This is a discussion on Caliber: .45 ACP/ Type of Gun: I want a 1911 but... within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by ExaltedOne I want a 1911 but... I'm hesitant about getting one. I'm looking at the RIA 1911 Tactical 2011 with full length ...
Since the RIA Tact has a 5" barrel it will probably be primarily used for the range and HD. It is a $500 sidearm, priced about the same as the M&P. As a range weapon you'll probably want to only shoot ball ammo and use GI mags with the follower dimple.
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You might like the M&P 45 #109106 - no mag safety and has a thumb safety; 4.5" barrel and 5.5" high; just a little higher than the 1911. Usually 1911ers like thumb safeties, Glockers usually don't; M&Ps can accommodate both. Just don't expect the M&P to have the feel of a 1911 trigger. It, like the Glock, can be improved, though, with aftermarket triggers. But chances are that it still won't feel as good as a 1911 trigger. A tricked out 1911 trigger? Forgetaboutit.
If you're used to a striker fire don't be surprised, literally, if it feels as if it is going off all by itself. Yeah, don't be surprised that you will be surprised and shocked. Load a single bullet in the mag, then fire it, then 2 in the mag and fire it, then 3 in the mag and fire it, increasing the mag capacity by one until you can empty a whole mag. Just to be safe.
I bought a Rock Island Armory 1911 in 10mm. It was very tight, reliable, and accurate. It was flawless through several hundred rounds. It was a great gun with a lifetime warranty. I would recommend one as an entry level 1911 to se if you like the 1911. The only reason I sold it was to make room in my save for a new Colt Delta Elite. I am at the point that I have to sell a gun if I buy a gun. I refuse to buy a second safe because that would lead to safe number three and number four.
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There are lotsa tradeoffs.
Size, shape, weight, capacity, barrel length...
It's true that the 45ACP Glock 21 and Glock 30 are very soft-recoiling, in fact the G30 is the softest-recoiling 45ACP handgun I've ever shot, including the HK 45ACP models and the 1911, even lighter than the G21, if that's possible.
Both the G21 and G30 are also thoroughly reliable IME, at least in the gen 3 models. (I have no direct experience of any of the gen 4 Glocks.) Both are also quite acceptably accurate and precise.
OTOH, the G21 has a fairly hefty grip, however (wide & deep compared to the 1911), and is inconvenient to carry concealed, though IMNSHO it makes an excellent home defense gun, when paired with an attached white light source.
The G30 grip is better than the G21, though still fat compared to the 1911. I carried a gen 3 G30 for years, always OWB because of the wide blocky slide.
While the G21 barrel is shorter than that of the standard 1911, and the G30 is of course shorter yet, it should be mentioned that the velocity loss with shorter barrels is proportionately less for the 45ACP than it is for the 9mm, and would probably matter little in a self-protection context.
Fully-loaded capacities for the G21 and G30 are 14 and 11, respectively, compared to 8-9 for the 1911.
OTOH, spare flat 1911 magazines are a cinch to carry, while the Glock mags are quite bulky.
There's a lot of difference in the trigger "feel" for Glocks vs. 1911s.
How important that difference is will vary from shooter to shooter, but experience with both types is recommended before buying, to the prospective "first 1911" purchaser.
Nowadays I find a lightweight Colt Gunsite CCO 1911 easier to carry concealed, in IWB mode, than either the G21 or G30, and certainly the 1911 grip is the best one out there among currently available 45ACP pistols, as far as I'm aware.
(I'd mention the G36 too, but IME, it's insufficiently reliable for serious consideration as a CCW gun, in spite of the advantages of its slimmer profile and lighter weight. YMMV, of course.)
I haven't shot any of the S&W M&P or SA XD models in 45ACP, though I've heard good reports from those who have.
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OK, Im seriously considering my first 1911. I carry a Beretta PX4 on duty, a Kahr CM9 & Glock 27 concealed, and use the Glock 30 and Glock 17 for home defense/vehicle gun. How hard will the transition be switching from a 1911 to my Glocks and Beretta? I have had plenty of experience with good triggers on bolt rifles and hunting revolvers, just not had a lot of trigger time on 1911's.
Anyone here have experience with the Ruger SR1911? How does it compare to the SA Mil-Spec?
I am a believer in the G 36, and truly don't understand the statement above.
I have found that it is a very accurate and very reliable handgun. No different from any other Glock, just 45acp.
My EDC choice.
Last edited by glockcoma; December 25th, 2013 at 06:46 AM.
I'am also looking for my first entry level 1911 and have been looking at the Tisas Zig M made in Turkey. A friend of mine bought one a few months ago and loves it and the $400 price is a great value. I own a TriStar L120 CZ 75 clone also made in Turkey by Canik and it is a very good gun.
Last edited by tdw63; December 25th, 2013 at 12:38 AM.
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Some folks with recent G36s seem to have no troubles at all.
I have had two G36s ever since they first came out, so they're of early manufacture (when the troubles were first reported), and cannot go very far over 100 consecutive rounds without having either a FTRTB or FTE, in spite of multiple recoil spring changes (stock, higher/lower poundage), higher power extractor depressor plunger springs, proper lubrication, and a good strong hold.
