Just some thoughts about the .357 sig vs .40 S&W

This is a discussion on Just some thoughts about the .357 sig vs .40 S&W within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I spoke to a Tennessee Highway Patrol officer today that was here for a presentation of some kind. Well, I couldn't resist asking him how ...

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Thread: Just some thoughts about the .357 sig vs .40 S&W

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    Just some thoughts about the .357 sig vs .40 S&W

    I spoke to a Tennessee Highway Patrol officer today that was here for a presentation of some kind. Well, I couldn't resist asking him how long they had been carrying Glocks. He said about 10 years - hang on I'm getting there. So I said, "It's a .357 Sig isn't it?" "Yep" he said. So I asked, "What's the general impression of the .357 sig?" He said they like it. This is where it's going to hit the fan.

    He went on to say the reason they went to the .357 sig is because the had some shootings with the .40 S&W and it failed to stop threats effectively. So what else could I say but, "So how's the .357 sig doing?" He said, "A lot better!". So I think, "Hmmm...." and asked if he'd like a cup of coffee; he said yes, so I gave him a cup of coffee from the 'office' pot.

    And there you have it.
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    Senior Member Array Freedomofchoice's Avatar
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    I have suspected that might be the case since secret service and the like have carried 357 Sig, but I'm still thinking that shot placement is a huge factor.

    Somewhere on one of these forums I read about a guy who was shot and hit 11 times by 9mm bullets and lived to testify against the guy that shot him. The account was somewhat sketchy without any real details on where he was hit, but I'm sure that if the first round had been a head shot the other 10 would have been superfluous.
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    Member Array Lyndo's Avatar
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    I have been around quite a few Oklahoma and Texas Troopers and they all had very good things to say about the .357 SIG round. I'm guessing the Secret Service did quite a bit of research before they selected it. All of these things combined played a huge role in my choice to carry the round, what sealed it for me is that the accuracy of the cartridge is astounding.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freedomofchoice View Post
    I have suspected that might be the case since secret service and the like have carried 357 Sig, but I'm still thinking that shot placement is a huge factor.

    Somewhere on one of these forums I read about a guy who was shot and hit 11 times by 9mm bullets and lived to testify against the guy that shot him. The account was somewhat sketchy without any real details on where he was hit, but I'm sure that if the first round had been a head shot the other 10 would have been superfluous.
    It's interesting that you mentioned the head shot. I didn't mention this in my OP, but the THP gave a specific example of a BG being shot in the head with a .40 S&W and it didn't stop him.

    Here in Chattanooga, four Chattanooga LEOs shot some 50 rounds at an armed BG. He was hit about 20 times with .45 ACP before they were satisfied he was stopped.
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    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
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    Maybe they need to come up here to Ky and learn how to shoot with the KSP. Ours have worked extremely well.

    I guess things just havent been the same in Tennesee since the Alamo. :-)
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    VIP Member Array zonker1986's Avatar
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    my understanding is that the only thing the .357 SIG offers over the .40 is a flatter shooting more accurate weapon at distance, which is a plus for State Police, and, the .357SIG is a better
    performer at shooting through barriers such as a windshield.
    .40SW seems to be working just fine for about a gazillion other LEO agencies and find the claim from the Tennessee Patrolman to be a bit over the top.
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    It's also said that the necked down cartridge shape is more reliable for feeding into the chamber.
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    Federal Air Marshals also carry the .357 Sig. In such tight quarters on an aircraft, accuracy is paramount for these guys. That says a lot about this particular round if a lot of federal agencies prefer the .357.

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    Drove myself crazy trying to decide which caliber I was going to carry when I started researching for CC.

    Ended up choosing 9mm after reading up on ballistics tests (which were so varied it was rediculous)

    Two factors pushed me to the 9mm over .357sig or .40sw: price and availability.

    I'm sure as time passes, I will have a suitable sidearm in all common calibers above .380 (already got my eyeballs on a 1911)

    I just like knowing that no matter where I go, there always seems to be plenty of 9mm in stock and it is a "capable" caliber.
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    Senior Member Array AZ Hawk's Avatar
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    I've recently become a big fan of the .357 SIG after purchasing a Lone Wolf .357 SIG conversion barrel for my Glock 23. It's now my outdoors (backpacking/hiking/camping) gun. I still prefer my Glock 19 for urban EDC, however.
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    Have the bad guys improved so much that it now takes as many as 20 rounds from the venerable .45 acp to bring one down? A shot to the head from a .40cal slug won't even faze them. During WWII the 9mm had enough power to take quite a few lives. But later, as bad guys became immune to it (as they had the .38 special) it became necessary to to upsize and it now takes half a box of ammo to put one down! Or could the real cause be poor marksmanship. It sounds a lot like the sloppy carpenter blaming the hammer. Those 20 45 acp rounds, were they through the heart? Or was he shot in the left foot, right thumb, etc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gryphon View Post
    Have the bad guys improved so much that it now takes as many as 20 rounds from the venerable .45 acp to bring one down? A shot to the head from a .40cal slug won't even faze them. During WWII the 9mm had enough power to take quite a few lives. But later, as bad guys became immune to it (as they had the .38 special) it became necessary to to upsize and it now takes half a box of ammo to put one down! Or could the real cause be poor marksmanship. It sounds a lot like the sloppy carpenter blaming the hammer. Those 20 45 acp rounds, were they through the heart? Or was he shot in the left foot, right thumb, etc.
    It's kinda funny that if I had said that about the 9mm it would have been how loathsome the 9mm is. What a different POV when it's the .45 that didn't work.

    You think a .45 through the heart would have stopped him where a 9mm through the heart wouldn't?

    He was pretty well shot up throughout the torso. Why would you think all the hits were in the left foot or right thumb?

    When I was at Blackwater for training, they showed us a video of an actual shooting where a woman's boyfriend shot her three times in the chest with a .45 ACP. Not only did she not go down, she ran around the car screaming he's shooting me.

    Evan Marshall tells of an experience he saw in person where a fleeing BG was shot in the back of the head with a .357 mag. The guy went down, but when the officers got to him, the guy sat up and said his head was hurting. Marshall said you could see the bulge of the .357 bullet just under the skin of the forehead.

    I'm not pushing the .357 sig, .40 S&W, 9mm, or .45 ACP. They all work; they all fail.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zonker1986 View Post
    my understanding is that the only thing the .357 SIG offers over the .40 is a flatter shooting more accurate weapon at distance, which is a plus for State Police, and, the .357SIG is a better
    performer at shooting through barriers such as a windshield.
    .40SW seems to be working just fine for about a gazillion other LEO agencies and find the claim from the Tennessee Patrolman to be a bit over the top.
    There used to be an ammo ballistics board. I forget the name now, but he did a bunch of gel test comparisons of the contemporary ammo of that day, probably about 10 years ago.

    His gel blocks were enclosed or at least partially by some wooden boards and he stated that the .357 sig was the only handgun round that broke the wooden frame boards!

    I don't know if that could be repeated, etc., but this guy was pretty well thought of in the field. And the .357 sig today may not be a .357 sig of yesterday. Anyway, this thread wasn't meant to prove anything; I just thought it would be of interest why the THP, or at least the reason given, went to the .357 sig.
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    Senior Member Array Cold Shot's Avatar
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    A buddy of mine worked at a major Texas PD for several years and he was a big fan of .357 sig.

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    Most agencies and ccw holders who have went .357 SIG from other calibers have not dropped it and went back to something else.

    Attributes: superb tactical penetration, lower recoil than a .40 or 10mm, shoots like a laser and hits like a hammer.

    What else can you ask for?

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