Lessons learned from shooting with a laser sight (video) - I've got some work to do

This is a discussion on Lessons learned from shooting with a laser sight (video) - I've got some work to do within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 10thmtn Nice vid. More than accurate enough for defensive purposes. Thanks, 10th - I agree, but I have identified some specific problems ...

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Thread: Lessons learned from shooting with a laser sight (video) - I've got some work to do

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post
    Nice vid. More than accurate enough for defensive purposes.
    Thanks, 10th - I agree, but I have identified some specific problems to work on, so hopefully I can get a little bit better groupings at 15 yds.
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  3. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    Nice video! I especially liked the music jazzy music. Also good shooting.
    Thanks Gman - I thought I'd give the music a try - I liked it; glad you did. I think it adds something.

    And thanks for the kind words about the shooting - I've got some work to do.

    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    ...I am still not sold on the laser, as far as my own uses, but I can see the advantage that they offer. Kind of the same as an electronic dot sight, giving the eye only one job to do.
    Yeah, I'm still in the learning stages. I really like shooting with iron sights, but I feel compelled to give the lasers an honest look. They do give you an advantage in a number of scenarios.
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  4. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by 40Bob View Post
    I like that green laser. I have only thus far played with them, and those were weaker red ones.
    Well, you may be on to something there. I'm trying to figure out a way to determine if a laser can be too bright. That's one of the problems I see when shooting the dots like in the video. Sometimes the laser kind of floods the target out. Of course on a threat I doubt it would be an issue. The brighter the laser, the better you see it in brighter daylight, especially the green lasers, but they are very temperature sensitive, they're only good from about 40° to 100°.

    I'm gonna shoot a red one next time I shoot, tomorrow or the Friday or both.
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  5. #19
    VIP Member Array BugDude's Avatar
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    I've given thought to getting a laser for training purposes that could easily be moved from gun to gun, but I've never given any thought to having one on a carry gun.
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  6. #20
    Member Array Eaglebeak's Avatar
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    My "tactical/gadgetry" side loves lasers, and that's why I've got a drawer full of them. However, my "practical/split-second defensive shot" experience finds them bulky, make a CC weapon more difficult to quickly draw, impossible to switch on during a quick-draw/point-shoot situation from CC, a major eye distraction while trying to quickly point-shoot on the move or on a moving target, and a general liability during any split-second draw/fire situation, and that's also why I've got a drawer full of them.

    I've got lumie dots on both my CC pistols that are simple and work very well with fast sight identification (even with 67 year old eyes); but, my CC self-defense practice is strictly confined to drawing and point-shooting two rounds at a paper plate 15 feet away where the sights never even come into play. Aside from past military combat, I never saw my sights during the two times I had to draw and drop a BG during my LE experience because I was not on any kind of tactical or spec/ops team and both were a split-second life/death situations at extremely close range when there was only time to pull and instantly point-shoot without "sighting". If I hadn't been well practiced at point-shooting and had to rely on sighting or spotting a laser dot, I'd have taken a bullet to center-mass instead of to a Zippo (and bad leg wound), and I'd have lost a partner on the other instance.

    Aside from the potential legal aspects of claiming "self defense" when there was enough time and distance to draw, switch on a laser, put the spot on target and fire, my past experience tells me that any justifiable self defense situation in the future isn't going to be any less of a split-second draw/fire instance at very close range anymore than my justifiable LE shootings in the past were.

    Lasers and tac lights may be of great value to some folks for an HD weapon, but my CC pistols are lean, unencumbered, close-range point-shooters.

  7. #21
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    I find the laser aids in shot placement when you are shooting in a nontraditional position say on you back, under a table, hanging your arm around a corner not exposing yourself where you can’t get a sight picture

  8. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglebeak View Post
    My "tactical/gadgetry" side loves lasers, and that's why I've got a drawer full of them. However, my "practical/split-second defensive shot" experience finds them bulky, make a CC weapon more difficult to quickly draw, impossible to switch on during a quick-draw/point-shoot situation from CC, a major eye distraction while trying to quickly point-shoot on the move or on a moving target, and a general liability during any split-second draw/fire situation, and that's also why I've got a drawer full of them.

    I've got lumie dots on both my CC pistols that are simple and work very well with fast sight identification (even with 67 year old eyes); but, my CC self-defense practice is strictly confined to drawing and point-shooting two rounds at a paper plate 15 feet away where the sights never even come into play. Aside from past military combat, I never saw my sights during the two times I had to draw and drop a BG during my LE experience because I was not on any kind of tactical or spec/ops team and both were a split-second life/death situations at extremely close range when there was only time to pull and instantly point-shoot without "sighting". If I hadn't been well practiced at point-shooting and had to rely on sighting or spotting a laser dot, I'd have taken a bullet to center-mass instead of to a Zippo (and bad leg wound), and I'd have lost a partner on the other instance.

    Aside from the potential legal aspects of claiming "self defense" when there was enough time and distance to draw, switch on a laser, put the spot on target and fire, my past experience tells me that any justifiable self defense situation in the future isn't going to be any less of a split-second draw/fire instance at very close range anymore than my justifiable LE shootings in the past were.

