Natural frequency?

Natural frequency?

This is a discussion on Natural frequency? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Do you feel your gun has a natural frequency with rapid fire? Obviously gun weight and caliber will be major influences but I have noticed ...

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Thread: Natural frequency?

  1. #1
    VIP Member (Retired Staff) Array P95Carry's Avatar
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    Natural frequency?

    Do you feel your gun has a natural frequency with rapid fire?

    Obviously gun weight and caliber will be major influences but I have noticed over years, as a generalization, that each gun has a definite ''ideal'' rate of fire. Even revo's too. Exceed that and maybe you lose the best results.

    I must admit watching experts with .45acp in particular, it is surprising how fast they can be but - am aware that rapid with my 220 is definitely better slowed a shade, compared to 9mm +P thru my 226, which is definitely faster.

    We are talking small increments of a second of course but sometimes, instance my SP-101 when it was EDC - if I tried to double tap faster than what seemed its natural frequency - second shot accuracy suffered.

    Good grip and technique are vital always but, like it or not the gun will move under recoil - to greater or lesser degree. Thus gun recovery between shots will have a finite ''signature''.

    Am I alone in this observation?
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  2. #2
    VIP Member Array MNBurl's Avatar
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    My guns do have what feels right from rapid fire and control perspective. Each is different and depends on the guns weight, trigger and ammo.

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  3. #3
    Distinguished Member Array lowflyer's Avatar
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    I tend to shoot 1911s faster than anything else I have tried in .45.
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  5. #4
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    I'm going to agree with you. I think it not only has to do with MNBurl's comments, but also its natural point of aim; as in how fast can you get the sights back on the target. After putting several hundred rounds through the gun, you get a feel for it and it starts to develop its own pattern and frequency.

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  6. #5
    VIP Member Array ccw9mm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P95Carry View Post
    Do you feel your gun has a natural frequency with rapid fire? Am I alone in this observation?
    Every gun does, IMO, having to do with the balance, weight, degree of recoil and muzzle rise.

    Data points: My Browning BDM has a fairly long barrel as compared to the overall length/size. Most of the weight is out there, so it handles rapid-fire strings fairly well. My CZ P01 on the other hand has much more of its weight spread through the frame near the chamber, so it (understandably) flops around a bit more during strings fired just as quickly. It's sweet spot is about 30-40% slower, when firing rapidly. The KelTec P3AT, interestingly, comes back onto target very quickly, hence I'm able to rattle off quick strings of 3-4 rounds much faster than the other pistols. I'm sure this has to do with its overall weight. Of course, the kick/rise is much worse than the others. They're all quite different, yes.
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  7. #6
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    P95 , I agree. I think most of us just tend to unconsciously set the rhythm of rapid fire without realizing it.
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  8. #7
    Array SIXTO's Avatar
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    Yes, I have noticed this too. I wonder though if its the gun or the shooter. Like Rocky, I think its a mental thing. Shooting is a mental game more than anything else.
    Try this... before you go to the range next time, think about an unusual shooting pattern. I.E. think about shooting 4 rapid shots on one target before moving onto the next. You will find that you alway want to shoot those 4 shots even if you force yourself to move to a five shot pattern or down to a three.
    It works that way for me anyway...
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  9. #8
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    VIP Member Array kpw's Avatar
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    This is a good post. It was something a friend and I were talking about recently. Certain guns shoot more faster-more better for certain people. Anybody have a better term for it? That doesn't sound right.

  10. #9
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    Yep, P95, I've noticed that too.

  11. #10
    Member Array mw1311's Avatar
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    I have noticed this with my guns too. Not just pistols but rifles too.
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    I'd think so, and there are multiple factors including the user.

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  14. #13
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by P95Carry View Post
    Do you feel your gun has a natural frequency with rapid fire?
    I think there is, but it's not just the gun. It's a combination of the gun, the shooter, the target, and the range. Change any of those variables, and the frequency is going to change.

  15. #14
    Member Array MD_Willington's Avatar
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    I've noticed this with my 5906, I've belted off 15 rounders with it fairly quickly on steel. My PT111 is pretty new and I haven't figured out its rhythm yet, different trigger setup on them and there is quite a bit more weight to the 5906.

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array Redneck Repairs's Avatar
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    IMHO its the shooter more than the action . The ergonomics of the firearm , familiarity with the trigger , and shooter rapid fire experiance all play a part , but my point is the more you shoot fast , the faster you can shoot effectively. The time between shots is dependant on the shooter , not the action since we see some amazing feats with double action revolvers (JERRY MICULEK) , single action revolvers ( bill mundin i belive his name is ) that can actualy out run a 1911 keeping 5 rounds on target , as well as the wizzards of ipsc , pin gun , and 3 gun matches.
    Spend some time shooting as fast as you can keeping your rounds in a pre defined area , and then shoot faster .. flat out will never shoot asprin tablets off a 2x4 at 10 paces , but some work full out hitting clay pidgens at that range will greatly increase the speed you can knock the asprins off lol .
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