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Plastic fantastic vs the 1911...yep I'm going there.

9K views 75 replies 33 participants last post by  nightsonge 
#1 ·
So which is better... Well for me the XD or the M&P or even a glock (even though they are ugly as sin)... The operative word here is for me. Don't get me wrong... 1911's are absolutely beautiful handguns with a ton of history but I base my self defense choices on function not nostalgia... And for a pistol that large and heavy I'll have more than 8+1 thank you.

If you like your 1911 and it works well... Awesome... I'm glad you have a great gun that works for you.. Really I mean that.

Let's look at this from the point of view of a perspective first handgun buyer coming on to DC asking what's a good reliable affordable and concealable pistol? The most common response would probably be the Glock 19...and we all know why right? I would bet practically no one would suggest the 1911... and after a bit of time here I think I know why.

First: The 1911 market is like a minefield, with everyone and their brother making 1911's of different qualities and price points that don't necessarily follow one another... yes Kimber I'm talking about you. Once someone asks which 1911 to buy everyone that has one that works speaks up.. My Kimber works great... My philippino wonder works great... My Ruger works great... My SA works great... Only buy the Colt... Even the Taurus pt1911 would get a vote or two, and the layperson can't see the forest (err quality 1911's) for the trees.

Second: reliability... This may sting and if you have a good one refer to the second statement in my post. Reliability with 1911's occurs when a lot of metal parts are machined to very tight tolerances and sometimes requiring hand fitting... This requires more labor cost which in turn means higher msrp... But sometimes even then the manufacturer is known to not get it right... Talking to you again Kimber. It's my humble opinion that when major instructors put out videos betting full refunds that any 1911 can't complete a course without hiccup... That's a bad thing!

Subcompact 1911s Just don't work well.... - YouTube

I also recently posted a thread asking people to tell me about their out of the box lemons... 1911's had quite a showing.

http://www.defensivecarry.com/forum...148654-tell-me-about-your-out-box-lemons.html

15 times the 1911 made the list of slightly over 50 entries... Doesn't prove to much as I would have hoped to get a larger sample but oh well. Almost a third of the entries including 2 Colts, 2 SA's and 3 Kimbers.

Further I can remember reading a few recent "I got a new 1911" threads and the common theme between them all was the parts that would get changed out of the box... From the plastic main spring housing on the colt to the mim parts on the Kimber, it blows me away.

I will say the sr1911 seems to do pretty well.

So maybe one day when I have 700 dollars lying around and I don't have anything else to buy on my list I would own a Sr1911 I think... It is pretty and 1911's are fun to shoot but I personally would not carry it, simply because there are smaller lighter higher capacity choices in my arsenal.

I look forward to your thoughts especially if you disagree with me, I would ask you to remember this is only my opinion and to refrain from simply dismissing me as clueless.
 
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#46 ·
I guess I'm unique as I see distinct roles for each pistol and get a little angry every time someone starts one of these threads to proclaim that their choice is the correct one and the people on the other side are wrong... and people on both sides do it.

I personally carry both professionally. When on duty have a Glock on my hip (compact at that, I prefer the 19/23 size to the 17/22). There are several reasons why that's my choice but chief among them is capacity. When I may be alone and knowingly going into harm's way I like knowing that I have 13+1 in the gun and 2 17 rounders in reserve on my person. But when I'm wearing the black uniform I have a STI 1911 on my thigh. This is the case for a couple of reasons, but primarily because I can get quality shots on target faster with a 1911 than I can with anything else. Since using the pistol likely means that things have gone bad and then my long gun stopped working, every fraction of a second is important.

When I'm not working I usually carry the Glock. However, that's a very recent change. Until about 2 months ago the 1911 was the off duty gun. I changed simply because I wanted to try a new holster and fell in love with it. I don't have one for the 1911 and don't know if I will get one. I found a way to make the Glock 23 carry the way I want a concealed firearm to carry so I'm happy. But if I should happen to find myself someplace with an active shooter where a very accurate long shot is required I'll regret the decision. I can shoot the Glock very well, but it is still second to the 1911.

As far as reliability, I have several guns and only have one that has ever had a problem. It is a S&W model 66. I get light strikes with the danged thing from time to time leading to a click rather than a boom.
 
#47 ·
Hmmm...A new mainspring might be in order for that Smith & Wesson Model 66. That or else check to see if the mainspring strain screw has been backed out or shortened; both being a not-so-clever trick used in an effort to make the action feel lighter.
 
#48 ·
I will second the mainspring screw, I have run into a couple where tightening the screw eliminated the light strikes. Anyone wanting to lighten the trigger pull on a S&W revolver should get the recoil slide spring kit from Wolff, by changing that spring you will get a very nice trigger pull without affecting the reliability.
 
