Do you carry a low budget handgun?

This is a discussion on Do you carry a low budget handgun? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by muttsrt Not even close to the same thing. In your examples, cheap is referring to inferior. The people that currently own or ...

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Thread: Do you carry a low budget handgun?

  1. #106
    Member Array Rhcmlc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muttsrt View Post
    Not even close to the same thing. In your examples, cheap is referring to inferior. The people that currently own or have owned the Hi-Points have already stated that they are reliable. Not comfortable, but reliable. This means they go bang when the trigger is pulled. Is a 9mm more powerful if its shot from a Glock vs being shot from a Hi-Point? Is the 45 thats shot from my 1911 magically more deadly than the same round fired from a Hi-Point? The answer is no. If a firearm is reliable, why is it a bad choice for self defense?

    If we want to talk reliability, my very first handgun was a Smith & Wesson .357. I forget the model number, 686 or 636 or 66 something like that. That gun was a piece of junk that didnt fire half the time, even with top shelf ammo. I havent owned a Smith since, and wouldnt give ya a dollar for one today. Based on the logic of some people here, I would be better off carrying that S&W because it cost more and is a better brand than a Hi-Point, which is just a ridiculous way of thinking.

    Like I said in earlier posts, I dont own, nor have I ever owned a Hi-Point, but I have shot them, and I have yet to have one fail. I personally would feel more comfortable with a gun I know is going to go bang every time I pull the trigger vs carrying a gun everyone thinks is much better, but in the end, may or may not fire if I really need it.

    In the end, most people dont want to carry a Hi-point, and I am in that same group. I do not want to own or carry a Hi-Point, but if it came down to leaving the house with no firearm on my side or leaving the house with a Hi-Point on my side, the Hi-Point wins....every time.
    I actually agree with Rockymtnnut. If Hi Points were known for going "bang when the trigger is pulled", then why isnt there a single law enforcement agency that uses them? Not even 1 agency in the United States.
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  3. #107
    Member Array ScottieG59's Avatar
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    I have been broke in the past. Still, I did not start to carry cheap handguns. I would go to the range less.

    In handguns I carry, I focus on value. I would have one good thing before I would have many not so good things.

    I consider Ruger to be about as cheap as I go. Taurus may be okay if it all I could get.

    I would not go with Cobra.
    tashunkwitko likes this.

  4. #108
    Member Array muttsrt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhcmlc View Post
    I actually agree with Rockymtnnut. If Hi Points were known for going "bang when the trigger is pulled", then why isnt there a single law enforcement agency that uses them? Not even 1 agency in the United States.
    The point was with my limited experience with Hi-Points, I have NEVER seen a failure. With my limited experience with Smith & Wesson, I have had 100% failure (owned just one, and it failed). Based on personal experience, I would choose the gun that goes bang vs the gun that MIGHT go bang. In my case, I would opt to carry the used Hi-Point from the LGS (that I shot with zero failures) vs the S&W .357, model whatever it was.

    Whether people like it or not, most of the folks who posted that they have owned/own a Hi-Point or have fired one, have said that they were reliable. The ones who never owned one or never fired one, are the ones saying they are not reliable and are just on the "I hate Hi-Points" bandwagon. Before one can dismiss a gun as being unreliable, you would hope they were basing it on personal experience rather than regurgitated crap read from internet forums.

    And no one has explained how a 45acp fired from a Hi-Point is less deadly than the same round fired from a Glock or a S&W or a Springfield. Does shooting the same ammo from a name brand gun make it more powerful? Is the round going to bounce off the chest of a bad guy just because it was fired from a low end gun?

    The original question was posed, would you carry a Hi-Point IF thats all you had. I stand by my answer, yes IF thats all I had. In my case, I dont have to carry a Hi-Point, so I dont. Would I spend my money on a different gun rather than the Hi-Point? Most definitely. As pointed out by several people, there are many better choices, most within $50 of the cost of a Hi-Point, but that wasnt what was asked.

    And FWIW, I dont base my opinion of guns on whether or not the police use them. Just because a lot of cops are issued and carry Glock's doesnt mean that I would ever own a Glock. Same goes for the .223 round. Its widely used by military and law enforcement, but I would choose 7.62x39mm over .223 any day, any situation.


