This is a discussion on CCW advice within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Since I'm new to this site I wanted to say hello and ask a question. I'm just waiting on the background check (MO) to get ...
April 18th, 2007 12:10 AM
Since I'm new to this site I wanted to say hello and ask a question. I'm just waiting on the background check (MO) to get my ccw and I'm interested in a quality small gun to carry. I carried a SW 659 9mm in Indiana, but I wasn't as concerned w/ concealment as I am now. My wife carried a Taurus 850 CIA (DAO) Total Titanium 38+p. It's light and small, but I always hit high and left with it, and I feel like I have a large orange in my pocket when I carried it.
After visiting the NRA convention, I think I have narrowed my field to SW M&P9c , Kahr PM9, or stick to J frame size revolver. Any suggestions, or alternatives? Can you compare them, or am I barking up the wrong tree? I prefer to stick to 9mm or 38/357 because of ammo issues, and unfortunately price is a factor.
April 18th, 2007 12:10 AM
April 18th, 2007 12:36 AM
April 18th, 2007 12:54 AM
Go with the model that feels best in your hands. All of those models are respectable in their own right. Get the one that you like the best and then practice with it as much as you can.
Also, Welcome to CombatCarry.
...He suggested that "every American citizen" should own a rifle and train with it on firing ranges "at every courthouse." -Chesty Puller
April 18th, 2007 12:55 AM
First of all Welcome. Arthur about said it all. The Kahrs are getting a very good rep for being a well built and dependable firearm. They don't feel right in my hands but if they fit you well you will be well served.
Remember...Four boxes keep us free: the soap box, the ballot box, the jury box and the cartridge box
April 18th, 2007 12:57 AM
Yes you can compare them, you may even end up owning all three and rotating them as carry options.
Of the three I would get the M&P or something similar (XD, Glock).
But my preferences are based on my experiences with guns owned and used, in your position I would rent as many different guns as you can find, and handle even more. Every time you pay $10 to rent a gun you are possibly saving $500 on buying a dud, or losing whatever when you trade it back in.
The M&P/XD/Glock platforms are popular with experienced shooters for good reason, they are foolproof and dependable.
April 18th, 2007 01:03 AM
from Central Florida!
Rent them at a range...this will help...try others...don't limit yourself...you'll find that certain sidearm that has that 'perfect' fit.
Stay armed...stay safe!
"That I cannot do."
"Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks."
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
April 18th, 2007 01:08 AM
Welcome to the Forum.
I carry a Kimber Ultra CDP that weighs in at 25 ounces and shots like a dream. Kimber has a 9MM but I wanted the .45 for the stopping power!
If it is not in the US Constitution then the Federal Government should not be doing it.
"Carrying a gun is a social responsibility."
April 18th, 2007 03:02 AM
I've been carrying for twenty plus years, so I'll pitch in my $0.02.
I carry an N-Frame Revolver with a 4" Barrel 80% of the time with a J-Frame 442 as a BUG. If the 442 becomes the "Primary" I back it up with a Kahr PM9.
The reason I selected the 442 over the PM9 is because at "Bad Breath Distance" you can "jam" the Kahr as you press it in to your opponent's side while shooting. Also, the "blow back" of blood, guts and skin can and will turn your PM9 in to a "One Shot Wonder Pistol." I can keep shooting the 442 until time to reload.
Also, while the Kahr is small and light, I find that the 442 draws from a pocket easier. Another plus to the Revolver is, I can shoot it from my coat pocket. Try that with the PM9 and you have once again created a "One Shot Wonder Pistol".
Don't get me wrong, I like my PM9, it's just that the Revolver seems more practical for most of my situations. By the way, I live in the desert southwest where a lot of people think you can't hide a fighting size handgun. I prove them wrong a lot. Good concealment depends on top quality holsters and belts, unless you want to wear "ghetto "baggies". I'm too old and too un PC for "ghetto baggies".
April 18th, 2007 03:11 AM
Welcome to CombatCarry!...
All the pistols you've mentioned are of high quality...you should handle them and see which one fits your hand best, and try to shoot that model (if possible) before purchasing. Good Luck...
