Kahr PM-9 Failure to Battery

This is a discussion on Kahr PM-9 Failure to Battery within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Well, I have a Kahr PM-9 that I bought brand new. The size and accuracy is so good. I shot hundreds of rounds to break ...

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Thread: Kahr PM-9 Failure to Battery

  1. #1
    Member Array gamboolman's Avatar
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    Kahr PM-9 Failure to Battery

    Well, I have a Kahr PM-9 that I bought brand new. The size and accuracy is so good. I shot hundreds of rounds to break it in, cleaned it good, shot it some more. Repeated this for like 1,500 rounds. I was and am willing to give the gun a good break in period. Well I have done that and I am still having Failure to Battery (FTB) occur when I have a full magazine in and fire the 1st shot. I have to lock the slide back and release the slide and it shoots the rest of the magazine just fine. It does this with different magazines, and unfortunately it does it with all different kinds of high $/Quality ammo, not just cheap Wolf or discount ammo.

    I bought this gun to carry it as my primary CCW weapon, and I must be able to depend upon it 100%. If I don't have confidence in any weapon, it is a gone pecan.

    I am in the process of sending it back to Kahr now. I will give the factory a chance to make it right. I hope they do as I love the size of the gun and it shoots so good.

    My question to all of the people who have had PM-9's and had this problem - Is the factory going to fix it so that I will be able to have confidence in the gun and be able to carry it as my primary CCW?

    Thanks for any feedback.

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  3. #2
    Member Array estimber's Avatar
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    Perhaps you need to apply more oil for lubricating? Although, I have a PM9 and have never had that problem. I did have a P40 (early production model) and it was plagued with the same problem. In that case there was a problem with Kahr not millng the barrel properly to releive enough material from the barrel hood. When the pistol would cycle the slide would get stuck (aka jammed) in the rearward position (at that point it was just metal to metal jammed together). I sent it back to Kahr and they relieved metal from the barrel hood and the problem went away.

    The only factory recall that I am aware of with the PM9 was a possible problem within a specific S/N range regarding the polishing of the feed ramp. My PM9 fell within the reported S/N range but I never had any problems with mine. I sent the barrel only back to Kahr and within 5 days, it was returned. I have had ZERO problems with my Kahr since I have had it. One thing is for sure, Kahr has excellent customer service and whatever the problem is, they will make it right.
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  4. #3
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamboolman View Post
    Well I have done that and I am still having Failure to Battery (FTB) occur when I have a full magazine in and fire the 1st shot. I have to lock the slide back and release the slide and it shoots the rest of the magazine just fine.
    I'm reviewing a PM9 right now, for possible concealed carry. Same thing, here, in that it often has a FTF on the first round of a full magazine. Not frequently, but enough to be a pain and shake my confidence. I think it's tied to the same thing that's inhibiting first-round feeding when I manually swap magazines and rack the slide, which coughs up a FTF about 30% of the time. Might well be a simple need to polish the ramp and barrel mouth; might be something else.

    Now, that said, I tend to be very patient when it comes to break-in periods. An all-steel Browning BDM 9mm that I broke in some years ago required a long, long time before it fed everything. By which time, it then fed everything perfectly for tens of thousands of rounds. That was reliable. About 99.5%, as it turned out, once the initial 5000 rounds were put through it; about 99.99% after the first 10000 rounds; and 100% the last 10000 rounds I owned it. Amazing that it took so long to break-in. Was worried at the time, but it just kept getting better and better. That gun's feed ramp, approach angles from the magazine to the chamber, and other features were different than the PM9's, of course.

    The PM9 is certainly much shorter. The angle of the feed ramp is much more steep. Is it the magazine springs? Is it the lips on the magazine that allow a bullet nose to dip at just the wrong time? I have noticed that the top bullet in a magazine tends to be let loose from the feed lips such that the nose turns down. If this were to occur during feeding, it could certainly hang up the nose on the feed ramp. Would polishing the ramp cure this? Dunno.
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  5. #4
    Member Array stmichps's Avatar
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    Try this: When you load your magazine short it one round and see if you still have this problem. It might be a magazine problem where you got to much tension on the initial round for it feeds properly.

  6. #5
    Member Array Double Naught Spy's Avatar
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    I have two PM9s and experienced the same problems. I don't have a good answer for you guys except to say that I noticed I never had a problem with my Rem Golden Saber 124 gr. +P ammo. I have now tested both guns with 250 rounds each and have had zero return to battery after firing problems (except for when I have hit the slide release into the locked position during firing...my fault, not the guns'). Shooting regular Blazer, Winchester white box, and Fed American Eagle red box, I have return to battery issues.

    FYI, Sportsmansguide.com has Rem Golden Saber 124 gr+P ammo For $160 for 500 rounds, slightly less if you are a member, then plus shipping. http://www.sportsmansguide.com/cb/cb.asp?a=235602

    I know it isn't the cheapest way to go and the guns should work without +P, but that is the only thing I have found to remedy the problem. I have tried different lube, different non+P ammos, and polished the feed ramps...and nada benefit...until using +P.

