The Cash Register--Where Hypocrisy and Ideals Collide

The Cash Register--Where Hypocrisy and Ideals Collide

This is a discussion on The Cash Register--Where Hypocrisy and Ideals Collide within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I don't know if this has been kicked around before, but I am curious to know what others think. Most of us here are Second ...

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Thread: The Cash Register--Where Hypocrisy and Ideals Collide

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    The Cash Register--Where Hypocrisy and Ideals Collide

    I don't know if this has been kicked around before, but I am curious to know what others think. Most of us here are Second Amendment advocates, open and/or concealed carry aficionados, and general defensive carry enthusiasts.

    In Ohio, as in some other states, signage in public places carries the weight of law. These signs are put up at the discretion of the business owner, and honored or ignored at the whim of the citizen carrying the gun. CPZ discussions, do-not-patronize lists on web-sites, no-guns/no-money wallet-sized cards and the debate in general goes on and on.

    Most stores where guns and shooting supplies are sold to the public welcome carriers as long as their firearms remain holstered. Signs to that effect are often posted. These dealers trust us in their establishments.

    Gun shows are a different matter entirely. Often held in CPZ venues which cover the permanently-affixed notices on the entrances of the doors to accommodate the week-end's event, promoters post their own signage banning all loaded firearms and ammunition on the part of patrons. They further station personnel at entrances to question and search all patrons, and to physically disable all firearms coming through the door with a paid admission. Given that ammunition is widely available within the show itself, and none of the sellers' guns are similarly disabled, this strikes me as very selective in the interpretation and implementation of the rights of the legally-carrying public. Concealed-carry schools, and at least one dealer who sells no-guns/no money cards and maintains a very large website dedicated to the promotion of carry rights set up vendor displays at most, if not all the major shows in Ohio. It seems to me that the ideal which is advocated does not apply in practice when dollar bills are involved.

    I understand the arguments and rationale behind all this, so I do not seek explanation or justification, merely points of view.
    Last edited by Mike1956; December 22nd, 2011 at 10:39 AM. Reason: grammar


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    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    The dollar goes along way as it pertains to a belief system..
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

    Never be ashamed of a scar. It simply means, that you were stronger than whatever tried to hurt you......

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryball View Post
    The dollar goes along way as it pertains to a belief system..
    Yes, indeed. Were I an advocate of CPZs (which I certainly am not), this is one argument in favor of which would be hard to lose.

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    I only frequent stores that allow me to carry.Having said that I do go to gunshows that don't allow loaded weapons inside,I can understand their reasoning for it,there are a lot of firearms being handled,not everybody that picks up a gun practices safe gun handling,and you always got the idgit that will pull a loaded gun out and say 'This is what I carry",So in that type of environment I have to bite the bullet for about an hour.
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    Gun shows? You mean, where I have to pay admission for the privilege of spending my hard earned money? AND they don't let me carry inside?

    No thanks. Stopped going long ago. Not to mention that the prices are typically outrageously high, and I have an intense dislike for crowds.

    I can find what I want online, or at local gun stores.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I don't know if this has been kicked around before, but I am curious to know what others think. Most of us here are Second Amendment advocates, open and/or concealed carry aficionados, and general defensive carry enthusiasts.

    In Ohio, as in some other states, signage in public places carries the weight of law. These signs are put up at the discretion of the business owner, and honored or ignored at the whim of the citizen carrying the gun. CPZ discussions, do-not-patronize lists on web-sites, no-guns/no-money wallet-sized cards and the debate in general goes on and on.

    Most stores where guns and shooting supplies are sold to the public welcome carriers as long as their firearms remain holstered. Signs to that effect are often posted. These dealers trust us in their establishments.

    Gun shows are a different matter entirely. Often held in CPZ venues which cover the permanently-affixed notices on the entrances of the doors to accommodate the week-end's event, promoters post their own signage banning all loaded firearms and ammunition on the part of patrons. They further station personnel at entrances to question and search all patrons, and to physically disable all firearms coming through the door with a paid admission. Given that ammunition is widely available within the show itself, and none of the sellers' guns are similarly disabled, this strikes me as very selective in the interpretation and implementation of the rights of the legally-carrying public. Concealed-carry schools, and at least one dealer who sells no-guns/no money cards and maintains a very large website dedicated to the promotion of carry rights set up vendor displays at most, if not all the major shows in Ohio. It seems to me that the ideal which is advocated does not apply in practice when dollar bills are involved.

    I understand the arguments and rationale behind all this, so I do not seek explanation or justification, merely points of view.
    Eh, I wouldn't be too concerned. They have to pay for their space in the event. Their purpose is to get their message out regardless of the restrictions of certain venues. I believe I know who you are referring to and they have done wonders in Ohio. Even Jesus had to sometimes go into the house of sinners to save souls.

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    It is a big hassle for me as well to have to disarm at these shows, however, I do understand the safety component as to why. I hear stories of ND's at gun stores and gun shows. There is no guarantee that all legally carrying people would keep their loaded weapons holstered. Plenty of holster makers and other vendors that might distract someone from keeping it holstered. Believe it or not there are people out there that do carry and that lack common sense.
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    Quote Originally Posted by devo6684 View Post
    It is a big hassle for me as well to have to disarm at these shows, however, I do understand the safety component as to why. I hear stories of ND's at gun stores and gun shows. There is no guarantee that all legally carrying people would keep their loaded weapons holstered. Plenty of holster makers and other vendors that might distract someone from keeping it holstered. Believe it or not there are people out there that do carry and that lack common sense.
    Which is the same rationale all who post CPZ signs use.

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    I'd imagine it's all about insurance for the event. If they don't enforce the "no loaded guns" clause then they probably can't get coverage....thus no event.
    And you know I could have me a million more friends, and all I'd have to lose is my point of view. -- John Prine (A Good Time)

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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post
    Gun shows? You mean, where I have to pay admission for the privilege of spending my hard earned money? AND they don't let me carry inside?

    No thanks. Stopped going long ago. Not to mention that the prices are typically outrageously high, and I have an intense dislike for crowds.

    I can find what I want online, or at local gun stores.
    +1 on that! I will only shop where all of me and my chosen method of personal protection are welcome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Okemo View Post
    I'd imagine it's all about insurance for the event. If they don't enforce the "no loaded guns" clause then they probably can't get coverage....thus no event.
    Imagination aside, do you have specific sources?

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    Quote Originally Posted by gigamortis View Post
    +1 on that! I will only shop where all of me and my chosen method of personal protection are welcome.
    So I will take it that you, 10thmtn and me are three people who do, indeed find it hypocritical. Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    So I will take it that you, 10thmtn and me are three people who do, indeed find it hypocritical. Thanks
    I am #4....
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    It is simple if they ban carry I spend my dollars else where.

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    Given the wheel-barrows full of cash these events generate for the promoters, I'm sure our unwillingness to disarm as a means of entering their shows will go completely un-noticed. Similarly, I doubt "no guns-no money" cards and protestations have much overall effect, either, given the fullness of the parking lot at the local Applebees at any given time.

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