discussion on Defensive Carry Handgun Capacity within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I don't prepare at the it's rare so I won't worry about it mindset, because quite frankly if I knew when a rare situation would ...

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Thread: Defensive Carry Handgun Capacity

  1. #16
    Senior Member Array canav844's Avatar
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    I don't prepare at the it's rare so I won't worry about it mindset, because quite frankly if I knew when a rare situation would occur I'd only carry on days I knew I was going to be attacked.

    I carry a Glock 27 with the standard 9 round mag +1, that should be plenty for almost any situation I encounter, but malfunctions are also frequently caused by mags, so there's also 2 G23 13 round mags handy, that's 36 rounds of .40S&W ready to go. Certainly hope I never need to use 1 but it's better to have it and not need it and 2 backups for mags are there in case of any malfunctions.

    The end number isn't the part that is important it's the preparedness for the unknown.

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  2. #17
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    Pogo, I think you're fine in your reasoning. Some on here wouldn't feel overloaded with a 20 mule team of ammo boxes backing them up. 7-8 round 1911s have been a mainstay for years, with or without spare mags.

    I carry to get me out of a jam, not to keep me in the battle. If I expect to get into a prolonged gunfight, I'm certainly packing more than any puny pistol, regardless of capacity.

    On an interesting sidenote, the latest American Handgunner has an Ayoob article about a fellow shooting an attacker 8 times with a 9mm. Then, to avoid the "9mm ain't enough" battle, Ayoob explains that the fellow fired the shots as fast as he could because the attacker was still standing--9 shots before the "corpse" had time to collapse. 8 out of 9 shots on target--that's pretty good SD shooting with any caliber or handgun. Very interesting read.
    Retired USAF E-8. Lighten up and enjoy life because:
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  3. #18
    Ex Member Array EB31's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragman View Post
    Two guns with two magazines each for me please! and if I make it to my truck I will have at least a third wepon!

    I will never be killed for lack of shooting back.
    Agreed.

    While I first depend on my SA, gut instincts and ability to get out of a sticky situation...if it were to come down to it? I have my Glock 19 with 2 extra magazines (15 rd) for a total of 45 rounds of ammo.

    I hope to never have to use my gun against anyone. Do I feel that I carry MORE than enough ammo? But I certainly dont feel I would come up short. Same as money, food, water, love...I'd rather have too much then not enough.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    I think that capacity is something that people who do not shoot well worry about more than those who are confident. Plus, it's one of those "what if" things we like to play with in our minds, kinda of like the, " if you could only have one gun...." for the average Joe or Jane, who is not an accomplished shot, then there will never be enough ammo or bugs carried. From my point of view, if you can't resolve it in a couple of shots, then it's time to get away, or take the k-bar, ballbat, or tire iron and get busy, providing retreat is not an option. People have not become superhuman in the last 30 years or so when a 38 was considered good medicine, and I'd say it still is.
    You honestly think that people who carry higher capacity pistols do so because they can not shoot well? I totally disagree with that. I think people who carry higher capacity guns, bug, knives, etc...do it because they feel there is a chance they might need it. I mean sometimes more than 1 person decides to mug/attack civilians and you can not always get away.

  5. #20
    VIP Member Array Old School's Avatar
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    Cool

    I carry a G-23 off duty with a Diamondback .380 BUG. I have no reloads for either. I am of the Jim Cirello school of a second or third or forth gun is faster than trying to reload the first gun. Ayoob called that a New York reload. I feel comfortable with this set up.

    On duty I carry the departmental G21SF with two extra mags and the Diamondback with no reload. A Remington 870 is in the rack in the cruiser and hopefully the cavalary is on the way when needed.
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

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  6. #21
    Distinguished Member Array LanceORYGUN's Avatar
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    I've always carried 1911's but lately it's a Glock 17 or M&P
    The full size S&W M&P is surprisingly comfortable to carry concealed. Much better than a Glock or Springfield XD series, in my opinion.

