Kel-Tec 9mm - Page 2

Kel-Tec 9mm

This is a discussion on Kel-Tec 9mm within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I carry my P11 daily in warm weather with the belt clip, easy to conceal. Yes I agree a long trigger pull that takes a ...

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Thread: Kel-Tec 9mm

  1. #16
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    Array BigDave's Avatar
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    I carry my P11 daily in warm weather with the belt clip, easy to conceal.
    Yes I agree a long trigger pull that takes a little getting use to.
    It is pretty accurate and recommend for close range.
    Note when using the belt clip with a t-shirt tucked in you need to push the handle below the belt line to conceal, so a fast draw is not possible.
    My P11 has been real reliable and will be keeping it for sometime yet.
    When the weather is a little cooler then my XDSC .40 is the ticket for me with a light shirt over it.


  2. #17
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    The p11 is a love it or hate it issue , I dont know which i am since i dont own one lol . The new pf9 single stack will appairently mirror the p11 for height and width but be thinner since single stack . ( again dont know cause it aint out yet lol ) . The exciting news IMHO for the pf9 is that it uses the p3at/p32 fire control . You loose second strike capibility but pick up from what i understand a much better trigger pull and weight .

    Myself i went Kahr and have no regrets on that tho my cheap little p3at is not for sale or trade .
    Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
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  3. #18
    Member Array mstarn's Avatar
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    LOOOONG Trigger

    I went to the local gun shop to buy a P11 from all the good things I heard about it. Came home with a Kahr CW-9. The trigger was just too loooong for me. Love the CW-9. Nice trigger compared to the P11.

    Never heard any thing bad about the P11 except for the trigger. Good luck on your decision.

    Mark

  4. #19
    Member Array yellowv's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squawker
    Well, looks like it's up to me to spoil the party. I bought a P11 last year, when I realized that with the Vegas summers, I would need a pocket pistol. It is the biggest piece of trash (I would prefer to use another adjective, but I am substituting trash for decorum) that I have ever bought. It sits in my safe, and will probably never come out. Why do I hate this gun? well, let's begin:
    1) The trigger pull is way too long. More than that, it's hard. Firing just 1 or 2 mags, rubs a blister on my finger. I had to wear Band-Aids on my index fingers just to be able to qualify with it for my CCW.
    2) Reliability is poor. The first magazine, I had multiple failures to feed, failures to extract, stove piping, etc (FMJ ammo, not hollow points). My first range session, the gun jammed so badly that I had to have a gunsmith clear it.
    3) Breakdown and reassembly is more difficult than it should be. I took mine apart to clean it, and I couldn't get the spring to compress enough for the reassembly. Embarrassed, I took it back to the gun shop for help. The owner, who carries a P11, had trouble with the reassembly.

    Now, I had a "fluff and buff" done by the gunsmith when he cleared the jam. It did improve feeding. And, I could send it back to Kel-tec to have a better trigger installed. But quite frankly, if I need to do all that, I would rather just buy a better gun. Products should perform their basic function straight from the box. If I buy a TV, it may require some minor adjustment. But I should see a picture and hear sound. If it doesn't do that. it goes back. I shouldn't have to waste a C note on ammo just to have it perform correctly. I may have to experiment with different brands of hollow points to see what works best in the gun. But if it won't feed ball ammo, it doesn't do it's basic job. Regardless of the amount of improvement, I will never feel that I can trust my life to this gun. So, it will sit in my safe until either I can get close to what I paid for it back, or the if "the digestive waste product strikes the rotating oscillator", I can use it as a trade gun.
    Sounds like you got a bad one. The one I had was totally reliable and easy to disassemble and reassemble. True the trigger sucks and you will get blisters shooting it but look what it is. It's a tiny under $300 carry weapon that holds 11rds of 9mm. What do you expect it to shoot like? If you sent it back Kel-Tec would have made it right. Hell I sent my Kimber back 4 times for them to get it right and it was nearly a grand.