"I surrounded 'em"- Alvin York
"They're ain't many troubles that a man can't fix with seven hundred dollars and a thirty ought six"- Jeff Cooper
April 18th, 2007 08:40 AM
Small 9mm - Glock 26?
If you want a very concealable 9mm that works every time, how about a Glock 26? You won't find a 10 shot 9mm that is much smaller and lighter weight, and there are many good holsters made to carry the gun on the belt or ankle. Here is a good photo of a G26 by Lunde:
April 18th, 2007 10:00 AM
Welcome to Combat Carry
If you are hitting high and to the left you could be anticipating recoil in such a light gun as the 850.
Noli nothis permittere te terere
Lord, Grant me a good sword and no need to use it.
April 18th, 2007 10:02 AM
I say go with the Kahr, its thin, flat and light weight. Its much easier to conceal than a J frame or a fatter Glock, XD or M&P.
Everyone will preach go with what fits your hand, I say dont worry about that much. This isnt a target pistol, its a carry gun. You will carry it a whole lot more than you shoot it, carry comfort is more important here.
April 18th, 2007 10:33 AM
Thank you all for your help. I guess I have more questions to pick your brains with...
1. No matter what gun I go with do you have any suggestions on a holster? I'm short, fat and bald so Ghetto Baggies are out of the question. I wouldn't ware parachute pants last time they were popular. I wear a lot of jeans and suspenders, and I notice many in-the-pants holsters require a belt, any that don't? I saw some kind of pager/ phone holster at the NRA convention, but it seemed to place the weapon swinging between your legs, not ideal.
2. Any other ideas on compacts other than already suggested? I guess I'm being "old school" but I wanted to keep the caliber 9mm/ .38 or larger. Any changes out there to change my reasoning? I wanted to stay with calibers that I already owned, but I am open to others if there is a significant reason. Before anyone suggests a 1911 style, I guess I'm a puss but I don't want to carry "cocked and locked". I know the safety drill but I'm still uncomfortable carrying that way.
3. I live in rural Missouri, my range is the back forty, the closest neighbor is 1/2 mile away and the closest town is 5 miles away (pop less than 2000). Could those members close to St. Louis or Jefferson City suggest a place I might find a range that rents these guns? I wish there was a way the companies could send a demo to a local gun store, or have a roving demo shoot that was in my area. I guess with the laws and liabilities that will never happen.
Thanks again for your info. I am glad I stumbled upon this site.
POGO2, Thanks for your ideas, I have never held a g26 but the others I have held felt like a block in my hand. I have friends who love them but they feel and point oddly for me.
April 18th, 2007 12:06 PM
Top Gun in Imperial Mo has rental guns you can try. I have been there a few times and everyone seems to be really nice and helpful. They have a nice indoor range and they focus a lot on everyone being safe. Imperial is south of St. Louis on I-55.
April 18th, 2007 01:35 PM
I agree with SIXTO here. You have to figure out your priorities. Some people will tell you they've carried a large gun for years, & that's good. But with todays technology, you don't have to. Most people I run into that are interested in carrying just are not going to carry for very long if the gun's not small & light.
Originally Posted by SIXTO
I have both a Kahr PM9 & a S&W 442. I find myself almost always carrying the Kahr instead (Although my EDC is a Taurus Mil Pro PT145). In a good pocket holster, the Kahr's thinner, shorter, as light (Unless it's the titanium models), & more powerful.
If you already have .38's & 9mm's, there's nothing wrong with wanting to stay with those calibers.
As far as holsters are concerned, it depends on what you get & how you want to carry it. Personally, for my PM9, I have a pocket holster & an IWB one. If the idea of something else in your pants doesn't appeal to you, you can carry OWB. A belt's important, especially for OWB carry. I've found that I can carry my PM9 IWB (Metal clip), without a belt, but I wouldn't recommend it unless you're 100% confident the clip won't let go. HBE holsters & UBG holsters both use metal clips that won't let go.
Oh yeah, & welcome!
Last edited by cockedlocked01; April 18th, 2007 at 01:48 PM.
"Use human means as though divine ones didn't exist, and divine means as though there were no human ones." Baltasar Gracian
Integrated Close Combat
Glock 19 & 26, Kahr CM9 & P45, Para P12, Kel-Tec P-32, S&W 442, & Dan Wesson 14-2.
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