Tough Guns - Page 3

Tough Guns

This is a discussion on Tough Guns within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hey Bark'n; I used to be able to say that my old Colt friend had never failed me until that front sight went and flung ...

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Thread: Tough Guns

  1. #31
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    Hey Bark'n;

    I used to be able to say that my old Colt friend had never failed me until that front sight went and flung itself off.


  2. #32
    Member Array Protect's Avatar
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    Somewhere there is a write up on the SIG 220 Combat. They dropped it, ran over it with bulldozers, blew it up with high explosives, froze them, used them to crush rocks, dropped a backhoe bucket from 40 feet on them, still cycled and fired.
    "When a man attempts to deal with me by force, I answer him—by force.
    "... No, I do not share his evil or sink to his concept of morality: I merely grant him his choice, destruction, the only destruction he had the right to choose: his own." -John Galt, Atlas Shrugged

  3. #33
    Member Array mtnfreak's Avatar
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    I'd have to flip a coin on the Glock vs XD. It'd probably come down to price and accessories.
    For toughness, I love my old Ruger but, size- & weight- wise, I might as well haul around a brick.
    Law without force is impotent.
    Blaise Pascal

  4. #34
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    Of your choices Glock

    Surprised to not see the Smith M&P. M&P has harder finish (Rockwell scale) than Glock and is stainless underneath the treatment. IMHO it is what Glock should have evolved into but Glock says it is "perfection".

    Who knows. I just know that I could give either one to my grandkids (i.e. they will outlast my life).
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    Walther1

    Life, liberty, and the pursuit of the ultimate CC gun!

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmcgilvray View Post
    Hey Bark'n;

    I used to be able to say that my old Colt friend had never failed me until that front sight went and flung itself off.

    I still love my colt though! Great Gun!
    -Bark'n
    Semper Fi


    "The gun is the great equalizer... For it is the gun, that allows the meek to repel the monsters; Whom are bigger, stronger and without conscience, prey on those who without one, would surely perish."

  6. #36
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    I have owned four Glocks. Great guns. When I came across the XD.45 all other plastic guns lost their luster to me. I put my Glocks through h.. and they performed without a hitch. To see if it would hold up as well I have purposely put my XD .45 Service through some very rough treatment and I am convinced that it is the Glocks equal in toughness.

    BUT

    As far as accuracy goes my XD.45 is the best plastic gun I've ever had the pleasure to shoot. At 25 yards from a rested bench position my XD .45 averages under 2 inches! Hand held at the same distance I am getting 3-3.5" groups(all my groups are 5 shots each).
    Now the Glocks all four averaged right at 3"@ 25yds and handheld averaged 4-5". That's in my hand.

    Now I'm not saying that's bad. The XD fits my hand allot better so it doesn't surprise me that it's more accurate non-rested for me.
    IMHO the XD and Glock are the two best plastic guns out there. That's just my opinion. There may be other good ones out there but in my experience with many of them has led me to my current opinion.

    If you get a chance check as many of them out as possible to see which one fits four hand best and points well for you.
    Also If you go with the Glock I recommend a sight change.
    Between several of my friends who have XD's we have put a combined 72,000 rounds down range with not a single malfunction of any kind.

    Most of us have torture tested ours harder that the advertised Glock tests. Well with the exception of the one where they threw it out of a helicopter at like 150'. None of us has a helicopter. We have however dropped some of them from 50' on to pavement. We have yet to break one.

    Here is a link to a torture test of the XD (our testing was rougher than allot of this).
    http://springfield-armory.primediaou...SPstory11.html
    “You come at me with a sword and with a spear. But I come at you in the name of the LORD of hosts, the God of the armies of Israel, whom you have defied. This day the LORD will deliver you into my hand, and I will strike you and take your head from you". 1 Samuel 17, 45-46
    Brian

  7. #37
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    I choose Glock over the others not only for the overall toughness, but for the finish too. You have to really try and scratch up a Glock. Thats not true with the Sigs, or any others mentioned here. HK's may come close, same with the M&P... BUT, the big catch is if you do happen to break something on the Glock, its going to cost you a few dollars and the new part drops right in plus that part will be in your hands in a matter of hours if not minutes. Try that with HK, Sig or whom ever.

