CCO availability and quality - who makes 'em?

CCO availability and quality - who makes 'em?

This is a discussion on CCO availability and quality - who makes 'em? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; It's been years, but I find myself in need of a new CCW. My full-sized 1911 has been great and conceals fairly well, but I've ...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 43
Like Tree9Likes

Thread: CCO availability and quality - who makes 'em?

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    2,292

    CCO availability and quality - who makes 'em?

    It's been years, but I find myself in need of a new CCW. My full-sized 1911 has been great and conceals fairly well, but I've carried enough to know I can do better. Something a bit lighter, a bit smaller, but without sacrificing use of one of the 'Big 3' calibers (9mm, .40 S&W, .45ACP). Once again I'm drawn to the CCO type 1911.

    I'm trying to gather a list of who all makes CCOs and what their reputations are. I'm nixing outright the Nighthawk and Wilson Combat offerings due to price ($3k+ for a 1911 isn't jiving with me). Below is what I've found so far and what others have pointed out to me.

    Kimber Compact Stainless II ($950-ish)
    Kimber Compact CDP II ($1150-ish)
    Dan Wesson CCO ($1400-1500)
    STI Guardian (about $1000)
    Custom Fusion CCO (about $1400-1500, most of the extras I don't want so the build would be fairly basic)
    Les Baer Stinger ($1400-1600 used)
    Sig Sauer RCS ($900-1000)

    Personal thoughts so far. Kimber's aluminum frames worry me and they evidently still show the Cohen influence (serious questions about their quality). The DW gun looks fantastic and has a good reputation. I don't know much about STI except that they're highly thought-of in competition circles. Fusion looks to be a solid option in general. Les Baer Stinger I see fairly often on 1911-centric sites; hopefully it's just buyer's remorse or need of funds versus a reflection on the gun itself. Sig's RCS meets the definitions of what I'm looking for, but Sig has been anything but stellar of late and I don't know if their 1911s, in particular their RCS, are up to snuff yet. Time will tell I suppose.

    Does that about cover it? Any preferences among the list?
    Last edited by BAC; January 21st, 2013 at 10:25 PM.
    RIP, Jeff Dorr: 1964 - July 17, 2009. You will be missed.


    Defensive Carry Search Tips


    Step 1 - Choose a subforum on right side under "Search in Forum(s)"
    Step 2 - Type general topic of interest in "Search by Keyword" textbox.
    Step 3 - Read results and refine/repeat as necessary.


  2. #2
    Distinguished Member Array deadguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    1,885

    CCO availability and quality - who makes 'em?

    I currently have a Fusion CCO in 10mm. A real gem it has been for me. I had a Dan Wesson CCO. Great pistol as well. I would recommend either, but you can get the DW a lot quicker.

    Colt also has a CCO available. STI has been putting out quality pieces from the stories told.

    Les Baer Stinger. Don't count this one out. I've seen these going for the same amount as some DWs. A gently used Baer will serve you well.

    You may also consider a lightweight commander with a bobbed or round-butt grip. I switched from a CCO to a round-butt lwt commander and I don't notice a difference in conceal ability due to grip length. Breaking that corner makes a gun difference IMO. For this option, there are many.
    There's nothing like a funeral to make you feel alive

  3. #3
    Member Array Randall757's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    virginia
    Posts
    102
    Are colts not on the list? There are some great colts out there especially the 70 series concealed carry officers. Smith & Wesson has a compact 1911 that size also.
    R
    When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array high pockets's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Georgia for now
    Posts
    4,998
    Take a look at the CZ75 Compact.
    "If you make something idiot proof, someone will make a better idiot."

    - Anon

  5. #5
    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Southwest
    Posts
    3,150

    Sig Compact RCS 1911

    Sig makes a compact frame 1911 called the Compact RCS. Of course it has an aluminum frame.

    1911 Compact RCS Nitron

    kmagnuss likes this.
    Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the Peoples' Liberty's Teeth." - George Washington

  6. #6
    VIP Member
    Array archer51's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    22,369
    According to CZ site, the height of the CCO is 1/2" shorter than the Commander. CZ/DW quality is top notch. I know how I'd go.
    Freedom doesn't come free. It is bought and paid for by the lives and blood of our men and women in uniform.

    USAF Retired
    NRA Life Member

  7. #7
    Distinguished Member Array bigmacque's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    1,883
    There are some Springfield EMP's available for right around a grand. I've seen .40 cal's on Gunbroker for $995.00, and personally like the Springfield platform. I have the micro compact GI.45, my avatar, that I carry routinely.
    I'm in favor of gun control -- I think every citizen should have control of a gun.
    1 Thess. 5:16-18

  8. #8
    VIP Member Array ghost tracker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Ky Backwoods
    Posts
    5,130
    Another vote for CZ/Dan Wesson & Sig Compact RCS as my CCO variants of first choice.
    There are only TWO kinds of people in this world; those who describe the world as filled with two kinds of people...and those who don't.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Array Chuck R.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Leavenworth, KS
    Posts
    663
    I’ve got a Les Baer “Stinger” which is their CCO:



    Very reliable and accurate, should be under 2K now.

    Chuck
    deadguy likes this.
    homo homini lupus est

  10. #10
    VIP Member Array BAC's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Tampa, FL
    Posts
    2,292
    Colt CCO - are they still available? I can't find pricing or availability anywhere on Colt's website. Used ones hover around $1k it seems.

    The Les Baer Stinger looks like an option, but at $2k I'd definitely be looking for a used one. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll add that to the OP. The Sig RCS I'll have to read a bit more on from owners/users; that external extractor interests me since they had such a poor reputation in the past.