They'd be great CCW guns if they were thoroughly reliable, but mine aren't, though it sounds like your gun is just fine.
Humani nihil alienum
Give ya one guess as to my recommendation. Can't go wrong with a Kimber.
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I have been looking at 1911 style pistols again myself just lately. I'm sort of liking the Para Ordinance USA Expert for less than $600. Same shop has a RIA Tactical II FS for $550 and the trigger on that is pretty sweet and adjustable. I kind of like the full length guide rod and ambi thumb safeties also....but. Springfields seem hard to find around here. Anyways......the number of parts and breaking down a mil-spec or clone of a 1911 isn't really a big deal. Last time I had a hankerin for another 1911, I ended up with a SIG P220 SAO and that is one sweet pistol. You can actually chamber a round by racking the slide with the thumb safety engaged.
In today's world with the lighter, polymer, aluminum and alloy frames, I just feel the need to hold another 1911 that is all steel. I clean and maintain all of my firearms the same way. Don't make a difference if it's more metal and you need a diagram to take down and put 36 parts in a ziploc bag to keep from loosing them, or a Glock that breaks down into four parts. To me, the basic mil spec 1911 is the ideal pistol for the 45ACP even though I don't currently own one.
The M&P? Well, I'd rather go with an XD if I had to.
Magazines and problems? Well, a lot of pistol problems are the result of magazines or ammo unless you get a Glock. They don't have any problems but they may blow up. Back in the day I had an old Colt and I bought a Norinco 1911A1 when they first came out. I used to hit the Army surplus store on my way home from work every week and had some 30+ surplus magazines. They were $6-$8 each depending on condition. Some had rust and they were obviously used. The followers were not all exactly the same batch to batch either. But I had very few culls out of what I had collected, and when one started to malfunction, I simply removed the bad part and threw it away. Then I had a box of spare magazine parts. Sometimes all I needed to do was bend the feed lips back into shape to make a malfunctioning mag work fine. I am however a big fan of the Wilson Combat magazines for the 1911.
The rail on the newer 1911 offerings is a nice addition, but not really necessary. One usually buys a pistol with a specific purpose in mind. If it's strictly home defense, then it should have a rail for a light or laser combo. For carry, not really important. I know a lot of folks just like to buy pistols with no intentions of a specific task.
The cost of a decent 1911 these days? That pretty much depends on your thoughts of 'decent'. One basically needs something dependable and reliable, and something that won't break after 500 rounds. If it's just a range pistol to make holes and go bang, you can save some money. So....the $575-$2000. Now, you have to remember you'll need to feed this new habit. Guns don't work without ammo, and now is not the best of times to work your way into a new caliber! If you're a collector, you're not buying something reasonably priced anyway. Kimbers and Wilson Combat are at the high end of the list. It's just that I could never see spending a possible 1K rounds just to break one in. Damn if ammo isn't hard to find and more expensive than ever when you can find it. 45ACP will likely cost you $50 per hundred now. Right out of the box, the lower end 1911s are going to work well for you with good ammo and the factory magazines. It's just that what you feed them and how you care for them will pretty much dictate how long they'll last and how long it will be before you experience malfunctions. None of the modern plastic pistols are going to give you the feel of a 1911, but you won't have to worry about much and all of them fit into the budget category. It all depends on what you really want.
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It's just a different platform. You will form a different mindset. You should be able to adapt. I tend to think that Glocks tend to foster a cavalier attitude, so you may have to get rid of some bad habits, if you have any. For example, pulling the trigger to field strip a pistol is anathema to the 1911er. The habit of pulling that trigger may make some un-attentive, dull. To the Glocker putting a hammer down by pulling the trigger is usually very disconcerting. Those that have been around revolvers probably don't think twice when doing so. They know that the hammer is being put down on a live shell. The difference is that while the 1911er may know that he is putting the hammer down on an empty "chamber" he still treats it like it is always loaded. At least I do. I CAN'T pull the trigger unless I know that there's a snap cap in there. And I will probably check at least three times before doing so. Like I said, a different mindset. ymmv. BTW, I just can't ever own a de-cocker pistol for the same reason. I will have to train to push the de-cocker while it is pointed at the ground and not push it while it is on it's arc into my holster. That's one bad habit that I would have to break. Flipping on the thumb safety while it's on it's way to my holster? I have no problem with it because I'm confident (always aware) that my trigger finger is out of the trigger guard. De-cockers blow my mind. I just don't trust them. Obviously someone who is confident with a de-cocker doesn't see the big deal. I don't do slide mounted safeties. I don't want to confuse my muscle memory. You will have to form new muscle memories for engaging/not dis-engaging 1911 thumb and grip safeties.
You can hear anything in these forums other than a good prayer. The 1911 has not been a favorite for over 100 years because it was not reliable or durable. When you listen to the naysayers, you can bet they are young and raised on Glocks. Yet you will not hear Glock owners talk about the Glock Kaboom and other failures.
A 1911 is one of the most sought after guns in the market. I have trained many people on the 1911 that preferred other brands but once skilled with a 1911 began carrying them for SD and LE work.
A 9mm might expand but a .45acp never shrinks.
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