trigger job on a carry weapon?

This is a discussion on trigger job on a carry weapon? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; My recent carry purchase is a S/A Champion. Two things that I'm not crazy about are the occasional FTF even using several different mags. I ...

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Thread: trigger job on a carry weapon?

  1. #1
    Member Array sportkcjc's Avatar
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    trigger job on a carry weapon?

    My recent carry purchase is a S/A Champion. Two things that I'm not crazy about are the occasional FTF even using several different mags. I decided to have it throated and dropped it off yesterday at my local gunsmith. I was just getting back from the range so I had my target .45 with me, it's a Dan Wesson PMAS. This pistol has, I would guess, about a three pound (at the most) trigger. My smith said without measuring it he would guess it's about 2.5. My S/A feel like it is about 4.5to 5+. This heavier pull is effecting my accuracy. His suggestion was to leave it alone as the trigger does feel good, just heavy, which may not be a bad thing in an adrenaline pumping situation. I left it with him just to polish and throat, what do you think? Better accuracy, lighter trigger or combat accuracy and a heavier trigger.

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    Array QKShooter's Avatar
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    My personal opinion is Absolute Reliability as Job #1 - decent trigger pull with no yukky "creep/mush" ~ a crisp trigger with the exact trigger # weight not so important and (of course always) good accuracy.
    I hate a crappy feeling trigger.
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

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    VIP Member Array Tom G's Avatar
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    I would leave the trigger alone if its a carry peice. Modifing the trigger could screw you up if you ever had to use it in self defense. I think I would pratice a lot more with the carry gun .

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    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    trigger job on a carry weapon?
    Every time. Always.

    For me, it's the difference between a good weapon and a great one. A full action/trigger job and tuning improves the safety and handling characteristics, improves the shot-making ability, improves reliability and consistency. It also affords a chance to document in writing your stated goals for having the work done, with a copy of the request in the hands of someone else whose records cannot mysteriously disappear if SHTF. It's all to the good. About the best ~$150-250 you can spend.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

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    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    As long as it its smooth dont fool with it i would'nt go under 4# on the trigger

  7. #6
    VIP Member Array ELCruisr's Avatar
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    My primary carry, a Commander, has had a full trigger and action job. Trigger pull 4.5 lbs.

    My new GI Micro has a trigger pull closer to 6 lbs and it's going in for the trigger / action job next week then it will be a carry piece.

    The heavier trigger has affected my accuracy with it. I can't see a trigger job hurting me in court as it's giving me better control and I like both of them to have close triggers. However I wouldn't carry one with a sub 4 lb trigger for practical and legal reasons. Too easy to have an AD in the heat of the moment.
    If you stand up and be counted, from time to time you may get yourself knocked down. But remember this: A man flattened by an opponent can get up again. A man flattened by conformity stays down for good. ~ Thomas J. Watson, Jr.

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    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
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    Awful lot of "Guessing" going on for a Competition Shooter and a
    Gunsmith.

    Why not just have it Measured and tuned for a safe but smooth pull?
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    Member Array sportkcjc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AKsrule View Post
    Awful lot of "Guessing" going on for a Competition Shooter and a
    Gunsmith.

    Why not just have it Measured and tuned for a safe but smooth pull?
    AKsrule, you've got me confused with someone else. I'm not anywhere near being a competition shooter. If I was I probably wouldn't be having a problem with the accuracy of a different pull, eh! My first .45 just so happened to be the target model. No guessing from the gunsmith, he says no to the trigger job, he wouldn't recommend it. We both agree the trigger is smooth, no creep, just heavy. My question is do you modify for a light trigger and better accuracy or keep heavy since it's a carry piece.

  10. #9
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sportkcjc View Post
    No guessing from the gunsmith, he says no to the trigger job, he wouldn't recommend it. We both agree the trigger is smooth, no creep, just heavy. My question is do you modify for a light trigger and better accuracy or keep heavy since it's a carry piece.
    For a carry weapon, "hair trigger" action is something that juries hate to hear about. It's why DAO is a trend. Generally speaking, going much lighter than 4# in a carry piece will raise some eyebrows, not all of them friendly.

    I'm neither gunsmith nor attorney. But I appreciate the practical realities of carrying to the degree that willingly helping the prosecution with "hooks" to hang onto isn't something I choose to do. Like it or not, "hair trigger" actions are one of those things. If still concerned, speak with your own attorney for some unvarnished opinion on how much this might matter in your area.
    Your best weapon is your brain. Don't leave home without it.
    Thoughts: Justifiable self defense (A.O.J.).
    Explain: How does disarming victims reduce the number of victims?
    Reason over Force: The Gun is Civilization (Marko Kloos).
    NRA, GOA, OFF, ACLDN.

  11. #10
    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
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    My Point was that you can usually have a Gunsmith make your
    trigger pull Lighter and/or smoother and STILL have a "safe" gun.

    But the only way to make an informed decision is to inspect
    and WEIGH the trigger mechanism.

    I will agree though that a 4.5 lb. pull on a 1911 is adequate for
    self defensive use.
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    "If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
    {Bernhard Goetz}

  12. #11
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    Trigger jobs are not in and of themselves necessarily wrong or bad. But as has been pointed out, it may provide something an attorney can use to paint you in an unfavorable light. It may not be a break or make issue, but may increase time, effort, and cost of defense.

    A trigger under 4# could really become a problem - that's gettin' pretty light. If the attorney uses LEO after LEO with 6# and more trigger pulls, he's gonna plant some doubt in the jury's mind.

    We have to remember, justification will be decided in court by gun illiterate sheeple. It doesn't always take a lot to sway and lead sheeple with false representations of a SD shooting.

    I think trigger jobs are defensible, the question is, will the jury think so.

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    Member Array FIREARMZ's Avatar
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    As long as it is done by a professional gunsmith. Someone may have to testify as to it's function one day.
    Ken Forbus Owner of FIREARMZ
    FIREARMZ FORUM

  14. #13
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    Trigger job? What trigger job?
    "Just blame Sixto"

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    VIP Member Array pogo2's Avatar
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    Don't ask, don't tell?

    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    Trigger job? What trigger job?
    This actually makes a lot of sense as your preferred legal position. On some of my older guns, I have noticed a gradual improvement in the trigger over time as the gun goes from new to having 5,000 rounds through it. It is almost as if the gradual wear and smoothing of the trigger parts through use amounts to a "trigger job". I'm sure the pounds of force to trigger the shot have decreased over time on these used guns.

    I don't think a trigger job really leaves any distinctive marks on the gun parts involved that differ from ordinary wear. I would be surprised if a "gun expert" hired by the prosecution could prove that a gun had indeed had a light trigger job. He could measure the pounds required to activate the trigger, but guns of the same make and model can differ somewhat in their trigger pull. So as long as you stay close to the normal range, who is to say you ever had a trigger job, unless you admit to it? (Or they happen to find your regular gunsmith who keeps meticulous records of all his work.)

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array ELCruisr's Avatar
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    One of the things I like about the expanded castle doctrine here in FL is that, so far, the cases are being judged strictly as justifiable or not justifiable based on peoples actions. What they used, how it was worked on or loaded with has yet to enter any of the cases I've been able to follow. Of course nobody has used anything exotic or highly modified yet!

    This issue may be very location sensitive. So far, FL seems to be reasonable. It would also be very easy to come up with lots of documentation recomending 4 to 5 lb triggers on self defense weapons.
    If you stand up and be counted, from time to time you may get yourself knocked down. But remember this: A man flattened by an opponent can get up again. A man flattened by conformity stays down for good. ~ Thomas J. Watson, Jr.

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