    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post

    So, let's say I'm in dire straights. I buy this $100 gun and $40 worth of ammo (which isn't a lot these days) to go with it. I take it to the range and I find out I happened to get a lemon. I take it back to the store and they send it to Hi-Point. In x amount of weeks of having no gun again (and while I could be saving up for something better) I'm waiting for my gun to come back from repairs. When it gets back I spend another $40 to take it back to the range. It works fine this time but one of the grips is cracked. I can live with that and take it back out shooting (another $20-$40 that could have been saved). After x amount of rounds I find the slide under the ejection port has cracked (a common problem with these firearms). I take it back to be sent back again. And, again, I'm stuck waiting a couple of weeks with no gun.

    Finally, this time it comes back, I take it shooting and I FINALLY have a working gun that seems okay but my trust is just not there and when I do the math I have just spent around $300 for a gun I have only had in my possession for a few short days out of the months I've "owened" it. The money I have put into it has been to prove it's reliability and if I were to go into a gun store and try to trade it in on something better they would laugh at me.

    (IF (and that is a HUGE IF) the gunstore will even allow a trade in on a hi-point, the most I have EVER seen a hi-point trade in for is $40. I have seen Glocks/Springfields usually get around $200 + for trade in value (low end) and even Bersa can get you $100).

    So, now I don't trust the gun, but I can't even trade it in for a fraction of what I put into it.
    The same thing can be said for________ (insert name of gun here). Just because you buy a Glock doesnt mean it will be a good weapon. What if you were the one that bought a Glock and had to send it back x number of times? Wouldnt you then have more money invested in shipping/ammo, just like you would have had it been a Hi-Point? Wouldnt you only be in possesion of it a couple days of the months you have owned it? Buying the Hi-Point doesnt automatically mean its going back to the factory. ANY maker of firearms can have a lemon leave the shop.

    As far as trade in, using your numbers, you bought a $100 gun and sold/traded it back for $40. You lost $60. The $500/600(reasonable cost) Springfield or Glock, you said $200 (low end), which means you lost $300/400. How is that better? How is losing more money on trade in, a better deal? Its OK to lose hundreds of $$$ because you had a name brand gun? I would rather not lose at all, but if I had to lose, I would rather lose $60 than hundreds.

    Quote Originally Posted by limatunes View Post
    I have seen people "on a budget" who have done what is being suggested and when they got hit with an unexpected bill they come in and try to sell back their gun and are shocked to find they aren't going to get more than $25 on a Hi-Point.
    And if you run across any of those $25 Hi-Points, send them my way. I will buy as many as you can send me.

  5. #109
    Member Array tashunkwitko's Avatar
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    does a S&W Sigma 357v count- the sigma series is kinda of a baller on a budget type line of roscoes.
    Totus vestri castrum es nostrum possessia

  6. #110
    Member Array broknindarkagain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHTFGearLLC View Post
    do you or would you carry a low budget handgun if you had financial limitations?
    OK guys, put yourselfs in the shoes of a mid 20s person who has been hit hard by the economy, but has the same views as far as having to carry a weapon as you do.

    Now this person may bring home $600 a week, but has a wife and two children to support. For someone like this, I think I'm safe to say that a $900 Kimber, or even a $500 Glock is out of the question. Someone like this has to look at cheaper alternatives.

    For myself, and I would think most other people....a "budget" gun is something like a Hi Point, Sccy, Bersa, Diamondback, Jennings, or any other of the smaller manufacturers.

    To answer the question on my end....Yes I would carry a budget gun....and yes I have before....but with that being said, there are conditions. I've owned 3 Bersa Thunders, 1 Hi Point, and 1 Sccy (among other higher end pistols, thats just my budget list)...And I've carried each and every one.

    The Bersa Thunders were great. Each one I've owned operated flawlessly no matter what kind of ammo I fed them. They did tend to FTE if I had a weak grip...but thats to be expected with almost any gun. I've sold all my Bersas for $250+ each. Nearly what I paid for them new.

    The Hi Point I can honestly say really impressed me. It was reliable....easy to shoot....and I was very accurate with it....even my first time shooting it. I was actually more accurate with it on my first few mags than any other pistol I've ever fired for the first time. The only downfall was that it was pretty bulky and really ugly. I traded this for an M44

    Now the Sccy. This guy was trouble. I bought it brand new and took it to the range the next day to break it in. I had planned on shooting 350 rounds out of it to ensure it was good enough to carry. I got to about 35 rounds and started having FTE and FTF problems. Upon inspection I noticed the recoil spring guide thingy (dunno what its called) was sticking out of the end of the gun by about 1/8th inch....and there was a hairline crack on the slide. Needless to say, it was never shot again. What had happened was when it was made, they forgot to put locktite on the screw that holds the recoil spring to the rod. While I was shooting, every round I fired backed out that screw a little bit.