  5. #20
    Distinguished Member Array Squawker's Avatar
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    "Sounds like you got a bad one. The one I had was totally reliable and easy to disassemble and reassemble. True the trigger sucks and you will get blisters shooting it but look what it is. It's a tiny under $300 carry weapon that holds 11rds of 9mm. What do you expect it to shoot like? If you sent it back Kel-Tec would have made it right. Hell I sent my Kimber back 4 times for them to get it right and it was nearly a grand."
    What do I expect it to shoot like? A GUN! You, know, pull the trigger, there's a loud noise, and a metal object comes out of the front. Had it done that each time that I pulled the trigger, then I would overlook all of the other short comings. I didn't buy it to target shoot- I would limit that to enough to stay proficient with the gun. Long trigger pull, blisters, etc would not matter if I was using it to save my life. Unfortunately, it would not fire reliably at the range. I will not trust my life to that gun. Yes, it's a $300 gun. But I didn't buy it because it was cheap. I could and would have spent more. I felt that I needed a thinner pocket gun that my Glock 26. It was the glowing reviews, such as many in this thread, that caused me to buy it, not the price. If I had any idea of the problems that I was about to face, I would have bought the Kahr. A reliable weapon at $300 is a good value. My gun, at $50, would not be. As far as sending it back to Kel-Tec, well, I just don't think that when I spend $300 for a new anything, that I should have to send it back to the factory to get it to perform it's basic function. I'm not talking about the trigger pull, or the blisters, or any of the other defects. I could send it back for those, and not be upset. But I shouldn't have to send it back to the factory just to make it go BOOM each time the trigger is pulled. I'm honestly very happy that yours has performed so well, and I truly hope that everyone else's will do the same. Funny thing is though, that when I've made a post lie this following numerous glowing reviews of the P11, I've gotten several more following mine simply saying that they had the same problem. Funny, on top of that. I've found that even though it's thick, the Glock 26 has done quite well as a pocket pistol.

  6. #21
    VIP Member Array frankmako's Avatar
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    picked up a p11 several years ago. the gun goes bang each and every time. there is a trigger fix on the kel tec web site. it makes the pull shorter. great gun for the price. now kel tec is coming out with a smaller 9mm this summer. it will be smaller than the p11 and some what bigger than the p3at. i am going to get one to play around with. i got the p11 for the same reason, range play gun. fun to shoot, but a gun i would carry if i had to. the only kel tec gun that i had had problems with is with my p3at. took several months to get it to work, it is at 98% now. i carry it when i am on the motorcycle along with two mags.

  7. #22
    Member Array yellowv's Avatar
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    Like I said anything could have problems. With Kel-Tec they seem to be few and far between and they would have made it right if given the chance. Should a new gun not work? Of course not but nothing is perfect. From Ferraris to Kias your gonna get one with problems every now and then. Like I said my $900+ Kimber had to go back to Kimber four times and finally needed to be replaced. That took 4 months. I can complain about that. You shouldn't complain if your not willing to let them fix it. They would do right by you. As for your comment that you wanted it to shoot like a gun your contradicting yourself. You clearly expected some great shooting piece. Most of us on this thread have all had experience with P11 and have had nothing but reliabilty, but we obviously have no qualms about telling about the LOOOOOONG crappy trigger and the fact that the gun is no joy to shoot. They do go bang though and yours is one of the only ones I have heard of with reliability problems I have heard of. Do you think Kahr has never sent out a lemon?

  8. #23
    Senior Member Array tex45acp's Avatar
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    My experience with my P-11 has been really positive. I have yet to do anything to the gun, other than shoot and clean it. It does have a long trigger, but I am an old revolver hand and it is not any worse that most revolver pulls for double action shooting. It's accurate but with the 147gr HydraShoks it kicks like a mule and after about 50 rounds will wear a raw spot in the web of my hand. I have over 4000 rounds through it and have had only one malfunction. Great little gun for the money.
    The only thing needed for evil to exist is for good men to stand by and do nothing!!!

  9. #24
    Member Array cgraham's Avatar
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    Whether you will like the P11 depends on your expectations.

    When I chose a pocket pistol, my critera were:
    Semiauto
    9mm
    As small as possible
    Maximal magazine capacity (I didn't want to carry an extra mag, or possibly do an tactical reload.) The advantage of a semiauto is that it can exceed the capacity of a revolver.
    Reliable
    Affordable.

