Problem gun

This is a discussion on Problem gun within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I bought a Kimber Ultra CDP II 3" gun as a CCW. It has turned out to be a problem child, it has been back ...

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Thread: Problem gun

  1. #1
    Member Array MJZZZ's Avatar
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    Problem gun

    I bought a Kimber Ultra CDP II 3" gun as a CCW. It has turned out to be a problem child, it has been back to Kimber once for repair and now that it's back it has a completely different problem. I'm either going to take it to a local smith or try Kimbers service one more time before I decide to sell it. Would you ever trust this gun to carry, or should I just cut losses now and buy new again. I still have several months to break in a new gun before Kansas issues our CCH licenses. I'm looking hard at the Colt Defender. Mike Z
    "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen.'' Warren vs District of Columbia

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Array BlueLion's Avatar
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    First, what problems are you having ? Because if you have ruled out operator error, such as limp wristing, bad ammo choice etc, then I would send it back to Kimber and explain the problem. Then try again, because I would have a problem selling a pistol that has problems because it could cost someone their life. Anyway good luck and I am sure the board will be alot more helpful if you fully explain the problems you are having with the weapon.
    Listen, Think and React.....Nuff Said.....

  4. #3
    VIP Member Array Ti Carry's Avatar
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    Sorry to here that. It's like anything else sometimes there are lemon's out there.

    I just heard of a Colt Defender Lemon just yesterday from a member here. So it's not just a Kimber thing like many want to believe, Springfield has there problems as well. I believe that Rockyhad some problems with his Springfield sent it back and all is well if I remember right.

    First of all you are not telling us the problem or now problems you are having?

    Here are some things to check,

    1) Does your Ultra have and internal extractor or is it the external model?

    2) If having feeding problems have you changed mag's to say a Wilson, Tripp Cobra mag's or a better quality mag than what Kimber sends? The Kimber mag's are usually junk and is the first thing I pitch and the first thind to look at for feeding problems.

    3) How many rounds do you have through the gun, are you lubing correctly in the break in process, have you tried different ammo?

    Without knowing the whole story it is hard to point you in the right direction.

    I will tell you I also own a Ultra CDP and did have feeding problems, about 1 sometimes 2 with every mag or every other mag. The Wilson or Cobra mag's didn't solve the problem but did clean it up a bit.

    I never had a failer to extract (I have the internal extractor) just feeding problems. I elected to drop it off to my local smith who is one of the best in a several state area so I am lucky to have him so close. For the cost of shipping it to Kimber would have been, I had a reliability job done, polished feed ramp, throted the barrel, did a trigger job and the gun is 100% and 2,000 rounds later. I carry this gun and the gun is completely reliable.

    Kimber also has a bad rap which is true that when you send the gun to them they hardly look at it, shot a few rounds that work for them and call it good then send you your still non functioning Kimber back to you dirty.

    I wouldn't send it to Kimber again. Also what are they saying that they did to it? Did they fix you first problem but now you have another totaly different problem.

    I need info to help!!!!!!


    Ti.
    Train and train hard, you might not get a second chance to make a first impression!

    I vote for Monica Lewinsky's Ex-Boyfriend's Wife for President.....Not!

  5. #4
    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
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    Another discussion of your question

    There is a fairly long thread running now on 1911 Forum regarding the Kimber Ultra vs. the Colt Defender. Here is a link:
    1911 thread Ultra vs. Defender

    The consensus of the thread seems to be that some Kimber Ultras will have problems, and that the Colt Defender tends to be a reliable gun.

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array Ti Carry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pogo2 View Post
    There is a fairly long thread running now on 1911 Forum regarding the Kimber Ultra vs. the Colt Defender. Here is a link:
    1911 thread Ultra vs. Defender

    The consensus of the thread seems to be that some Kimber Ultras will have problems, and that the Colt Defender tends to be a reliable gun.
    Don't believe the hype! Kimber did have more issues with the Ultra's that had the external extractors (they were stupid to have switched), they switched back to the original internal extractor design and problems went away. The problems that they still may be having is directly related to the junk mags Kimber sends with there gun's. I don't believe that Colt or Springfield or Kimbers are any better than the other now as far as reliability. Although I have no clue why Kimber would send a mag that doesn't work well many times with there gun's, they do all the same.