    Lasers and tac lights may be of great value to some folks for an HD weapon, but my CC pistols are lean, unencumbered, close-range point-shooters.
    Tactics and gear must be driven by the situation. E.g. you could have had a laser on your gun when you made the split second very close range shots. You just wouldn't use it in that situation.

    The point is, you can do anything with a laser sight on a CC gun that you can do without it. You don't have to use the laser, but it's there if you need it.

    I think you're focusing on lasers that have to be turned on in a motion separate from the draw stroke. Grip type lasers, and there are several manufacturers of them now, come on by just gripping the gun. There is no separate motion required. This is very much like the thumb safety issue on a 1911; it is swiped off as part of the draw stroke rather than a separate motion.

    And, while your specific instance was not one where a laser would help, LE has long recognized the benefit of laser sights. When the threat moves beyond 15 feet, and is only partially disclosed, or one in a situation where the sights or gun can't be brought up to eye level, we have a problem that a laser solves well.

    My carry gun has to serve me in both close and longer ranges. I may be faced with only a partial target, may be just a head at 21 feet. The lighting may be such that sights don't show up clearly - the laser does.

    But, sure if your CC gun is relegated to non-sighted fire at very close ranges then you don't need iron sights or a laser sight.
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  9. #23
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    I found that when I first started using the laser mine did quite a dance around the desired target area too, I also liken it to trigger control... Now after several trips to the range with it, I can easily produce much tighter groups and at a greater distance, along with faster followup shots... One things for sure when you are using a laser... You can easily see what you are doing during the whole trigger pull sequence. Personally I love the laser. My poor old eyes are doing nothing but getting older and poorer, but since I added the laser to my carry guns, my shot placement has done nothing but tighten up tremendously. I have nothing bad to say about um. If I had anything to say on the con side of it, it would be; I'd suggest to make a point to practice with and without the thing so one doesn't become too complaisant with it's use. Oh' great video BTW, really enjoyed it. :had10:
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  10. #24
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    Thanks gottabkiddin, for the kind words on the video.

    I think what you said is what I'm starting to find as well. As a matter of fact, I've already got it on the agenda, I'm gonna shoot at that same 3" dot with irons with all the accuracy I can, and then turn the laser on and shoot a second dot. Just want to see where I am accuracy-wise. I just don't think I can get a sight picture tight enough to match the laser. Not to mention the dot is right on the target so there's only one sighting plane.

    Then maybe next time I'll take a look at speed.

    I can tell you one problem I'm having: the laser is so easy to shoot with, I get overconfident and let down on technique.

    Almost forgot, what kind of laser are you using?
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  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tangle View Post
    Thanks gottabkiddin, for the kind words on the video.

    I think what you said is what I'm starting to find as well. As a matter of fact, I've already got it on the agenda, I'm gonna shoot at that same 3" dot with irons with all the accuracy I can, and then turn the laser on and shoot a second dot. Just want to see where I am accuracy-wise. I just don't think I can get a sight picture tight enough to match the laser. Not to mention the dot is right on the target so there's only one sighting plane.

    Then maybe next time I'll take a look at speed.

    I can tell you one problem I'm having: the laser is so easy to shoot with, I get overconfident and let down on technique.

    Almost forgot, what kind of laser are you using?
    I installed this type on my two J frames Laserlyte. I'm going to swap um out for some CT laser grips, but being new to the whole laser thing and not sure just how viable they really are and I didn't want to invest too much right off the bat. I was able to setup both J frames for the price of one off the CT style grip laser.. I picked um up at my local GS for just over $100 and change a piece.. Now that I'm pretty much sold on um, I'll be adding um to most all my carry guns over the next few months. I do agree that they could easily affect one's technique, but I try to use it in conjunction with my regular practice time as well, so I'm not too concerned with that.. Anyway, as always, thanks again for an interesting thread and video..


    Oh' forgot to mention... I have the S&W Bodyguard that has the integrated insight style laser on it, but due to some kinda problem I'm experiencing with that revolver, it's not being used right now..
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  12. #26
    VIP Member Array 10thmtn's Avatar
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    Tangle - Who makes a grip-style laser that comes on just by gripping the gun normally, other than Crimson Trace?
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  13. #27
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    Very informative. Thanks for taking the time to video and post this.
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  14. #28
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    Good vid and shooting. More than adequate for any defensive situation IMHO. As a civilian, I can't imagine the need for firing multiple shots at that distance, but it's good for practice - so accuracy at closer range would be admirable.

    My next SD pocket gun will have a laser.......

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  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by 10thmtn View Post
    Tangle - Who makes a grip-style laser that comes on just by gripping the gun normally, other than Crimson Trace?
    I know this one does because I called about it yesterday:
    J-Max Side Plate Lasers

    and I think this one,
    https://www.lasermax.com/ProductDeta...0/Default.aspx

    but its unclear that it comes on via grip, but I'm pretty sure it does.
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  16. #30
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    Using the laser I got enough feedback that I learned to hold still on target better. Though I'm not happy yet with my trigger control, I improved.

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