Kimber 1911s not working out for SWAT cops.

This is a discussion on Kimber 1911s not working out for SWAT cops. within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; JD you beat me to it. The department I assure you did not pay anywhere near $2000 for a Kimber. Here is the Kimber price ...

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Thread: Kimber 1911s not working out for SWAT cops.

  1. #16
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    JD you beat me to it.

    The department I assure you did not pay anywhere near $2000 for a Kimber. Here is the Kimber price list for one of the LE distributors I purchase from.

    Kimber Custom TLE-II
    GT Price: $889.95

    Kimber Custom TLE-RL II
    GT Price: $979.95

    Kimber Custom TLE-RL II Stainless
    GT Price: $1,109.95

    Kimber Desert Warrior .45
    GT Price: $1,259.95

    Kimber Pro Carry II
    GT Price: $869.95

    Kimber Stainless Pro Carry II
    GT Price: $939.95

    Kimber Super Carry Ultra Pistol
    GT Price: $1,329.95

    Kimber Super Carry Ultra+™ .45 ACP
    GT Price: $1,329.95

    Kimber Warrior .45 with Night Sights
    GT Price: $1,259.95
    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

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  3. #17
    VIP Member Array Superhouse 15's Avatar
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    I'd have to look for the exact model. It was black over FDE with a rail for a light. As for the Serpa, a lot of departments around here mandate them for plainclothes carry. I have never used one personally, and I probably wouldn't, but somebody in Purchasing somewhere must like them. They are the only department I know of using +p ammo around here.
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  4. #18
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    I was just thinkin about getting a Kimber Ultra TLE II LG. but from all the posts here Im second guessing now. It's just so purtyyyy

  5. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superhouse 15 View Post
    I'd have to look for the exact model. It was black over FDE with a rail for a light. As for the Serpa, a lot of departments around here mandate them for plainclothes carry. I have never used one personally, and I probably wouldn't, but somebody in Purchasing somewhere must like them. They are the only department I know of using +p ammo around here.


    It could be anything, either a TLE RL II w/ a different finish, a Warrior or Desert Warrior or one of the other Tactical models, as for the +P, looking at the data from Speer, it looks pretty good.



    There are a lot of agencies that ban the Serpa, and a lot of agencies that still mandate it. 6 of 1, half a dozen of the other.

  6. #20
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    In regards to Serpas it has gone back and forth. The index finger is extended, presses the release button and the gun is drawn. The key is not to let your finger continue on into the trigger guard until the gun is indexed on the target or at least away from your body. This problem seems mainly to occur with single action autos like the 1911.

    Goes back to that safety thing I read somewhere. Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot.
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    "A first rate man with a third rate gun is far better than the other way around". The gun is a tool, you are the craftsman that makes it work. There are those who say "if I had to do it, I could" yet they never go out and train to do it. Don't let stupid be your mindset. Harryball 2013

  7. #21
    JD
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacman605 View Post
    In regards to Serpas it has gone back and forth. The index finger is extended, presses the release button and the gun is drawn. The key is not to let your finger continue on into the trigger guard until the gun is indexed on the target or at least away from your body. This problem seems mainly to occur with single action autos like the 1911.

    Goes back to that safety thing I read somewhere. Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot.
    And Glocks, and M&Ps....ahhh heck lets just not got there....

  8. #22
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    Excuse me while I pick the hulls out of my teeth.
    oneshot likes this.
    Retired USAF E-8. Remember: You're being watched!
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  9. #23
    Senior Member Array Rotorblade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Let's not get started on the MIM stuff again. A poorly-made bar stock machining will fail just as quickly as a poorly-made MIM piece. If MIM by itself was so bad, we wouldn't be using it as much as we do in aerospace applications. Oh, and forged parts are always better than cast, right? Ahem... Browning switched from forged to cast to eliminate a cracking problem with machined, forged slides on their .40 S&W HiPowers.