    Member slimjimwill tell you his Colt Defender was a lemon, I bought his Alessi holster for it and now he has a Glock. So Colt has their problems as well.

    Also take notice that this Kimber, Colt question is in the Colt forum! Do you think the reviews of Kimber are going to be better than Colt in a Colt thread? Colt is a great gun, I have a few and carry a combat commander a lot of the time, so I am not baised.


    Ti.
    Train and train hard, you might not get a second chance to make a first impression!

    I vote for Monica Lewinsky's Ex-Boyfriend's Wife for President.....Not!

  7. #6
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    I had a problem with a bad slide release on my SA .But it is a 4" barrel. I bought a 4" after researching all the problems of FTF, FTE on the 3" guns. If I were to ever risk getting 1(which would be doubtful, I have heard of less with the colt defenders)
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


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  8. #7
    Member Array MJZZZ's Avatar
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    To start with the first Ultra CDP that was shipped to my dealer. The first time we dropped the mag, the mag release would not go back in. Non-functioning gun, so it goes back. Three days later we received the new gun, shooting only Kimber mags I had multiple feed problems 10 out of 100 rounds. After reading up a bit, I went to Wilson 47D mags and switched out the Kimber followers to Wilson polymer kits. The problem got better after a new recoil spring and over 600 more rounds, using several different brands of 230gr FMJ ammo. I took my CCH training with the gun, and that day it had 6 out of 55 FTF's. So with 755 rounds through it, I sent it in for repair. They reamed and polished the barrel, worked on the slide stop, adjusted the extractor and polished the breechface. It was there and back in 11 days, which I thought was fantastic. It was 2 weeks before I got to test it and when I did it was perfect for about the first 70 rounds. Then during the next 85 rounds I had 9 FTE problems. Three times I had to drop the mag and push empty brass out of the barrel with a dowel. All FTE's were with the same brand ammo, and I had already shot the other brands I had brought. I thought the gun might have errored after getting hot, or it started not to like the ammo I was using. So I took it to a local gun range, where a HS buddy works and he put 21 rounds of a variety of ammo through it. He blew out the center ring of the target at 10 yards and didn't have any problems. Dead on accurate and perfect in function, but he didn't try multiple or rapid shots so the gun didn't heat up. That is where I'm at, Kimber says to send it back so they can see it again. I'm going to the range with it this weekend with 100 rounds of Federal JHP and 100 rounds American Eagle FMJ ammo to test my hot gun theory. Mike Z
    "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen.'' Warren vs District of Columbia

  9. #8
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    Personally , I would ask them to cover all shipping costs and get it right (if possible) Do you have the external extractor?
    "In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson


    Nemo Me Impune Lacesset

  10. #9
    VIP Member Array Ti Carry's Avatar
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    O.k., now we are getting somewhere. I still didn't see if you said if it has an internal or external extractor?

    Ammo with these gun's are picky, so I suggest you find what works the best and only run that type ammo. I would bet the AE FMJ ammo will not run as well. If so stay away from it. The Federal should do just fine.

    Now, a lot of times with the 3" gun's it is user error. Just like BL said, having a limp wrist and what not. Sounds like you buddy at the range was able to overcome that with three mag's and not one problem. Try holding the gun firmer in your hand this weekend. It's good that you got the new mag's to help that problem.

    Question, can you tell visually that Kimber did the work they say they did? It's quite possible that your problems are just break in, (slide to frame fit is much better on a Kimber so therefore tighter) ammo selection and possible limp wrist. Hey, I did it with my Ultra as well and have been shooting guns for better than 25 years, so we are not immun from it. When I found that ammo selection it likes and had a firmer grip all has been well.

