380 Gone, Caliber Changes for 2011?

This is a discussion on 380 Gone, Caliber Changes for 2011? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 10thmtn I've fondled one at a gun store. Personally, I'd rather get the LCP and add the CT Laserguard - you can ...

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Thread: 380 Gone, Caliber Changes for 2011?

  1. #61
    Senior Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post
    I've fondled one at a gun store. Personally, I'd rather get the LCP and add the CT Laserguard - you can now even get it from Ruger pre-mounted. I just prefer the instinctive activation of the CT lasers - just grip the gun normally, and the laser comes on. I also didn't care for the S&W's thumb safety - I just don't like thumb safeties, in general.

    And it's ok - there's nothing "yuuuk" about a pistol that can always be on you. My LCP only goes in the safe when I'm showering or sleeping.
    LOL - the yuuuk was the thought of the 'taste' of any gun

    So you're vulnerable in the shower? I'm making a note.
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  3. #62
    VIP Member Array 10thmtn's Avatar
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    I love the taste of gunpowder and Hoppes in the morning...tastes like...victory...

    The more good folks carry guns, the fewer shots the crazies can get off.
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  4. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichSteve View Post
    Bob, I just listen to episode 102 and I must say that caliber again did not matter as much as training. Bullet placement did not end the fight right away even though it was a 40 caliber S&W, wow three shots at center mass and the gun man still fires 11 rounds and shoot himself.

    Another good point is the gunman did bring a high capacity 9mm and plenty of ammo, the security guard and retired officer went to retrieve more ammo and a vest, just saying when you know you are going to a gunfight you don't bring a 380. The police showed up with rifles to the gunfight. Great interview.
    You're right training won the day in the end. Not caliber.
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  5. #64
    Member Array Fozzy Bear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichSteve View Post
    Hi Fozzy Bear, you seem to have experience with 1911's, I was wondering what you would recommend in a 4" 45acp under $900?
    I'm sorry for not responding sooner; I was out for Holiday and am just now getting my inbox hammered flat again...
    Since it would be hyjacking this thread, I'll reply via IM, unless the original poster of this thread request my to put it here too.
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  6. #65
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    I'm not sure I understand the comments about people not being able to conceal "larger" pistols. I can conceal a full size glock and XD in the middle of summer in shorts and a tee shirt with a IWB holster. If you can't you need to lose some weight or buy bigger clothes, or something! Bottom line is that if you knew for sure you were going to need your weapon to protect yourself or loved one today you would leave the 380 at home and take your "larger" pistol. And this is the mind set everyone needs to have that carries a weapon for self defense. On the flip side of what some people are saying, I would hate to know that people got killed because I could have stopped a bad guy and didn't because I didn't have enough firepower.
    Last edited by Raiders; January 8th, 2011 at 08:21 AM. Reason: missed a word

  7. #66
    Member Array ken45's Avatar
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    Bottom line is that if you knew for sure you were going to need your weapon to protect yourself or loved one today you would leave the 380 at home and take your "larger" pistol.
    Ummm....no. If I knew that, I would stay home. I'm not Wyatt Earp looking for the OK Corral.

    I don't have much faith in a .380 (or a 9), but they will work in probably over 90% of the cases where a gun is needed for self defense since most of the time no shots are fired (Kleck, et al).

  8. #67
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    Caliber wars ad nauseum. Carry what you're comfortable and accurate with and don't worry about what others carry or think. Personal decision.
    Glock 22, Glock 23, Glock 32, S&W SD9VE, Kahr CM9, Del Ton Echo 316 AR15.

  9. #68
    VIP Member Array 10thmtn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders View Post
    I'm not sure I understand the comments about people not being able to conceal "larger" pistols. I can conceal a full size glock and XD in the middle of summer in shorts and a tee shirt with a IWB holster. If you can't you need to lose some weight or buy bigger clothes, or something! Bottom line is that if you knew for sure you were going to need your weapon to protect yourself or loved one today you would leave the 380 at home and take your "larger" pistol. And this is the mind set everyone needs to have that carries a weapon for self defense. On the flip side of what some people are saying, I would hate to know that people got killed because I could have stopped a bad guy and didn't because I didn't have enough firepower.
    I see you live in Texas - good for you. Not everyone lives/works in such a gun-friendly area. For me, someone even bumping into me and realizing I'm carrying a gun could have devastating professional and/or personal consequences. It's all a balance - the probability of needing it versus the possibility of being discovered.

    And to echo what was said above, if I knew I was going to need a gun, I would do my best not to be there...if that was impossible, I would bring a long gun, and friends with long guns.

    Some folks here grossly over estimate the fight-stopping ability of any weapon that can be fired with one hand - i.e. - the handgun. Absent a hit to very specific areas of a human's body (the brain and/or upper spinal column) no handgun is going to cause an attacker's body to instantly shut down due to physical damage.
    The more good folks carry guns, the fewer shots the crazies can get off.
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  10. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post
    I respectfully disagree. Add a CT laser, and the finger extension - both help the "shootability" of the LCP. I've posted pics on this forum before, where I shot several mags worth of shots into one ragged hole at 7 yards at a rapid fire rate. If you know how to shoot, the small .380 pistols are no issue. The key is good basics - especially a smooth steady trigger pull.