  7. #6
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    My PM9 had the same problem with all ammo, 6 different brands. I never found one that would function with a full clip. They wanted me to cut a revolution out of the magazine spring, I don't think so. Its not the only gun that won't function with a full clip, however it should. I took mine back bought a Glock 26 and never looked back. The PM carries better but what good is it if you can't rely on it. The PM9 should be better quality gun for $600 IMO.

    J.S.

  8. #7
    Member Array gamboolman's Avatar
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    Update on FTB - Kahr PM-9

    I have been in discussion with Kahr and Ms. Dottie at Kahr. She has been great and I am encouraged at the response from her. I am having the gun sent back to Kahr tomorow at their expense. I have given Kahr detailed description of the FTB problem, but they are well aware of the problem. My gun is a serial # in the 1100's. I have read that the new ones don't have this problem?? I bought the gun in late April of this year. But as we all know this problem is not acceptable for a expensive new gun.

    Anyway I will keep the board posted on the "Kahr Club Saga". The size and how well the gun shoots is great - if it can just funciton and be dependable as a primary CCW.

    in the meantime, I am going to buy a Glock 26. I will see about the Kahr when it comes back from the factory. But at this point I have zero confidence in it. It will have to earn the confidence back by a few thousand rounds when I get it back.

    Thanks for all of the replies and suggestions.

    gamboolman....

  9. #8
    Member Array floridaguy911's Avatar
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    I think you will like the 26 Gambool. My GF owns a 26, and I currently own a 27 (.40) and I really like it. I too, like yourself, originally was attracted to the size of the little Kahrs. My GF and I went to the range one day, and rented a P9 (i believe, all metal, not fullsize but not subcompact either, in between) EVERYTIME, on a full magazine (approx. 15 mags total through it in that one session), it would refuse to go all the way into battery unless I manually smacked the rear of the slide in. It would stop app. 1/4- 1/2" prior to battery. It did it so often during just one range trip that turned me off of the Kahrs immediately. Turns out from reading forums.. its not "just one" instance. It happens quite frequently it seems. I still love the size of the little Kahr, especially the PM, but not at the expense of confidence.

    However, I have heard that the Newer PMs have been improved, although I do not know that to be true through hearsay or personal experience.
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    Member Array Whirlwind06's Avatar
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    I don't own a Kahr. When I took my CHL class one of the other students had a Kahr and it did the samething. I didn't give it much thought at the time. But I keep seeing these posts here and on THR.

    It seems that Kahr will pay for the shipping a few times but after that they want the owner to pay. Sad to see such a pricey pistol with problems.

    Sure will makes me think twice before buying one.

  11. #10
    Member Array Double Naught Spy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamboolman View Post
    I have been in discussion with Kahr and Ms. Dottie at Kahr. She has been great and I am encouraged at the response from her. I am having the gun sent back to Kahr tomorow at their expense. I have given Kahr detailed description of the FTB problem, but they are well aware of the problem. My gun is a serial # in the 1100's. I have read that the new ones don't have this problem?? I bought the gun in late April of this year. But as we all know this problem is not acceptable for a expensive new gun.
    The newer ones do have the problem as mine are in the 5000s.

    Your gun will come back from Kahr with a new recoil spring, polished feed ramp, and if you have one with the serial number in this range, VA0003--VA9999, you will get a new barrel. At least that seems to be the standard of what happens for PM9s with this sort of problem when sent back to Kahr. Based on what I have seen, you have about an 80% change of the problem being rectified, but it is far from being absolute.

  12. #11
    Member Array gamboolman's Avatar
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    Angry Kahr Club - Saga - Status Report

    Kahr Club Status Report

    I talked to Dottie at Kahr again today. I explained that Kahr has 1 chance to get it right and then I will be going after a full refund.

    I am getting more aggravated as time and expense goes on. Today was a goat roping as Fed-X made a huge deal out of shipping the gun. So I spent hours getting that worked out.

    Anyway the guns on the way to the factory, and we'll see.

    As I explained to Ms. Dottie, I will not carry any weapon that I don't trust 100% and thats that. To Ms. Dottie's and Kahr credit, she agreed that if I get the gun back and it has FTB problems again, then the next thing will be for me to send it back and get a full refund. But what a hassle !!

    Thanks for the replies from all the posters.
    I will keep the board and on THR posted.

    Thanks, gamboolman....
    Last edited by gamboolman; September 9th, 2006 at 01:00 PM.

  13. #12
    Member Array rangemeister's Avatar
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    Kahr PM9

    I have owned several Kahr pistols and have had no problems except with a Tactical 40 I bought. The customer service was outstanding, but I never got the gun right and decided to sell it. My PM9 functioned flawlessly and now I carry a P40 and love it. I know the feeling of insecurity. I am sorry to hear to have had these problems with what I consider to be a fine pistol. Just my 02.

    Go figure, FEDEX hassled me about shipping as well. Do they hire half wits or what? Took a call to HQ to get the gun picked up and then it happened again witht he same driver.

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