Kahr P380, Ruger LCP, KEl-Tec 3AT, Sig P238 or S&W Body Guard Which would you pick? - Page 3

Kahr P380, Ruger LCP, KEl-Tec 3AT, Sig P238 or S&W Body Guard Which would you pick?

This is a discussion on Kahr P380, Ruger LCP, KEl-Tec 3AT, Sig P238 or S&W Body Guard Which would you pick? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by MichSteve Yes it is a 642, I like it very much but don't pocket carry much, it has the clip draw on ...

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Thread: Kahr P380, Ruger LCP, KEl-Tec 3AT, Sig P238 or S&W Body Guard Which would you pick?

  1. #31
    Member Array joepa150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichSteve View Post
    Yes it is a 642, I like it very much but don't pocket carry much, it has the clip draw on it and I carry it AIWB.
    I see the clip now


  2. #32
    Member Array wormtown's Avatar
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    My P3AT was one of the first guns I bought. It was cheap, it goes anywhere. I've never had a failure that wasn't ammo related.
    It is a little ugly, and has a bit of snap, but it shoots well enough.
    I have other more powerful options now, but every now and then, it has it's role.
    You should not have any special fondness for a particular weapon, or anything else, for that matter
    Miyamoto Musashi, The Book of Five Rings

  3. #33
    Member Array rogerdodger's Avatar
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    I have both the LCP and the Kahr p380. The LCP had issues but Ruger made it right, now I carry it. P380 is still in breakin, but has more features like slide lock on last round, +p ammo. LCP does not.
    Roger

  4. #34
    Senior Member Array Gaius's Avatar
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    I'm old school. I have a Walther PPK/S that is 30 years old. Fires flawlessly, breaks down in seconds, quite concealable, and contrary to some opinions on the forum, the slight additional weight makes it far more shootable/contrallable/accurate than some others I have fired. As I say in my Wyatt Earp quote below, "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything." This thing is damn accurate.
    Best way to win a gun fight? "That's easy, don't show up."
    --Wyatt Earp

    "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything."
    -- Wyatt Earp

  5. #35
    Senior Member Array Gaius's Avatar
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    A quick follow up to my last post. In the 2011 edition of pocket Pistols, there is an article on the 380 by Richard Mann. A couple of quotes.

    "Over the last few years we have seen a variety of new .380 handguns introduced. Most are very lightweight, like the Diamondback at 8.8 ounces and the Ruger LCP at 9.4 ounces. This extreme lightweight makes these super compact handguns easy to carry but it also intensifies recoil... A 10-ounce 380 ACP will recoil with almost the same force as a full size 1911 in .45 ACP. Most extremely compact lightweight .380 ACP pistols are simply not comfortable to shoot."

    "And, understandably, shooting comfort might not be that important in a life-or-death encounter....But you have to be able to shoot the gun enough to practice so that you can be proficient in case you need to defend yourself. If your gun is uncomfortable to shoot you will very likely not shoot it."

    When I have talked with those who use an extremely light weight 380, they admit they rarely, if ever, actually practice using it. Could be for a lot of reasons, but I suspect that the uncomfortableness of the gun, and thus, for many, the inaccuracy of the gun lead to a bad range day experience and thus a reluctance to regularly practice with the gun that they are betting their life on. So everything is a trade off. The super lightweight and ultra concealable pistol has it s place, but consider what you are giving up if "that other choice" is only a couple of ounces heavier, or a couple of millimeters larger.

    Anyway, just some thoughts.
    Best way to win a gun fight? "That's easy, don't show up."
    --Wyatt Earp

    "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything."
    -- Wyatt Earp

  6. #36
    Member Array Sailor man's Avatar
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    I carry ruger Lcp with crimson trace but if you like the feel of all steel my favorite is my mpa .380 all steel and the exact size of a seecamp but much better because it will handle all .380 ammo I have put through it LCP sits home now

  7. #37
    Senior Member Array NCSoxFan's Avatar
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    You can't go wrong with the LCP. Great BUG at a great price. Put that money you'll save by buying the Ruger towards a stronger primary piece.

  8. #38
    Member Array CharlieW's Avatar
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    I picked the Taurus 738 TCP, because it fit me better. Turns out to be surprisingly accurate, reliable, and softer to shoot than the P3AT I had previously.

  9. #39
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    I looked at them all today... side by side. I didn't fire any of them...

    The Kel Tec, Ruger, and Taurus, are all okay.

    The Kahr and the S&W stand apart from the crowd.

    The Kahr has the sweetest trigger of the lot, the Smith is a very close #2, the Taurus #3, Ruger #4, and Kel Tec last.

    Do I need a sweet trigger in a pocket lint collector? Nope. At least not @ $550.00. But it sure is nice.

    Smith's Got a Laser built in, Standard! Do I need that in a "wet work," close up, better than no gun at all .380? Prolly not. But, back to the Smith in a minute.

    Kel Tec, Ruger, Taurus, will do the job, I found all the triggers a bit "gritty," least so the Taurus. All about the same price point with the Taurus a bit higher.