#49 ·
I carry a 1911 everyday a Colt Stainless Steel Combat Commander XSE,I carry 2 spare mags and I can hit what I shoot at,the 1911 isn't for everyone since most people don't shoot or practice with their carry gun every week,drawing swiping safety off shooting,re-engage safety re-holster,repeat.
A lot of shooters don't want any safety on a gun they may forget to take off in a Stressful SD situation and that mistake could get them killed,by the same token my wife likes the M&P 45c,
Also not all 1911's only hold 8 rounds,some are double stacks and can carry as many rounds as compact polymer guns,
 
#51 ·
Hey Doodle, you should take a walk on the wild side. it seems like a lot of the 1911 guys responding to your OP will openly admit to shooting polymer as well. Maybe you should cross over for awhile and see what you think. Get you a 1911 in the originally intended caliber and take it for a spin. You might scare yourself and find that you like it. The personal shame of appreciating the platform would pass quickly I believe.
 
#52 ·
Oh I've had a couple... I shoot them well, but I've had my share of issues leading to me swearing them off.
 
#54 ·
I shoot both polymer and a version of a 1911. Depending on what I am doing, ect dictates which gun I choose. I carry similar guns with a 1911 style safety for familiarity. As long as I can hit what I am shooting at I consider my choice acceptable. Why really worry about what others carry?
 
#55 ·
It needs a new mainspring, no doubt about it. The gun was my mom's duty gun back in her police days. My stepdad thought he was quite the gunsmith and did exactly as you suggest. If the gun were anything more than a safe queen that manages to head to the range once a year or so I'd work on making it right. As it is, I'm not too concerned. Thanks for the post though, good chance that may help someone that comes across one of these second hand one day.
 
#58 ·
I have over a dozen pistols (CZ, Glock, Sig, Ruger, Colt) including one 1911 (Colt LW Commander). Some have had minor break-in issues when brand new, but none have had any failures since and most I've shot thousands of times. I have Glocks and Sigs with over 5,000 error-free rounds down range. I have had one stinker, a Kahr P380 that never ran right. I even gave it over 1,000 rounds, but still had at least one jam per box of ammo. Like most folks here, I like my pistols to be 100% reliable........, but I think it's Clint Smith that says that ANY gun can malfunction precisely at the wrong time and that we all have to know how to resolve the problem. One thing I have learned is to NEVER sell a reliable pistol. Many folks here have had unreliable handguns and nothing is more frustrating.......
 
#59 ·
The absolute definition of irony... I saw one of these today in person. Online photos of this finish can't do it justice... It is that beautiful and Molon Labe means come and take it. I am VERY seriously thinking about convincing the wife to let me spend $1200...flame away 1911 dudes.
Firearm Gun Trigger Gun barrel Air gun
 
#61 ·
One thing I like about carrying my steel 1911 vs my poly M&P is if I ever need to use the gun as a bludgeoning device, the 1911 is much better suited for that task. I wouldn't want to get hit with either, but the weight of the 1911 would make it much easier to knock someone unconcious.

The absolute definition of irony... I saw one of these today in person. Online photos of this finish can't do it justice... It is that beautiful and Molon Labe means come and take it. I am VERY seriously thinking about convincing the wife to let me spend $1200...flame away 1911 dudes.
View attachment 63254
Nothing to flame for IMHO. There is no written rule that states a "1911 guy" (what is that anyways?) can't buy polymer, revolvers, or a frigging French muzzleloading duel pistol if he so chooses and vice versa. We ALL need to realize we are "GUN people" and we best stay united cause the anti's are hammering away at us every day.

In regards to the Sig, two things I don't like about them. 1. External extractors (not what the 1911 was intended to have) 2. Dimensions are not normal 1911 dimensions so holsters can be tricky to find.
 
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#64 ·
All handguns are a compromise. The question is just which compromises you wish to make. Some people make decisions that bring them to a plastic gun. Some make decisions that bring them to a 1911. Some end up with a DA/SA auto. It is a personal choice (unless you carry a gun for a living and are told what you'll carry). In the end we put way too much emphasis on what weapon we, or anyone else, carries.

In reality the Indian is much more important than the arrow.
 
#63 ·
I love the 1911 feels great in my hand, visually pleasing, the 45 is a hard hitting round, big bullets, many perks for many people. I can't shoot one worth a darn. I grab a glock, feels like a brick, square and ugly. The full size glock in 45 way too big for my hand. But the g19 or g17 size frames I can shoot the lights out.

I love everything about the 1911 but my skill level with one is sub par so for me I carry a glock. Again its ugly and square but I have carried one on duty and concealed and have had nothing to complain about as far as function.

For several years I was my departments range master running quarterly qualifications. We carried the glock 40 sw, I saw thousands of rounds go down range, big guys, little guys, women, and even some sissies who didn't even like to shoot, their glocks all functioned without fail.

So for me I carry a glock for those reasons, I won't discount the 1911 again Ive had several, I like them a lot and wish I could get the results I get with the glocks but its not in the cards so I will just carry my plastic gun and feel confident.
 