    The P11 best met these critera (capacity with the new mags, 12+1)

    I knew the trigger was difficult, but I was determined to overcome that difficulty. I knew that some copies need 300-500 rounds through them before smoothing out, and that FTF problems sometimes occur early on; in the last year or two, the factory is said to have greatly reduced these problems. I had no problems after a couple of mags.

    I never did overcome the trigger problem, in spite of practice (limited by being only able to shoot about 50 rounds in a session). I found it difficult to impossible to squeeze off a shot quickly, while maintaining a sight picture. The first shot of a session always surprised me with its difficulty. There is no way I could fire rapidly with this gun. I had difficulty keeping 10 shots on a 9" plate at 21 ft., shooting deliberately. Shoot the P11 before buying.

    The Glock 26 was a world of difference. In spite of the slightly lager size, chunkyness and greater weight (6 oz), I could conceal it, shoot reasonably well and rapidly with it and I so felt quite confident with it. It made me realize that I would NOT be confident with the P11, especially under stress.

    I think the P11 is only suitable for a very close encounter, and for a person with strong fingers at that.

    One day I'll attempt to transform it with the trigger mods. I'd be very happy if I could significantly improve it: it has the makings of a perfect 9mm carry weapon. In the meantime, I am profoundly disappointed that this otherwise well-designed weapon has such a weakness in the trigger assembly. I know DAO's are supposed to be difficult, but not this difficult.

    The other high quality guns are the Kahrs. At 6 or 7+1 they don't meet my capacity requirement, and would necessitate carrying a spare mag. The big advantage of Kahr is they are single-stack, and thus slim, and reliable (from what I have read - I have not owned one). If you don't like the weight of the Glock, they are the next best choice, IMO.

    I dismissed the other 9mm pocket pistols for one reason or another.

    Good luck in your choice.

    Edited to add: I have since called Kel-Tec, and explained the problems I was having with the trigger - I was asked to send it in to make some alterations and adjustments to make it a better physical fit for my hand, and to lighten the trigger pull.

    This is an interesting thread I started, looking for help: http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaB...num=1153694230

    One of the best pieces of wisdom from it:
    " I think the problem some have shooting the P-11 is that the trigger breaks too far to the rear for them. The P-11 trigger pull is not that heavy, but it is long, and the break point is beyond the normal hand geometry of some people. The finger placement they must use to initiate the firing stroke is not appropriate to complete the trigger pull without throwing the pistol off target. The http://1bad69.com site has just about everything you can do to a P-11 trigger."

    It was on this same thread I was encouraged to call Kel-Tec. My hopes are now increased that the weapon will be improved sufficiently for dependable use. I will post further info on the cited forum, when I get the gun back rom service.
    C
    Last edited by cgraham; July 29th, 2006 at 01:17 AM.

  10. #25
    New Member Array outlaw_6's Avatar
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    Ok, my $.02. I am a LEO (10 years exp.) and have carried many different guns off duty. I have to say my favorite of them all is my current carry gun, the P-11. I have the optional 12 rnd mag with "finger rest" floor plate and a Hogue "Hand-all" grip. I carry it in a Fobus paddle holster. This combination is the best I've used yet.

    A lot of things have to be considered like ammo capacity, weight, concealability, comfort, sights, accuracy, grip and so on. Of course, no gun will be perfect and all are a compromise in some way or another.

    To me, I've found no better combination and I've tried many.
    Rob

    \"Lead, follow or get out of the way.\"

    Life Member, Veterans of Foreign Wars

  11. #26
    VIP Member Array SammyIamToday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msgt/ret View Post
    It is a good small and light carry piece but due to problems with my right hand I just could not master that looooong heavy trigger. Did get a nice deal when I traded it for a Firestar 9MM though. If you go to www.KTOG.org their tech section has some suggestions for improving trigger pull.

    Thanks for that link. I have one by virtue of the old lady liking it when we bought it and not liking it when we shot it. So, I'm trying to adapt it for some use (although not sure what cause it's just a bit too big to pocket carry).

  12. #27
    Senior Member Array hsuCowboy98's Avatar
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    Heres my complete range report with pics:

    http://www.combatcarry.com/vbulletin...t=kel-tec+p-11
    Fear No Evil.

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