    Bigmacque, I'd consider the EMP if I was more certain of its reliability and useability. Baby 1911s seem to have more problems than full-sized weapons, or did last I was looking for 1911s.

    The input's appreciated guys, keep it coming!
    RIP, Jeff Dorr: 1964 - July 17, 2009. You will be missed.


    Defensive Carry Search Tips


    Step 1 - Choose a subforum on right side under "Search in Forum(s)"
    Step 2 - Type general topic of interest in "Search by Keyword" textbox.
    Step 3 - Read results and refine/repeat as necessary.

  11. #11
    Member Array Kadonny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Malvern PA
    Posts
    140
    Dan Wesson CCO hands down. Just do some reading on that gun, it will amaze you. An almost custom 1911 for a very reasonable price......if you can find one.

    I have one on order, can't wait to get it.

  12. #12
    Senior Member Array FLSlim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    606
    Colt CCO LW is being put together via agreement with Talo. I think I paid around 900 for mine. Not a bad choice IMO.
    IMG_1425.JPG
    Chose a weapon that goes bang EVERY time!

  13. #13
    Member Array DHart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    359
    BAC... compact 1911s do indeed bring compromises and more likelihood of functional difficulties. Not that they cant be reliable, because certainly many are/can be.

    A couple of considerations... the .45acp caliber was designed to provide optimal terminal ballistics with a 5" barrel. Shorter barrels reduce velocity and therefore reduce terminal ballistics with standard .45acp ammunition. Going to 4.25" Commander barrel length reduces velocity slightly, but not significantly. The 4" barrel drops it a tad bit more. The 3" barrel drops it significantly. You can work to compensate for these velocity losses by using the considerably more costly exotic .45acp ammunition (like the Barnes all copper loads). But function testing/proving with such ammo gets really expensive, really quickly.

    1911s were designed to perform optimally in Government (5") size. Its well known that the shorter lengths require much more precise tuning and very frequent recoil spring changes to maintain defensive, absolute reliability. This can be done, of course, but not without some noteworthy compromises on your part.

    Add in reducing grip frame height (in the "compact" models) and you also lose a round of capacity (from what is arguably a moderately lower capacity design anyway).

    The compromises required by a short barrel length and short grip frame, with the 1911 design, really do add up to sacrifice.

    So, the question for you is, does the moderate reduction in size and weight more than justify the need for hotter, exotic ammunition, more frequent recoil spring changes, more need for precise tuning, the loss of 1 round of capacity, and likely more concern about the utmost defensive reliability/capability of the weapon?

    If you are unfortunate enough to find yourself having the darkest day of your life, facing the darkest evil you have ever confronted, will you be glad you chose from among the smallest, lowest capacity pistols you could choose? Really?

    If so, then at least you enter the world of the compact 1911 with eyes wide open and mind better informed of the downsides regarding compact and micro 1911s.

    For me, the compromise is definitely too much. That's why I sold my Defender and don't carry my Kimber Compact (all-steel 4") nor my Kimber Compact CDP (alum. frame 4") models (both older, pre-series II models). They definitely are cool guns, but not what I would want in my hand if I had that dark day.

    From my perspective, among all the 1911 models you could choose from, the Commander size models offer the best compromise between reducing size and weight from the Government models while still maintaining capacity, good terminal effectiveness, and reliability. The Colt Commander models in all-steel and Lightweight versions have proven themselves, to defense professionals and others alike, as worthy defense pistols.

    If I were you, I'd pick up a Colt LW XSE Commander (stainless for less upkeep) and feel totally confident in having made an excellent choice, with high quality parts and materials, for a very reasonable price (about $1k or so). You can fully expect perfect reliability right out of the box (with a thorough cleaning out of the preservative, of course) with the new Colts.

    I have two LW Commanders, one the XSE which I had bobtailed, and the other the Wiley Clapp Commander.



    The Wiley Clapp Commander




    If you want an all-steel frame, the Colt 1991A1 Commander in blued or stainless is around $900 and a superb choice as well.



    Last edited by DHart; January 21st, 2013 at 07:00 PM.
    The clowns in government office see the solution to everything is write more laws, creating the ever-mounting morass of legal handicaps that we citizens must labor under.

    STATE'S RIGHTS RULE and should be INVIOLATE. Feds butt out!

  14. #14
    Member Array 424D57's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    MO
    Posts
    36
    The STI would be top of my list. Love all the STIs we've had, and the price is about perfect, even with some cash left over for mags, ammo, and have Brazos put some sights on there and maybe even work the trigger to your precise likings.

    A couple other bits for thought aside from my opinion on the STI-
    If you're worried about the aluminum frame check the DW - think it also has an aluminum frame.
    The DW and Kimbers I think both have a firing pin safety of some sort. Not sure about the Fusion but I'd guess not - the STI and Les Baer do not. Not trying to steer you either way (lack of a firing pin block doesn't bother me personally), but its a relatively large feature difference between the pistols you listed and might be of interest in your evaluation.


    -424D57

    edit: I'll second the idea to look at an EMP if you're not stuck on .45. I've fired several and liked them all. Even the one on the rental wall at the local range was reliable.

  15. #15
    Distinguished Member Array deadguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    SC
    Posts
    1,885
    Dan Wesson does not use any type of firing pin safety.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Search tags for this page

1911 cco vs commander
,
best 1911 cco
,

best cco 1911

,

cco 1911

,
colt o4691
,
colt talo cco for self defense
,
dan wesson cco vs guardian
,
dw cco vs sti guardian
,
fusion cco
,
gun availability
,
new 1911 cco for 2013
,
who makes a cco 1911
Click on a term to search for related topics.