    Bottom line is, look beyond just the material fabrication process for causes of failures.
    Forgings do have much better mechanical properties than castings. Usually when someone switches to a casting from a previously forged part it's almost always to get cost out of the product.

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  10. #24
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    Personally I had a bad experience with Kimber Tactical three years ago. Never again, after I bought Ed Brown .... never looked back for another 1911.

    Vodek
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  11. #25
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    I don't care about the price. LEO's (the good ones LOL...j/k) should have what is needed. But I fail to see how on earth someone picked Kimber over other firearms. Not Kimber bashing (never owned one but fired them , got 2 friends that have them) but from what I read and friends tell me they are not worth the money.
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  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rotorblade View Post
    Forgings do have much better mechanical properties than castings.
    Right up until you start machining across the grain flow.

    And one modest step past Metal Injection Molding is the HIP (hot isostatic press) process... which finds its way into those benign duties like jet engine compressor disks.

    Usually when someone switches to a casting from a previously forged part it's almost always to get cost out of the product.
    Yep, I bet Browning switched to a cast slide to take the cost out of replacing all those machined, forged slides that would have cracked.

    Castings are, in general, cheaper than forgings because you can't get near-net-shape with bar stock like you can with a casting, and therefore you have to spend more machine time whittling away material that you end up throwing out. Anybody here like Rugers? Nearly every Ruger handgun frame is a casting. A very good casting, indeed, and I doubt anyone turns their nose up at a Super Redhawk or an Alaskan because the frame is "just" a casting.

    Bottom line is that the material and its properties (elasticity as well as strength, plus other properties) simply have to be sufficient for the intended use of the product.
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    VIP Member Array multistage's Avatar
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    My Custom II Stainless has yet to grenade. Heck, I REALLY live fast and loose sometimes:

    I carry it. God help me.
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  14. #28
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    There is nothing wrong with a ANY Kimber that a...Springfield Operator won't fix! And Serpa holsters are no more dangerous than a chainsaw. If you don't know how to USE it, it'll kill ya'!
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  15. #29
    Senior Member Array Rotorblade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gasmitty View Post
    Right up until you start machining across the grain flow.

    And one modest step past Metal Injection Molding is the HIP (hot isostatic press) process... which finds its way into those benign duties like jet engine compressor disks.



    Yep, I bet Browning switched to a cast slide to take the cost out of replacing all those machined, forged slides that would have cracked.

    Castings are, in general, cheaper than forgings because you can't get near-net-shape with bar stock like you can with a casting, and therefore you have to spend more machine time whittling away material that you end up throwing out. Anybody here like Rugers? Nearly every Ruger handgun frame is a casting. A very good casting, indeed, and I doubt anyone turns their nose up at a Super Redhawk or an Alaskan because the frame is "just" a casting.

    Bottom line is that the material and its properties (elasticity as well as strength, plus other properties) simply have to be sufficient for the intended use of the product.
    Just to clarify...... If you're machining across the grain flow you ordered the wrong forging. You have to know how you're going to machine the part before you you specify out the forged material.
    I agree that castings are suitable for many applications and my company uses them whenever the application can tolerate them, and we do it to remain competitive, not because they are better.
    I'm no metalurgist but I have been a Quality Engineer/Manager in the aerospace industry for over 30 years including a stint with one of your competitors (Being in Arizona and knowing about fan blades and metallurgy I have a good idea where you work!)
    Anyway, I agree with 95 percent of what you said!
    Cheers

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  16. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rotorblade View Post
    J
    I'm no metalurgist but I have been a Quality Engineer/Manager in the aerospace industry for over 30 years including a stint with one of your competitors (Being in Arizona and knowing about fan blades and metallurgy I have a good idea where you work!)
    Anyway, I agree with 95 percent of what you said!
    Cheers
    We're on the same page, brother. BTW, I got my start in the biz out east in a metallurgical lab, with a couple of intermediate steps (all in the same line) before I ended up in the desert.
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