    Also, as cockedlocked01 pointed out, the generic comparsion of the "1911" is no comparison at all. X company makes a great 1911, Y company makes a crappy one. Both are 1911's but are very different.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    I choose Glock over the others not only for the overall toughness, but for the finish too. You have to really try and scratch up a Glock. Thats not true with the Sigs, or any others mentioned here. .
    Not so. The current XD's are finnished with Melonite which is the same thing as on a Glock. It just has a different name. This has already been discovered and confirmed on the XDtalk forum.
    “You come at me with a sword and with a spear. But I come at you in the name of the LORD of hosts, the God of the armies of Israel, whom you have defied. This day the LORD will deliver you into my hand, and I will strike you and take your head from you". 1 Samuel 17, 45-46
    Brian

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alien Nation View Post
    Not so. The current XD's are finnished with Melonite which is the same thing as on a Glock. It just has a different name. This has already been discovered and confirmed on the XDtalk forum.
    OK, I'm not saying your wrong, but get back to me after about ten years of holster wear. If it still looks as good as a Glock, then I'll listen.
    "Just blame Sixto"

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    OK, I'm not saying your wrong, but get back to me after about ten years of holster wear. If it still looks as good as a Glock, then I'll listen.
    Well I would imagine it would be no worse than a Glocks since it's the same exact finnish. As I said I've owned four Glocks. All of them showed wear on the edges after about a year or so. It was minimal but there none the less. Glocks corrsion proof finnish ,Tenifer, is the same thing as Melonite. The black finnish on a Glock is not the Tenifer. The Tenifer/Melonite is a metal treatment that penetrates the metal to some degree. The black finnish on either gun is for looks alone.
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:
    Tenifer is a trademarked name for the end result of a chemical bath nitriding process that embeds nitrogen into an iron-containing alloy to create a corrosion-resistant finish that is a dull grey in color and extremely hard. The generic term for this type of process is carbonitriding. Other trade names for carbonitriding include Melonite, Sursulf, Arcor, Tufftride, and Koline.

    PS, I have drawn my XD a little over 3000 times from a leather holster since Febuary and it has only the slightest shiny spots on the front edges of the slide. This is identical to my experience with my Glocks.
    Last edited by Alien Nation; June 12th, 2007 at 03:23 AM.
    “You come at me with a sword and with a spear. But I come at you in the name of the LORD of hosts, the God of the armies of Israel, whom you have defied. This day the LORD will deliver you into my hand, and I will strike you and take your head from you". 1 Samuel 17, 45-46
    Brian

  11. #41
    Senior Member Array Cap'n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SIXTO View Post
    HK's may come close, same with the M&P... BUT, the big catch is if you do happen to break something on the Glock, its going to cost you a few dollars and the new part drops right in plus that part will be in your hands in a matter of hours if not minutes. Try that with HK, Sig or whom ever.
    I believe that is the whole point of this thread. I've never had to use HK's customer service because my USPc doesn't break. My brother-in-law has never had to use Sig's customer service because his 226 doesn't break. I hear all too often about lifetime warranties and great customer service (Kel-tec) but I hope I never have to use my warranty or customer service for any firearm I own. A firearm at the repair shop is useless for me.

  12. #42
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    I would opt for a Stainless steel SIG 220
    Liberty Over Tyranny Μολὼν λαβέ

  13. #43
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    I believe the reason Sixto says that (& why it's a big deal), is that he's looking at it from a LE point of view. Guns do break (Any of them do: Sigs, HKs, etc.), especially if used on a daily basis. LE guns may not be fired alot, except for training &/or qualifications (Unless one is in a specialized unit), but they're drawn constantly, bang against just about everything, & many times are cleaned properly.

    That is why Glocks are the #1 gun used by LE. Are they necessarily better? No, but they keep going, fairly inexpensively, & if necessary, can be fixed easily & cheaply.
    "Use human means as though divine ones didn't exist, and divine means as though there were no human ones." Baltasar Gracian
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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cap'n_America View Post
    I believe that is the whole point of this thread. I've never had to use HK's customer service because my USPc doesn't break. My brother-in-law has never had to use Sig's customer service because his 226 doesn't break. I hear all too often about lifetime warranties and great customer service (Kel-tec) but I hope I never have to use my warranty or customer service for any firearm I own. A firearm at the repair shop is useless for me.
    Amen.

    Right now, I'm most torn between a medium-framed Glock, an HK USP or USPc, and a Sig P220 or P226. I've had some range time with the XD, honestly doesn't impress me or really feel any different from a Glock, and the M&P feels oddly large in my hands (my primary problem with the full-sized and large-framed Glocks). The USP and the steel-frame Sigs seem to have a reputation for toughness, and I've seen near every model of Glock endure some type of torture test.

    BUT, despite narrowing my focus on those above mentioned firearms, I do notice that there are an increasing number of gun models made to emphasize strength and durability. The XD, the M&P, Ruger P series (which have always had a decent reputation, so long as I've heard of them anyway), etc., are all good guns and more keep coming out with admirable toughness.

    Newer guns may not be "1911-pretty," but they seem to be getting better and better in the durability department.


    -B

  15. #45
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    Other than the Kahr, I've owned all of the pistols listed at one time or another and they'll all do what you need them to do. It probably all boils down to what you shoot best and what feels "right" in your hand. That used to be Glock for me, but then I got a Sig and am in love.
    "The only people I like besides my wife and children are Marines."
    - Lt. Col. Oliver North

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