    Take it out this weekend, lube the gun properly (many do not put enough lube on the gun for proper break in) if the AE ammo starts the problems, stop using it and go to the Federal and see what happens. Then let us know how it went. Try and it another couple of box's of good ammo and try as well and shoot as many as you can afford to and or time allows.


    Ti.
    Train and train hard, you might not get a second chance to make a first impression!

    I vote for Monica Lewinsky's Ex-Boyfriend's Wife for President.....Not!

  11. #10
    Member Array MJZZZ's Avatar
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    My Kimber has the internal extractor and has never once errored using American Eagle FMJ, what it doesn't like is MagTec and Remington UMC. I hear about all these Kimber owners who have never had any problems, and I get 2 duds in a row. The serial numbers of the two guns were only 5 numbers apart and were both made on 4-21-06. I started out at another forum, but I don't want to sound like a whiner and all I ever have to talk about is my POS Kimber. I've had it to the range 10 times and have never had an errorfree session. My buddy at The Bullet Hole in O.P., Ks watched me shoot to check for proper technic before I bought the gun. So no limp wristing going on here. I've got more than 1100 rounds through the gun, so break in should be over. I didn't mention one of the earlier problems was the slide locking back with rounds in the mag, and Kimber fixed the slide stop on the first trip back. My question was really, would you ever trust this gun again? I'll take 200 rounds with me, but it starts to have problems Kimber will be looking at it again. Mike Z
    "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen.'' Warren vs District of Columbia

  12. #11
    VIP Member Array Ti Carry's Avatar
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    Make them take it back and buy a Colt!


    Ti
    Train and train hard, you might not get a second chance to make a first impression!

    I vote for Monica Lewinsky's Ex-Boyfriend's Wife for President.....Not!

  13. #12
    Distinguished Member Array RSSZ's Avatar
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    I own 2, Kimber UC CDP II's, both with int/ext's. I did a CORRECT F&B on both of mine. I did a PROPER break in on both of mine. I use only "proper" mags(Wilson)in the weapon.I PROPERLY shoot mine. I have NEVER had a problem with either. Even the one that I have subjected to pure hell(my training weapon).

    I'm sure that people have done what I have done to their Kimbers and properly shoot their Kimbers and still have the problems with their Kimber brand weapons. Yes,even the 5 inchers. With respect I say,I feel sorry for those people.

    I would also say that I would NEVER,EVER,carry a weapon for self(or family) protection that I did not trust to function properly.

    I believe that Kimber has a problem somewhere along their production line,and/or in their QA dept., and also in their customer relations/PR department. This is very sad because I feel that they otherwise,make a fine product.

    I would suggest that you find and carry a weapon that you are COMPLETELY confident in, even if it's a High Point. The good brands are out there and the good models in those brands are also out there. Keep looking,you'll find it. --------
    Last edited by RSSZ; August 23rd, 2006 at 04:52 PM.

  14. #13
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    My question was really, would you ever trust this gun again?


    NO. I bought a Kahr pm9 and loved it at first. The gun had minor problems at the beginning. put 500 rounds through it and then more serious problems set in. For me those mechanical problems lead to shooting problems and confidence problems. I had 30 days on the gun, so I took it back and went with a Glock and I'm really happy that I did.

    These guns are expensive, they have to work out of the box or they go back. I use Cabelas, they give you 30 days on every new gun. If you don't like it you can return it. To me its well worth the extra money they charge for their firearms.

    Greetings from Johnson County
    J.S.

  15. #14
    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
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    The trust issue

    Quote Originally Posted by MJZZZ View Post
    My question was really, would you ever trust this gun again?
    I agree with you that it is logical to be wary of a gun (2 guns in your case) that have given you so many problems. In your shoes, I would probably want to see about 500 rounds of mixed ammo go through the gun properly before I would carry it.

    I have always found 1911s to be more touchy than some of the more modern designs in feeding and extracting. Once you get a 1911 running correctly, it has many good qualities. And most 1911s probably work just fine from the start. But if someone wanted to make me a bet on a gun running correctly out of the box, I'd rather put my money on a Sig, Glock or H&K than a 1911.

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