Taking another Xcountry trip advice?

Taking another Xcountry trip advice?

This is a discussion on Taking another Xcountry trip advice? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; When it get's nice I out I'm planning another cross country camping trip for 3 weeks. Have to use some work vacation before I lose ...

Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Taking another Xcountry trip advice?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array Adkjoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Northern Vermont
    Posts
    765

    Taking another Xcountry trip advice?

    When it get's nice I out I'm planning another cross country camping trip for 3 weeks. Have to use some work vacation before I lose it. Anyway, I can legally carry a firearm in all the states I'm going to that's not my concern.

    Since this will be a 3 week camping trip ranging from Montana, Idaho, Utah, and wherever I else I end up landing I want to bring an appropriate pistol. I'm going to bring my marlin break down .22 rifle for some small game (hunting and fishing permits will be in order) but I can't decide weather to bring the Ruger sp101 .357 mag or the Glock 23 .40 as my CC/woods pistol. I need to be able to conceal it otherwise I would just bring a .44 for camping out west. So I need a healthy balance between power and conceal ability for this trip. Which would you choose? The .357 with some heavy grain ammo or the G23 with more capacity? Both are extremely reliable and I shoot both well. I really don't want to carry more than a small rifle and one pistol especially because I have a Jeep with a softop. So...G23 or Sp101
    Vermont does not issue Permit/Licenses to Carry a Concealed firearm. Vermont allows anyone
    who can legally own a firearm to carry it concealed without a permit of any kind.


  2. #2
    Member Array jwarren's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    TN
    Posts
    341
    Hey young man, you must not be from around here. Cause, if you were, you would know that according to the talking heads in here that the only responsible thing you can do is round up all of your guns, take them to the local LGS and trade them on the mighty Glock 29 in 10mm......then and only then will you be protected from man and beast.

  3. #3
    Member Array WvHiker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    West Virginia
    Posts
    310
    I'd take whichever one I was a better shot with. Your chances of dealing with dangerous animals are pretty low, especially compared to your chances of dealing with dangerous people. A lot of guys will steer you towards the SP101 in case of bear, but if it were me I'd take the Glock, but only because I like them and shoot them well.

  4. #4
    Ex Member Array azchevy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Oceanfront Property
    Posts
    3,850
    I would definitely take the .357 That along with your long gun will be more than adequate.

  5. #5
    Member Array supv26's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    123
    I do this every year except on a motorcycle so taking a long gun is out of the question for me. We camp along the way in campgrounds or where ever we can pitch tents. I am limited to carry what ever I can conceal in an ankle or pocket holster. If I were you I'd take the highest capacity semi auto for a handgun.
    It's not the destination, it's the journey.

  6. #6
    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Southwest
    Posts
    3,150

    G23 for your application

    I like .357 snubbies but on a trip like yours I'd take my old G23. The G23 gives me the powerful .40 caliber round, lots of capacity, absolute reliability, and easy concealment. It gives me a comfortable feeling to have it with me.

    Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the Peoples' Liberty's Teeth." - George Washington

  7. #7
    Senior Member Array Adkjoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Northern Vermont
    Posts
    765
    I can conceal both very well, I'm sort of leaning towards the .357 though since I will be spending most of my time hiking and camping deep in national forests. I haven't made up my mind yet it's a hard decision but I think I would feel more comfortable with some 180 gr .357's over pretty much any grain .40 when it comes to the woods.
    Vermont does not issue Permit/Licenses to Carry a Concealed firearm. Vermont allows anyone
    who can legally own a firearm to carry it concealed without a permit of any kind.

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    9,505
    As much as I like the 357, I would probably take the G23, and load it with some Double Tap hardcast flatnose gas checked bullets or their 180 grain controlled expansion bullet. Both of these loads are 1050-1000 fps, and pack a wallop for both man and beast, ( except grizzly) and you still have the hi capacity and quick reload. All of these combined are a winning combo.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  9. #9
    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Southwest
    Posts
    3,150

    Comment on .40 caliber vs. .357 short barrel

    Quote Originally Posted by Adkjoe View Post
    I can conceal both very well, I'm sort of leaning towards the .357 though since I will be spending most of my time hiking and camping deep in national forests. I haven't made up my mind yet it's a hard decision but I think I would feel more comfortable with some 180 gr .357's over pretty much any grain .40 when it comes to the woods.
    I went to the Buffalo Bore ammo website and compared heavy .357 to heavy .40 ammo:

    .357 magnum 180 grain hard cast lead - 1302 fps velocity, 675 ft-lb energy (from 3 inch barrel test gun)

    .40 S&W 180 grain JHP bullet - 1100 fps velocity, 484 ft-lb energy (4 inch barrel gun)

    I am presuming that your Ruger SP101 has a 3 inch barrel. If the barrel is shorter the velocity and energy would be less than above.