    Yeah, I have no problems at all carrying a budget gun if thats all I can afford. But in order for that budget gun to be carried, you should cycle several hundred rounds through it first to not only get use to the weapon, but to make sure that it will be reliable for you.

    Remember, a generic budget gun that has proven to be reliable to you is MUCH better than having nothing....or even an unreliable generic gun is better than nothing because usually just the sight of a weapon can diffuse a situation....and if that doesn't work at least you have a chance that it might fire....rather than just having no fire at all
    Trooperc7 likes this.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

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  7. #111
    Member Array broknindarkagain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muttsrt View Post
    Whether people like it or not, most of the folks who posted that they have owned/own a Hi-Point or have fired one, have said that they were reliable. The ones who never owned one or never fired one, are the ones saying they are not reliable and are just on the "I hate Hi-Points" bandwagon.
    ^^^This is very true.

    Like I had already said. I had nothing but 100% perfection out of my Hi Point 380. I know someone else with the 9mm version who had never had a single problem out of his either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhcmlc View Post
    I actually agree with Rockymtnnut. If Hi Points were known for going "bang when the trigger is pulled", then why isnt there a single law enforcement agency that uses them? Not even 1 agency in the United States.
    For several reasons.

    1-there is so much bad rep out there from people who are just assuming something but really have no first hand experience.

    2-the other options for duty weapons (Glock, M&P, HK, etc) are better in several ways. The biggest IMO is how comfortable they are.

    3-feild stripping.....i never was able to figure out how to field strip my hi point lol
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

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  8. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by muttsrt View Post
    The same thing can be said for________ (insert name of gun here). Just because you buy a Glock doesnt mean it will be a good weapon. What if you were the one that bought a Glock and had to send it back x number of times? Wouldnt you then have more money invested in shipping/ammo, just like you would have had it been a Hi-Point? Wouldnt you only be in possesion of it a couple days of the months you have owned it? Buying the Hi-Point doesnt automatically mean its going back to the factory. ANY maker of firearms can have a lemon leave the shop.
    Didn't I say that? I'm pretty sure I said that... oh look! I said that:
    ...I've seen it with all sorts of firearms. I've sent the same Taurus, Kimber, and even Glock or Sig back two, three even four times until it came back right...
    But from my experience behind the counter and as a RSO, I have seen far more troublesome Hi-Points and Jennings and Cobras than I have Glocks or Springfields.

    Quote Originally Posted by muttsrt View Post
    As far as trade in, using your numbers, you bought a $100 gun and sold/traded it back for $40. You lost $60. The $500/600(reasonable cost) Springfield or Glock, you said $200 (low end), which means you lost $300/400. How is that better? How is losing more money on trade in, a better deal? Its OK to lose hundreds of $$$ because you had a name brand gun? I would rather not lose at all, but if I had to lose, I would rather lose $60 than hundreds.
    This is when you need to learn how to work the system.

    Buy a used Glock or a used Springfield or M&P for $320-$350 (depending on condition). Even used you could probably sell it back (depending on the condition) for $200+ sometimes upwards to $250. You You are losing about the same you would lose with the Hi-Point.. Not to mention used guns like the ones mentioned above are usually pretty well tested and broken in and the previous owner has done the work for you in sending it back for any repairs. Not to mention, if the gun store has a range they will often let you test fire used guns for reliability and feel whereas they will not allow you to test fire new guns. Win/Win for you. You get resale value, get to test the actual gun before buying it and you aren't losing a lot of money if you do decide to sell back or trade in.

    And if you run across any of those $25 Hi-Points, send them my way. I will buy as many as you can send me.
    It's business, my friend.

    No gun store that wants to stay in business is going to give you $80 and turn around and sell the same gun for $80. They would make $0 profit. They give you a "trade/resale value" meaning what credit they will give you towards a trade or cash to buy the firearm back. IF they take a hi-point (which, as I said, many gun stores will not) they will give you around $25-$40 and then resell the used Hi-Point for around $60-$80 (sometimes less).

    People can do whatever they want... I really don't care that much, but if I were advising someone who came into a gun store wanting options, the above is what I would tell them.

    Having seen desperate people coming into the gun store trying to sell back their Hi-Point or having trouble with it is pretty sad. I've had that many times with Hi-Points and Cobras and Jennings... You know how many times I've had that with a Glock? Once. Springfield XDs? Zero. S&W M&P? Zero. S&W Sigma? Once.

    Like I said, people can do whatever they wants but it just makes far more sense to me to be a little smart about it, work the system and get the best bang for the buck.