  7. #22
    Distinguished Member Array LanceORYGUN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD View Post
    Officer Down: A Warrior's Sacrifice
    Resistance to Gunfire
    Mettinger absorbed nine rounds from Borders' .45—six of which hit him in the torso and two more of which literally severed his right foot—without any significant effect on his fighting ability. This would have been remarkable even if Officer Borders had been firing marginally effective rounds, but he was using .45 caliber Gold Dot ammunition, which is considered by many to be the best man-stopper on the market.

    Officer Down: The Peter Soulis Incident

    The Aftermath
    Remarkably, Palmer had taken 22 hits from Soulis' .40-caliber Glock, 17 of which had hit center mass. Despite the fact that the weapon had been loaded with Ranger SXTs considered by many to be one of the best man-stoppers available Palmer lived for more than four minutes after the last shot was fired. His autopsy revealed nothing more than a small amount of alcohol in his bloodstream. Although Soulis could not have known it, Palmer was wanted for murder in a neighboring state.
    Harlem man survives being shot 21 times by NYPD

    More than 50 bullets were fired, almost all of them by the police. At least 21 of those bullets pierced Alvarez's body.
    Luckily for Alvarez — whose criminal record includes at least eight prior arrests — none of the bullets hit his brain, heart or major arteries. His family members say that even though his arms, legs and torso were riddled with ammunition, Alvarez is "doing all right" and talking. It's believed he'll survive. A forensics expert told the New York Daily News' Simone Weichselbaum and Virginia Breen that Alvarez is probably the new holder of a somewhat dubious record.

    "I would say more than 20 gunshot wounds is a record," Dr. Vincent DiMaio, a forensic pathologist who specializes in gunshot wounds, told the paper. "Of course, the real issue is where you get shot. One bullet can kill you, but believe it or not, a body can survive a lot of bullet wounds."

    My XDM-9 with 19+1 is looking like a pretty darn good option.

    Too big?

    I'll let you all be the judge of that:



    N
    That is the most Rambo like post that I have seen posted anywhere in a long time.

    You also fail to mention how very heavy a fully loaded XDm is. Many folks don't want to carry such a heavy gun concealed, even if they can cope with the size.

  8. #23
    Distinguished Member Array LanceORYGUN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    Your research is the same as mine - the defensive shooter just needs to get away from trouble, not engage in a sustained shoot-out. Police have to stay on the scene and resolve the problem. So reports of bad guys taking lots of hits don't necessarily reflect what you or I might have to deal with. Most real-life shootings tend to be resolved simply by showing or, even more rarely, firing the handgun once or twice.
    This is probably the most sensible post on this subject that I have ever seen on any forum.

    I really don't have anything to add to your astute analysis here.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by LanceORYGUN View Post
    That is the most Rambo like post that I have seen posted anywhere in a long time.
    Rambo-like? That is an odd description for a post describing 3 incidents where multiple hits were needed to down an aggressor. Not sure where you got Rambo-like from it at all. It may not relate to most civilian or police shootings but it does show that it happens and to downplay it as a possibility may be unwise.
    People, carry what you like but implying that someone that carries a larger capacity handgun does so to play out a Rambo fantasy or to make up for a lack skill is just plain foolish. I'll refrain from calling you undedicated and unprepared, even if I think it so.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaxE View Post
    You honestly think that people who carry higher capacity pistols do so because they can not shoot well? I totally disagree with that. I think people who carry higher capacity guns, bug, knives, etc...do it because they feel there is a chance they might need it. I mean sometimes more than 1 person decides to mug/attack civilians and you can not always get away.
    In short , yes. I do not think that most of the people carrying now know what it was like back when if you carried, it was a six shooter, and you felt comfortable with that. I think most of the people carrying today are jumping on the ccw band wagon, and only have knowledge of hi cap semi autos. I am not saying this is a bad thing, just a personal observation. If you are not in a high risk job, I think you are well served by a powerful revolver cartridge.

    Yes, it is a given people are carrying because of a percieved need to. Nothin wrong with that either. But if you could put a cylinder full of hot 38s in the face of an attacker at 10 yards in a couple of seconds, I'd say you are all right with a j frame. If you struggle to keep 15 rounds on a paper plate at 20 yards, which I see ALOT of people do, I say good luck.

