An uncomfortable "What if"

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    Member Array Skippymjp's Avatar
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    An uncomfortable "What if"

    I have a friend that sometimes goes to the range with me, and if we've got enough ammo and we're feeling saucy, we have a little good guy/bad guy drill we do. We set up two targets, one to represent "he", and one "me". And we do a drill as one guy being the bad guy in a "somewhat ready hoodlum not expecting the armed citizen" stance, and the other being, well, the armed citizen. The hopeful outcome of the drill is for the bad guy target to be engaged, and the other, not.

    We did this a couple times this morning, and he was doing the good guy thing. I was doing my very best "low ready gimme yer money" stance and he drew his LCP and...."thunk". His very first round was a misfire. He can do the tap/rack/bang drill quite quickly, likely a shade under 2 seconds. But in that time, I came to full ready and shot 3 holes in the "he" target. That little incident had both of use in somewhat of a blue funk, like; well, uh ok.

    So, we both tried it, with an empty chamber to simulate a dud round, and, the bad guy won...every time.

    We then went one step further, and used revolvers starting with an empty chamber, and concentrated on double taps. That drastically threw the odds back to the good guy. We'd already be squeezing into the second shot before it really registered the first one didn't go off.

    I know we might go through a million more rounds before that happens again. But I'm really seriously considering going back to a J-Frame or round butt K-Frame for carry again. I can do jam clearing and such pretty well, but I'd rather not have too if there is a BG an arm's length away.

    Just an observation...
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    Member Array mgillitzer's Avatar
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    I really like the idea of this drill. I will have to start doing drills like this myself. As a working man, I think revolvers have only one downside... The price. I'm a pretty firm believer in not selling guns once I purchased them, but can usually find a semi that I have wanted before I can save up the amount needed for a revolver and have a somewhat compulsive buying problem.:D
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    Member Array cthruit's Avatar
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    The answer (or, at least, the best answer) is to drill, drill, drill until there's no thinking to the decision. That, quality ammo and weapon maintenance is crucial.

    As an old timer once told me, and I've found it to be true....if it's your time, it's your time. I try to avoid it.
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    It was an LCP, even if the round wasn't a dud, you'd still die.
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    That is an interesting drill that you did. Over the last few years I have watched seasoned and experienced people that about 90% of the time when they get a dud, like you and your friend have also experienced they are already pulling the trigger on the next round when they notice the dud then do a tap, rack, access, and if need to, bang drill. This has also happened to me, so that made me think of the advantages of revolvers and also some manufactures of semi-automatic firearms that allow attempted repeat firing of so called dud rounds, where on a dud round the trigger goes back to DAO setting allowing you to pull the trigger again to fire the dud round. Taurus, Keltec, and S&W are some of these manufactures and I know there are others out there. I *thought* that I read somewhere that 99% of the time if you pull the trigger again on these dud rounds that they will fire. When I had a S&W Bodyguard 380 I used to go to the range sometimes using Tulammo. We all know how hard the primers are on these rounds and that sometimes you think you got a dud, but pulling the trigger again will fire the round, which is what the S&W Bodyguard 380 allowed me to do. I also had a Keltec P11 that allowed me to do this. Yes we should all keep practicing the tap, rack, and access and if need to bang drill. Just sharing my experience and thoughts on this. God Bless
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    VIP Member Array Easy8's Avatar
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    I like the 380 bodyguard have had one I purchased for my wife a while back. I have had it at the range several times an never had a hiccup. I still would not carry it over a j frame or sp. there is something about reaching down an feeling that revolver that is to comforting. I keep hi cap semis for home defense. On our little trips to town the revolvers we carry should suffice. When I showed my wife the bodyguard I got her she just rolled her eyes an tapped her 642 an walked away. Got to love a woman who knows what she wants.

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    Funny thing about your drill- the target doesn't move while your buddy is doing the tap, rack, bang. I would hope he isn't stationary while performing the immediate action drill. Getting away from where the thug thinks you're going to be is a great way to stay alive.

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Decent drill, to show the viability of time as a factor. Can make all the difference.

    Of course, in a real situation, getting of the X and moving can also play a part, which itself (along with other tactics such as closing distance, if at contact distances) can rapidly change the calculus. Depends on much, leveraging time to create advantage.

    Though, time's rough. It often shows how rough it can be, as in your drills. Very unforgiving, generally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skippymjp View Post
    ... I'm really seriously considering going back to a J-Frame or round butt K-Frame for carry again...
    Been there, done that. Ruger LCR is my favorite carry. Looking for some money for a S&W model 60.

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    VIP Member Array Easy8's Avatar
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    Nix mod 60 is a great weapon either it or my sp is always close by. image.jpg

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    VIP Member Array Smitty901's Avatar
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    You can what if yourself into a nut house.
    The LCP is a good weapon keep you weapon in good working order use good known ammo and take you chance in life.
    1. it is unlikely you will ever have to fire it in self defense
    2. If you do it will fire
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    The most concerning thing to me is the reason for the misfire. With a quality production firearm and quality ammo (I assume) what happened?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skippymjp View Post
    .. I'm really seriously considering going back to a J-Frame or round butt K-Frame for carry again. I can do jam clearing and such pretty well, but I'd rather not have too if there is a BG an arm's length away.

    Just an observation...
    I'm a big fan of the LCP. I've yet to find anything that equals it, but it is absolutely NOT a fighting gun. It's what I carry when I absolutely cannot carry anything else, or it's a backup that I hope I never need.
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    Member Array charliefox's Avatar
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    No matter what you carry, if you don't get off the X, you will get killed. Draw, shoot, move; repeat as necessary.

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    It's an interesting experiment but, because it's totally static it is not really reality based.
    Take it as a learning experience.
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