    While the .357 ballistics are higher, I wouldn't relish shooting this type of ammo from a 25 ounce revolver with a 3 inch barrel. I think the recoil would be very high, and you only have 5 shots.

    The .40 caliber ballistics above are lower but still significant. And you would have 14 shots before reloading. Personally, I can shoot the G23 more accurately than a short barrel snubby, so that would be my preference.
    Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the Peoples' Liberty's Teeth." - George Washington

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array Adkjoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Northern Vermont
    Posts
    765
    All very good points thanks guys.

    Quote Originally Posted by pogo2 View Post
    I went to the Buffalo Bore ammo website and compared heavy .357 to heavy .40 ammo:

    .357 magnum 180 grain hard cast lead - 1302 fps velocity, 675 ft-lb energy (from 3 inch barrel test gun)

    .40 S&W 180 grain JHP bullet - 1100 fps velocity, 484 ft-lb energy (4 inch barrel gun)

    I am presuming that your Ruger SP101 has a 3 inch barrel. If the barrel is shorter the velocity and energy would be less than above.

    While the .357 ballistics are higher, I wouldn't relish shooting this type of ammo from a 25 ounce revolver with a 3 inch barrel. I think the recoil would be very high, and you only have 5 shots.

    The .40 caliber ballistics above are lower but still significant. And you would have 14 shots before reloading. Personally, I can shoot the G23 more accurately than a short barrel snubby, so that would be my preference.
    Yes it's a 3". I have a couple boxes and have shot a number of the 180gr buffalo bore round. Yep there a handful alright but I can manage them. I usually practice from about 80 feet and I can put all 5 of the 180gr rounds on a paper plate at that distance. Not as quickly as I could .38 or regular .357 loads but I can do it.

    I think Glock10mman has a point though with the double tap ammo. That might not be a bad combo.

    Are these what your talking about Glockman?
    DoubleTap Ammunition
    Vermont does not issue Permit/Licenses to Carry a Concealed firearm. Vermont allows anyone
    who can legally own a firearm to carry it concealed without a permit of any kind.

  11. #11
    Member Array Horsetrader's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    now: here and there
    Posts
    225
    Just my 2 cents: the Montana and Wyoming Rockies are full of bears, and not like those puny bears back east. Out here in Glacier we wear bells on our backpacks to warn the bears that we are coming. When we camp away from town I carry a S & W 686. But as I often say: you do as you will, its still a free country.
    "Improvise, adapt, overcome."

  12. #12
    Senior Member Array Adkjoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Northern Vermont
    Posts
    765
    ^ I grew up in whitefish right outside of glacier park. I always carried a .44 but I don't have that option this time. I'm going to be spending the majority of my time in Utah but will eventually head up to the Tetons and towards glacier.
    Vermont does not issue Permit/Licenses to Carry a Concealed firearm. Vermont allows anyone
    who can legally own a firearm to carry it concealed without a permit of any kind.

  13. #13
    Member Array LoadedPipes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    East Coast USA
    Posts
    336
    I'd take the .357 and load it with FMJ, hollowpoints might not penetrate a bears fur/skin sufficiently. If you're in the woods often you might want to invest in a dedicated "woods gun" I have my .44 S&W 629 for this purpose and you can conceal one easy enough.


  14. #14
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    9,505
    Yes sir, those are the ones. If you think or desire protection against black bear, the desired shot placement is for a shoulder hit to imobilize it. Black bear are not really that tough, and full penetration is desired. In the chance you are charged, one shoot drop to a level even with the bear and begin raining lead into the head and chest area. You are looking for either an instant kill by head shot, or, kill by the bullets penetrating deep into the chest, or, and hopefully in addition to the afor mentioned, a shoulder/s being broken by bullets resulting in loss of mobility, ie... charge is stopped.

    The reason you want to get on even height level with a charging animal is because you will shoot behind it, and or miss. By dropping down all your shots are head on with no lead involved, better probability your shots will hit something critical.

    With a grizzly, well, the hi cap hard cast bullets will still serve better because in a panic (and you will be) you need as many bullets on target quickly as possible. Of course a shotty or rifle is better, but hey, we fight with what we have.

    Of course for people they will work too.
    Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.

  15. #15
    VIP Member Array MNBurl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    3,019
    I would take the 357 with soft points for hiking and JHPs for around town.
    MNBurl

    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking" - George S. Patton.

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

black bear shot placement

,

defensive black bear shot placement

,

r grizzle sp101 iwb

,

ruger sp101 357 3 barrel ft lbs energy

,

will a .40 cal stop a montana grizzly

,

with glock 19 i can put all round into a paper plat at 80 feet, is that ok

Click on a term to search for related topics.