  9. #113
    Member Array muttsrt's Avatar
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    I think we are all saying pretty much the same thing, if you carry a gun, make sure its in good working order, whatever brand you choose to carry. As far as Hi-Points go, I am done defending them, because honestly, I dont own one and do not seeing me having to own one in the near future...and I am not a fan of plastic guns, but thats a different subject entirely.

    I think there are far better choices than a low end gun, especially when you can get a decent used gun for close to the same amount of money, but that wasnt an option in the original posting of this thread.

    Be safe.

  10. #114
    VIP Member Array slugger6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muttsrt View Post
    The point was with my limited experience with Hi-Points, I have NEVER seen a failure.
    With my considerable experience with Hi-Points I have seen numerous failures. I wouldn't carry one on a bet! My EDC is a Colt Defender.
    "What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

  11. #115
    Distinguished Member Array Toorop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1956 View Post
    I would carry a set of nunchukus and a set of shirikens before I would carry a Hi-point or a .25.
    In many states "Ninja weapons" are illegal and cannot legally be carried even you have a permit to carry a firearm.

    I know nunchuks ate illegal in Arizona.

  12. #116
    Member Array muttsrt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slugger6 View Post
    With my considerable experience with Hi-Points I have seen numerous failures. I wouldn't carry one on a bet! My EDC is a Colt Defender.
    Well at least you have some personal experience with them and are not just jumping on the bandwagon because its the thing to do. My experience has differed from yours, no big deal. My EDC is my Springfield full sized 1911 except for the rare occasion I carry my Browning Hi-power, but my personal choice is the 45acp vs the 9mm.

  13. #117
    VIP Member Array zacii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by broknindarkagain View Post
    OK guys, put yourselfs in the shoes of a mid 20s person who has been hit hard by the economy...
    They could sell their xbox
    Trust in God and keep your powder dry

    "A heavily armed citizenry is not about overthrowing the government; it is about preventing the government from overthrowing liberty. A people stripped of their right of self defense is defenseless against their own government." -source

  14. #118
    Member Array broknindarkagain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zacii View Post
    They could sell their xbox
    You have obviously never struggled yourself if you have this fantasy in your head that every struggling young person has an Xbox that they can sell.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

    Smith & Wesson M&P9c

  15. #119
    Member Array rockymtnnut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muttsrt View Post
    Not even close to the same thing. In your examples, cheap is referring to inferior. The people that currently own or have owned the Hi-Points have already stated that they are reliable. Not comfortable, but reliable. This means they go bang when the trigger is pulled. Is a 9mm more powerful if its shot from a Glock vs being shot from a Hi-Point? Is the 45 thats shot from my 1911 magically more deadly than the same round fired from a Hi-Point? The answer is no. If a firearm is reliable, why is it a bad choice for self defense?

    They are inferior and not very reliable . Ever seen one with 2000 rounds without failure I have not. It's usually comical when watching on shoot with one they generally have a 150$ pistol and 160$ pair of Nike shoes. And on a lighter note even a cheap surgeon gets it right every once in a while.

    If we want to talk reliability, my very first handgun was a Smith & Wesson .357. I forget the model number, 686 or 636 or 66 something like that. That gun was a piece of junk that didnt fire half the time, even with top shelf ammo. I havent owned a Smith since, and wouldnt give ya a dollar for one today. Based on the logic of some people here, I would be better off carrying that S&W because it cost more and is a better brand than a Hi-Point, which is just a ridiculous way of thinking.

    Like I said in earlier posts, I dont own, nor have I ever owned a Hi-Point, but I have shot them, and I have yet to have one fail. I personally would feel more comfortable with a gun I know is going to go bang every time I pull the trigger vs carrying a gun everyone thinks is much better, but in the end, may or may not fire if I really need it.

    In the end, most people dont want to carry a Hi-point, and I am in that same group. I do not want to own or carry a Hi-Point, but if it came down to leaving the house with no firearm on my side or leaving the house with a Hi-Point on my side, the Hi-Point wins....every time.
    They are unreliable and inferior . Have you ever saw a high point pass a 2000 round challenge? I haven't . I place my confidence in a certain brand for a reason and its based on the track record of that brand over a course of time. Gloock ,Sig,H&k, have a reputation for a reason and so do high points cobras and all of the other low end fire arms. This is not a wrench at sears that if it breaks you take it back for a new one. a pistol is a tool that you bet your life on and if it breaks when you need it you die.
    It's comical the guy in my ccw class had a 150$ pistol and a 180$ air Jordan Nikes.

  16. #120
    Member Array rockymtnnut's Avatar
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    Wink

    I was told by a very reliable source that the president of High point doesn't even carry a high point.

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