#67 ·
The 1911 trigger is what intrigues me......., but that dang manual safety sets me off. I mostly carry 45acp pistols and currently have 4, a Colt LW Commander without night sights, Glock30sf and (2) Sigs (P220R and P220 Gen 2). I'll admit that I hate the Glock 30 trigger. After shooting my Sigs and Colt it feels so rough and uncivilized. I've been carrying my Sigs now for over 2 years. To me, they offer the best compromise between a Glock and a 1911 in that there is the first heavy trigger pull (serves as a good safety for me) and then the following short 4.4lb single action (very similar to a 1911). Recently though I've been looking at an Ed Brown carry pistol.....Gad they make beautiful pistols! Thinking of trading my Glocks..... I should never have visited Ed's website.....
 
#68 ·
The thumb safety doesn't bother me a bit. I shot 1911 variants & Browning (FN) Hi-powers for so long that my thumb just naturally sweeps down the thumb safety, even if it...isn't THERE! I probably even "flick-down" my GLOCK, my M&P. and possibly my revolvers (if I ever watched my draw in slow-motion). It's simply pure habit & muscle memory. :biggrin2:
 
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#69 ·
I'll take the 1911 trigger over the current popular triggers that so many pistols wear. The safety is a non-issue.

I'm more intrigued by some of the DA/SA designs like SIGs and such. Don't have any but might sample one.
 
#70 ·
#71 ·
I sure cant agree with any arguement that the 1911 is any less reliable than any other handgun, so long as we narrow it down to the SA, Colt, or maybe Kimber. This just has not proven to be true in my testing and use.

However, I really do like the Glock for all reasons. It is boringly reliable, chambered for the powerful 10mm, and can digest high pressure loads with ease and no apparent sign of excessive wear and tear.

If the weather is bad, or if I am in rugged terrain, I will carry one without the worry of scratching , or damaging it.

The Colt could deal with the same conditions, but I think it would hurt my feelings if it got dinged up.
 
#72 ·
All Stainless Steel 1911 preferably a Colt for me. I've tried a few others even have one now in blue and it just doesn't fit my need/want in a carry gun. IMHO plastic is for toys, like I said, just MY opinion, please don't flame me. BUT, I prefer a revolver for carry, due ti simplicity.
 
#73 ·
I admit I didn't read the whole thread, so I apologize if this idea has already been put forward. It's quite simple really. For me, there is no "1911 vs Glock." I own 1911s and I own Glocks. The only 1911 I have ever had any problems with was an old Norinco. Norinco 1911s make a great starting platform for customization, but left as is, it is (or at least was) pretty much the worst offender of any semi auto, and I certainly would never bet my life on one. I have never had any issues with any of my Glocks, buy hey, they're Glocks, so you expect perfect performance.
 
#74 ·
There is nothing wrong owning a 1911. I have several and love shooting them. In their heyday they were the gun to have. However, the times and technology have changed and their are better choices. I am not knocking carrying one but personally fell there are better choices. With the advancement in handguns, you can get a smaller, lighter firearm with equal or higher round capacity. Remember, you always want to have superior firepower.
 
#76 ·
I see this one as a non issue, as I don't trust 1911's out of the box, of course I also don't trust Glocks out of the box, nor revolvers out of the box. My mindset has always been, "If you're going to trust your life to a gun, SHOOT the gun, VERIFY that is is both accurate and reliable, and DECIDE if you are willing to trust your life to THAT PARTICULAR gun."

Every manufacturer CAN and HAS produced lemons, and every size, style, and design of gun has both it's sterling and it's crappy examples.

Shoot, verify, decide, That's your responsibility with any gun you own and use for self defense or defense of home, if you don't trust it's reliability or accuracy, then trade it off for something else, or get it fixed so you can trust it.

While some manufacturers are definitely better than others, and I'll even concede that a Glock today has a much higher chance of being ready Out of the box than a 1911, That personal responsibility doesn't change from one manufacturer to another. It's the same for each gun you own and use for defense.

That being said, I buy guns I like and go from there. I like my 1991A1 .45, though when I get the cash I'd like one just a bit smaller than the full size version I have, I like my Bersa Thunder 40 Ultra compact pro, it's my usual carry gun, I like my Taurus 605 Stainless steel .357 revolver snubnose, "though it's got one heck of a kick" which usually goes in my offhand pocket, I like my Bersa thunder .380 deluxe, which used to be my run to the store gun, "now it's the .357" I like my old 6 inch barreled vent ribbed Taurus 669 .357, though it's really too big to carry, it was my first gun, and I've taken several deer with it.

I've shot and verified that all these are accurate and reliable enough that I'm willing to trust my life to them, I've also got guns stored away and labeled as to what's wrong with them, or why I don't trust them, like my little RG .22, which even if you discount the caliber, does a fine job firing 6 shots, provided you're willing to pull the trigger 18 times. Just as an example.

I don't on the other hand like plastic guns, that's not to say they aren't good guns, just not my personal preference. but, I've found if you don't like a gun, you don't like to take it out and shoot it, ergo less practice, which makes the gun a less optimum choice for defense.
Just my 2 cents
 
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