    Frankly, I'm tired of people blaming the gun for their poor technique (not you personally, but in general)...just like I'm tired of people complaining about the "thick" Glock grip which my petite wife (with small hands) can manage just fine...but that's another topic...


    ^^^^^I'm not trying to pick a fight,but^^^^^^^^^


    This is taking into consideration, the Perpetrator(s) you are up against are willing to stand there in the breeze, while you produce your firearm, Take your proper stance and commence firing.

    OTOH, if they are not willing participants in your demonstration on how to shoot rapid fire at a statue still object,(eg),
    1) they are shooting back at you
    2) they are already engaging you in a struggle for the weapon
    3)there are more than you can count on one hand attacking you
    4)its dark and you are NOT afforded the perfect shot,

    You may want to consider something more substantial, which would impress upon them your determination to live



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  11. #70
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    Not a .380 fan but there is more to a CC gun/pistol than caliber. For me it’s also handling, safety and reliability. I continue to favor my S&W 640 loaded with Buffalo Bore 158. If five-rounds of that isn’t enough for the initial engagement, then it was fun while it lasted.
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  12. #71
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    Quote from Saber: "Not a .380 fan but there is more to a CC gun/pistol than caliber. For me it’s also handling, safety and reliability. I continue to favor my S&W 640 loaded with Buffo Bore 158. "If five-rounds of that isn’t enough for the initial engagement, then it was fun while it lasted."

    I like what he said. I think too many of us over think this, are over the top and slip into an LEO mentality. Chances are it's your awarenes and initial reaction time that'll make more of a difference then what caliber or type of gun you have in your pocket. And there is something to be said about just being able to produce the gun that will statistically keep you safe in a number of circumstances. Of course we all know not to rely on that 100% or we could carry empty guns but you know what I mean.

    I've learned you never really convince anyone on the net of anything but you can influence a few from time to time.

    Enjoy your day and God Bless!
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  13. #72
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    Agree with what both Gideon and Saber said.

    Most criminals are looking for easy targets.

    If you are confronted with a dozen gun toting thugs bent on killing you, even a high cap 45 isn't going to keep you alive. But how often does that actually happen in the U.S. unless you are into the big time drug leagues? (And even then?)

  14. #73
    VIP Member Array 10thmtn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oneshot View Post
    ^^^^^I'm not trying to pick a fight,but^^^^^^^^^


    This is taking into consideration, the Perpetrator(s) you are up against are willing to stand there in the breeze, while you produce your firearm, Take your proper stance and commence firing.

    OTOH, if they are not willing participants in your demonstration on how to shoot rapid fire at a statue still object,(eg),
    1) they are shooting back at you
    2) they are already engaging you in a struggle for the weapon
    3)there are more than you can count on one hand attacking you
    4)its dark and you are NOT afforded the perfect shot,

    You may want to consider something more substantial, which would impress upon them your determination to live
    No worries - my normal carry is a Glock 26, plus a spare mag for it. I have carried a LCP as a primary at times (sometimes even two of them) but not often.

    Point I was trying to make is that the small .380 pistols are plenty "shootable" if you have the basic fundamentals of shooting down.

    I also find it mildly amusing when folks on these forums claim the .380 is too weak, while at the same time complaining about the "terrible recoil" of the small .380 pistols. Uh...so which is it?
    The more good folks carry guns, the fewer shots the crazies can get off.
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  15. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raiders View Post
    I'm not sure I understand the comments about people not being able to conceal "larger" pistols. I can conceal a full size glock and XD in the middle of summer in shorts and a tee shirt with a IWB holster. If you can't you need to lose some weight or buy bigger clothes, or something! Bottom line is that if you knew for sure you were going to need your weapon to protect yourself or loved one today you would leave the 380 at home and take your "larger" pistol. And this is the mind set everyone needs to have that carries a weapon for self defense. On the flip side of what some people are saying, I would hate to know that people got killed because I could have stopped a bad guy and didn't because I didn't have enough firepower.
    I don't think I agree. First, I do not like IWB - I do not find it comfortable and I think I've tried every holster out there except some custom made ones. I have 11 45's from a PM45 to a SIG P220 and FS 1911, and a LCP I got for Christmas. Right now, when I am always wearing a jacket, it's no problem - I can carry any of the 45's on my belt. Today it's an compact HK 45.

    However, here in Atlanta, March through October present a challenge. The PM45 is marginally pocketable except in jeans, and is a great pistol, but I have a feeling that come spring, I will be using the LCP with proper ammo a lot.

  16. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post

    I also find it mildly amusing when folks on these forums claim the .380 is too weak, while at the same time complaining about the "terrible recoil" of the small .380 pistols. Uh...so which is it?
    Well, there is an appropriate weight for every caliber. Too light of a gun for the caliber, and the recoil is stiff. A heavy gun for the caliber and shooting is easy. A .44 mag in a Super Redhawk is easy. But people buy super lightweight .380s and the recoil is more than they expect. Of course grips are a part of the equation and often the small, lightweight .380s don't have comfortable grips. Also, a short barrel length gives more flip, and guess what? People want really small .380s.

    I certainly do not think my Sig P230 has too much recoil, but then people criticize it for being overly large for a .380 !

    Ken

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