This is a discussion on What Caliber Vs. a Grizzly? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by 9mmHP I was once up in alaska salmon fishing and had a grizz charge me and my fishing partner. He decided to ...
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Whoa, that is serious stuff right there. Were they all hits? If not, what percentage were?Originally Posted by 9mmHP
I talked to a guy who used to own a sporting goods store in Alaska in the 90's and he had plenty of campfire talks about this situation. He said in a purely self defense situation where the bear was charging, a lot of the guys up there would recommend a 10 gauge with slugs. Bear hunting is different, I suppose, with rifles being preferable.
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If you're talking handgun, .44 Magnum.
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Anybody in their right mind would pack no less than a hot loaded 45-70, 375H&H, 338 win mag, or such caliber.
I love my handguns for hunting, but I love my life more. Even a hot loaded little 44 magnum lever gun would be better than a handgun.
See'em on tv is one thing, but it doesn't give you that warm runny feeling going down your leg like when you see one in person. And that warm runny feeling is a symptom of " is this enough gun"?.
Don't be that guy.
Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.
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THIS.
A 12 gauge with slugs is all the bear medicine that you'll ever need in black bear country...but a Gizzly is whole different story. My personal choice would be a Marlin .45-70 lever gun with an 18" barrel, crammed full of the hottest handloads that I can assemble, with the biggest gas-checked solid bullets that I can stack on top of the powder.
When a bear is charging you, there's only two things that you can rely on to stop it. First is a round in it's brain...and you're a fool if you bank on being able to do that while being charged by a bear. (unless you've been charged by bears on multiple occasions, and in that case I'll bow to your superior knowledge) Even if you can put the round on target on it's head, the Grizzly skull is not at all easy to penetrate - theres a LOT of bone in the forehead and the angle of the forehead just makes things worse. Second is a round in the shoulder with enough oomph to shatter the joint. To do either of those things you need a serious amount of penetration - more than a 12 gauge slug can reliably offer.
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If the 45-70 will work the how bout the .458 SOCOM. Same ballistics as the 45-70 in an AR platform Shoots big pills up to 600gns though subsonic. But a 450gn FN would do some serious damage. Then you can have another 10 to follow up with. Top it off with an eotech and you have fast first shot and follow-ups.
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I live near the Custer National Forest in Montana and recently asked a Forest Ranger about self protection in bear country. He recommended Bear Spray over most handguns under .44 caliber. I'm not a hunter, so this may or may not be correct, but the ranger also said the best place to shoot a bear is behind the front shoulder area where a bullet can penetrate the lungs. Of course, if said bear is charging you head on this might prove to be a difficult shot. Me: I carry bear spray and a .40 cal and when a bear is spotted I start walking, not running, the other direction. And when in bear country, and not hunting, it is wise to make a lot of noise as bears generally don't like us humans and most of the time will leave us alone. But if you ever get between a mama Griz and her cubs you can pretty much kiss your behind goodby.
If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.
- Dalai Lama, Tibet
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If I had a penny for every time I've red a post like this go-round I could finally buy that DD BR I've been saving for
IMHO anything short of one of these
_c637708_image_0.jpg
Is futile ..... as even small bruins can take a 45-70 to the chest and STILL get up and run away
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Well, there are some who hunt grizzlies with a bow....to each his own but that is way too up close and personal with one of those beasts. Just the sound they are capable of making sends a chill down my back, I can' imagine stalking and hunting a griz with anything, let alone a bow.
If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.
- Dalai Lama, Tibet
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Bars can run fast.....very fast. At an outdoor survival course I took once, the demonstration of just how fast, went like this.
One of the instructors stood about 40-ft in front of an idling pickup truck, with his back to the truck. His arms were raised over his head. When he dropped his arms, the driver punched it, and before he could turn around and face the oncoming pickup, it flew past him. He turned to us and said: "That's how fast a bear will be on you if you come across-ed one in the woods!"
Adding: "Never run from a bear that is approaching you, in anyway. Walking at you or however it may be coming towards you. Because once you turn your back on that bear, the bear WILL then charging at you, and it WILL catch you! Never turn your back on a bear.....period!"
If a bruin decides to charge from 50-ft or closer, you will....no MIGHT have 1.5-seconds to react.
I was kinda thinking 105 Howitzer.If I had a penny for every time I've red a post like this go-round I could finally buy that DD BR I've been saving for
IMHO anything short of one of these
_c637708_image_0.jpg
Is futile ..... as even small bruins can take a 45-70 to the chest and STILL get up and run away
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Talk a boot open carry
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If it was not a DIRECT HIT ,,,, I still would not want to be in front of the Griz.
"It is better to remain silent and appear stupid, than to speak and remove all doubt."
"I fear the day when technology overlaps with our humanity, and the world will only have
a generation of misinformed idiots," Albert Einstein
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i'd go with .338 myself, mostly because i don't think i could handle anything more powerful than that. and even .338 is pushing it, for me!
how about a Sherman tank - i wouldn't even ask for ammo - just seal me up inside.
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The .45-70 load that I would choose for Grizzly is 540 grains, and should push +/- 1550 FPS. No, that's not plain 'ole SAAMI spec for a .45-70....which is why you need to grab one of those fancy Marlin lever guns. I don't think that there's enough room in a .458 Socom case to stuff in enough powder to match that. Last I saw, .458 Socom only manager about 1000 FPS when you started to get up into the real heavy (550 to 600 grain) bullets.
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Well, now that we're into silly - I just recommend bringing along an acquaintance.
If 'mental illness' is a main cause of gun-grabbing sentiments, then mental illness is the true enemy.
The March of Dimes worked. There's an opportunity there for being pro-active in defense of your rights.
Alternatlvely, please just actually give actual money occasionally.
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