    These are all "belly guns," BUGs, or pocket lint catchers... But I will be choosing one for EDC... probably as a primary weapon.

    Of them all, I'd take the Smith... it's got the laser, it's got a safety, LRHO, and slide lock... For about the same price point as the Taurus plus a little, and the trigger is nearly as nice as the Kahr.

    This is my thinking... it's a pocket gun. You're gonna use this when in a face to face confrontation and your life is at stake... maybe it's in a wallet holster or a front pocket holster... You need it right now. So... The trigger isn't that important. The laser isn't either. But it's there in case there are others on the way to aid the first BG you shot...

    The Kel Tec, Ruger, or Taurus will do the same dirty work just as well Gritty trigger or not... But the Smith has just a little more "range" in its capabilities, a sweet trigger, and that laser.

    Now, in a perfect world, I wouldn't take any of them, I'd have the change for a Semmerling... 5 shot .45 pocket gun..
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  10. #40
    VIP Member Array tokerblue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oakchas View Post
    This is my thinking... it's a pocket gun. You're gonna use this when in a face to face confrontation and your life is at stake... maybe it's in a wallet holster or a front pocket holster... You need it right now. So... The trigger isn't that important. The laser isn't either. But it's there in case there are others on the way to aid the first BG you shot...

    The Kel Tec, Ruger, or Taurus will do the same dirty work just as well Gritty trigger or not... But the Smith has just a little more "range" in its capabilities, a sweet trigger, and that laser.
    - Once you practice with any of those guns, you'll get used to the trigger. IMO, the Kahr has the best trigger of the bunch, which makes it very accurate.

    I'm not a fan of the laser on the S&W. I can't see too many situations where you would have a chance to activate it. Not to mention that the first button press turns it on, the second turns on a pulse mode and the third turns it off. Not exactly user friendly in the field. I much prefer the Crimson Trace lasers since the activation is instinctual when you grip the gun. Nothing to search for and nothing to fumble around with.

  11. #41
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Appreciate your thoughts toker... Granted, the laser is a bit "futzy" on the Smith... and yes the sweet trigger on the Kahr would make it a more accuarte range gun. But I suspect we're not shooting the pocket.380's for IDPA championships. The Smith's trigger's only slightly less fantastic than the Kahr, and far better than the rest.

    But the triggers are moot. IME this is a weapon for "wet work." You are most likely to be in a close encounter of the criminal kind when you need one of these pocket rockets.

    So, what I'm saying is that, given equal reliability across the board, any one of these will do the job they are designed for. It all depends on how much you care to spend. Since I'm a bang for the buck kind of guy who owns (GASP!) a C9 and a JCP .45, and likes them for what they are (but they are not my carry weapons), the Smith offers the most bang for the buck.

    That said, the local gun shop owner made an interesting point... He doesn't like the safety on the Smith...
    "Why, you don't have to engage it?"
    "Murphy's law. No you don't have to engage it, but it could somehow become engaged in a pocket holster, and then when you try to go "click," it won't go bang.... Right when you need it most."

    Hmmmmmm.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  12. #42
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    Here is my breakdown:

    The Sig is a top quality gun, but there have been a lot of reports of issues with the gun. I'd have a hard time plunking down that much cash on an iffy gun.

    The Kahr is also a top shelf choice. If you have the money, its the one to play IMO.

    The Ruger is a mid grade, and has made some quality improvements over the P3AT. I have a hard time spending money on a pistol that is such a blatant copy of other companies blood and sweat. But it is hard to deny its value and place among the pocket poodle shooters.

    The KelTec is not exactly a high quality piece, but I love the companies ingenuity and ethics. It is everything a peashooter should be and nothing it should not. Dollar for dollar, its the best value out of the bunch. All the gripes about the gun are easily fixed with some very basic know how.

    The bodyguard, I can only say I wouldn't buy it with my money, and I don't recommend you do with yours. Not yet anyway. I'd give it at least another year and look at it again.
    Last edited by SIXTO; March 30th, 2011 at 05:02 PM.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  13. #43
    VIP Member Array oakchas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Here is my breakdown:
    ...
    The Ruger is a mid grade, and has made some quality improvements over the P3AT. I have a hard time spending money on a pistol that is such a blatant copy of other companies blood and sweat. But it is hard to deny its value and place among the pocket poodle shooters.

    The KelTec is not exactly a high quality piece, but I love the companies ingenuity and ethics. It is everything a peashooter should be and nothing it should not. Dollar for dollar, its the best value out of the bunch. All the gripes about the gun are easily fixed with some very basic know how.

    ...
    I can certainly agree with every word here... and I also hear you about waiting on the Smith.
    Rats!
    It could be worse!
    I suppose

  14. #44
    Member Array joepa150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichSteve View Post
    Yes it is a 642, I like it very much but don't pocket carry much, it has the clip draw on it and I carry it AIWB.
    Any chance you could post a few pics side by side of the 642 and the PM9?

    I am thinking of a PM9 but I wonder how it compares in size with my 642.

  15. #45
    Member Array red13's Avatar
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    I have to say I'm one of the many disappointed and annoyed by Kel Tec... brilliant designs, zero quality control.

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