  11. #26
    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    I feel perfectly comfortable with my 10+1 in my glock 26. I do not (generally) carry a reload. However 10 rounds is a kind of my cut off. I have been considering a Glock 36 lately and since it is only 6+1 I would most likely carry a spare mag. I can't believe I am getting ready to say this but I almost kind of miss my Taurus pt145. 10+1 of .45 was a pretty sweet package and that gun really was tiny for what you got.
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

  12. #27
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    I'm of the same mindset as you, Pogo. I do find myself often carrying a j frame airweight in my weakside pocket regardless of what is on my strong side (which often consists of a SP101, 709, Bersa Thunder 9, XD40sc, or a full size 1911 in .45ACP). I think of that more in terms of a secondary access weapon (if your strong side hand/arm becomres incapacitated).
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  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by LanceORYGUN View Post
    That is the most Rambo like post that I have seen posted anywhere in a long time.

    You also fail to mention how very heavy a fully loaded XDm is. Many folks don't want to carry such a heavy gun concealed, even if they can cope with the size.
    A FULLY loaded XDM is still less than an UNLOADED 1911. MANY people carry a full size 1911 or Commander with no issues.

    As for the M&P, it carries very well and I just really enjoy the gun. I put 10-8 sights on my 17 and it made it a little harder to carry due to the corners on the sight and it catching on clothes. I put one on one of my M&Ps and it's much shorter (.215 vs .160), but still can catch a little. My Warren Tactical on another is contoured and carries much better. I might send the 10-8 off for a single tritium dot and some extra dehorning maybe a cross between the original Warren style and the 10-8. it's sharp edges make it easy to shoot accurately but the 140 U notch is still fast, though the Warren is still faster. I really do love the M&P. I also added 10-8 basepads and dremeled the frames, especially where the front strap meets the trigger guard and took the lip off of the bottom so it looks much better with the 10-8 basepads and Compact basepads. The standard pads are way too long.


    Quote Originally Posted by shockwave View Post
    Your research is the same as mine - the defensive shooter just needs to get away from trouble, not engage in a sustained shoot-out.
    Man, I wish someone would have told me this when I was carjacked/kidnapped! For those that have not been in a shooting/defensive situation, it's not always an option to fire a round then run away, sometimes we're committed to ENDING the fight, not just distracting it and getting away.

    Only one shot was fired, but the fight was long from over.

    In my previous post I gave three examples of people needing a reload (one or two not having one) and had NO OPTION but to stay in the fight.


    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    I think that capacity is something that people who do not shoot well worry about more than those who are confident.
    GLOCKMAN!!! If that's the case, I suppose you're carrying a PS90 right now?

    I was completely comfortable with my 1911 and a mag or two, but like I said in a previous post, there have been groups of three or four running around strong-arming and invading homes. That was enough for me to up my capacity. Plus, like I say all the time, I train to shoot to the ground, not one or two, so I may expend 5 or 6 rounds on one scumbag. I'd rather not need to show off my reload skills during a fight....though it would be quite impressive!
    Proven combat techniques may not be flashy and may require a bit more physical effort on the part of the shooter. Further, they may not win competition matches, but they will help ensure your survival in a shooting or gunfight on the street. ~Paul Howe

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
    I feel perfectly comfortable with my 10+1 in my glock 26. I do not (generally) carry a reload. However 10 rounds is a kind of my cut off. I have been considering a Glock 36 lately and since it is only 6+1 I would most likely carry a spare mag. I can't believe I am getting ready to say this but I almost kind of miss my Taurus pt145. 10+1 of .45 was a pretty sweet package and that gun really was tiny for what you got.
    My buddy wants a Taurus 24/7 compact .45. We saw one in our local GS and I must admit it is one sweet weapon. I've never read anything negative about the .45 24/7.
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  15. #30
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    I agree that if you ever use your firearm a few bullets will probably be enough.But what about the "what if" extreme situations? I would rather have the extra bullets and not need them than the other way around. I carry 12+1 and sometimes an extra clip.
    When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.
    The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
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