Why a .45

This is a discussion on Why a .45 within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Why did I choose the .45........ Because if I need to draw my gun, the bad guy is staring down a BIG black hole instead ...

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Thread: Why a .45

  1. #46
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    Why did I choose the .45........

    Because if I need to draw my gun, the bad guy is staring down a BIG black hole instead of a little one and he has to decide whether or not he's ready to take on whatever is going to be coming out of that abyss.

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  3. #47
    VIP Member Array maclean3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD View Post
    Because they won't let me in Pizza Hut with my 870.
    Crap Dan, I just shot coffee out of my nose... that's the best reason to carry a.45 yet!
    Jack

  4. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerryD View Post
    Whilst in the Army a few years ago..., feeling old now.

    I had to use a 9mm on a few occasions against enemy combatants. I was very unhappy with center-of-mass shots. Head shots always seemed to work fine, but in real-world scenarios, center-of-mass works best for me. Just a lot easier to hit.

    While resupplying one time, I was talking to the armorer about my displeasure with the 9mm. He said he had some older 45's and plenty of ammo, if I wanted to give it a try.

    A few weeks later I got the chance to try the 45. Impressive is not an understatement. One-stop-shot pretty much sums it up from my experience.

    I was taught double-tap center of mass, then one head-shot. But "most" of the time, if I was using my pistol, it was cause I didn't have time to re-load my rifle. So I didn't "unload", as I was trying to save ammo.

    So without getting to grotesque, I think the 45 is without a doubt, a much better man-stopper than a 9mm. Personally, for concealed carry, I will never own anything else.

    Also, let me just apologize in advance if what I have said seems to harsh, as I was trying to write it as non-offending as possible.
    Harsh is okay with me. I'm frankly surprised--since it's not an everyday occurrence--to be reading a person's firsthand account of shooting so many people to death offered so readily. Many times, I've read that people who have done so--in self defense or in wartime combat--are reticent about it. Evidently not so with you.

    If you don't mind the inquiry, in what kind of capacity were you acquiring such experience in C.O.M and head shots using these various pistols? I was surprised to read about it, as I didn't think that our modern military did a whole lot of killing with handguns--although I read further and you said it was when you couldn't re-load your rifle... Now I am intrigued.

  5. #49
    VIP Member Array peacefuljeffrey's Avatar
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    This has been an enlightening thread. I have had myths busted for me by this thread. (Particularly, that of the belief that the "hydrostatic shock" or wound channel effect of handgun bullets had some significant power to effect a stop.)

    Thanks, guys!

  6. #50
    Member Array TerryD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peacefuljeffrey View Post
    Harsh is okay with me. I'm frankly surprised--since it's not an everyday occurrence--to be reading a person's firsthand account of shooting so many people to death offered so readily. Many times, I've read that people who have done so--in self defense or in wartime combat--are reticent about it. Evidently not so with you.

    If you don't mind the inquiry, in what kind of capacity were you acquiring such experience in C.O.M and head shots using these various pistols? I was surprised to read about it, as I didn't think that our modern military did a whole lot of killing with handguns--although I read further and you said it was when you couldn't re-load your rifle... Now I am intrigued.
    I think you are right. Most people don't talk about they're experiences, and neither do I for the most part. I have talked to my wife about it a little but that's it. I decided to say something because this is an internet forum. I don't know you, and you don't know me, so the ananimity makes it a bit...easier to talk about.

    I would never talk like that in person to anyone, not even my best friend.

    As to my capacity. I started my career as a bodyguard in the Army. Then me and my partner got put on a "recon" type team. In the eary late 80's, early 90's, they didn't have the technology we have today. So when they needed specific intel for some high priority targets, they would send us in to take live video, and pics via a little "satellite dish" (best way to explain it). This could be damn near anywhere in the world, usually in the middle of the night.

    In a perfect world, we are supposed to go in, take video/pics and leave without anyone knowing the better. But it didn't always work out that way.

    It's taken me a long time to be able to even write about some things. But I believe I have overcame my demons, and am willing to write to anonymous people about it...ocasionally.

    As for friends and family...I will let them think I was the guy who was an a$$hole for so many years for no reason, then suddenly changed his stripes for the sake of family. Now...I am a nice guy.
    "Nice grips, weird choice of etching" Rocky

  7. #51
    Senior Member Array Vaquero 45's Avatar
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    Well the bottom line for me is, no amount of hashing over this number or that number beats real world experience. It's silly to think that handgun bullets at 1200 - 1450 fps do no damage due to velocity and energy, but at about 2000 fps, there's some magic that takes place that liquefies organs. It's not an on/off switch, everything is gradual.

    The .40 and .357 magnum cartridges work just as well or better than the .45. That's real world street experience. If 'big and slow" worked so great, there would be no need for .45 +P, but obviously there is, if that's the new standard. It's because faster bullets work better, for whatever reason. The .44 is in a class by itself not because it's a .429 bullet, but because it's a .429 moving fast.

    Why drive .45 bullets to +P if it's of no consequence to the human body?

    If 300 fps more velocity of the .40 over the .45 doesn't make any difference, then I bet .05 inch won't make any difference either.
    Slow is smooth.....smooth is fast.

  8. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by maclean3 View Post
    Crap Dan, I just shot coffee out of my nose... that's the best reason to carry a.45 yet!
    Jack
    Sorry about the coffee, Jack.
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

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  9. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metro 40 View Post
    Well the bottom line for me is, no amount of hashing over this number or that number beats real world experience. It's silly to think that handgun bullets at 1200 - 1450 fps do no damage due to velocity and energy, but at about 2000 fps, there's some magic that takes place that liquefies organs. It's not an on/off switch, everything is gradual.
    Either the bullet is fast enough that the temporary cavity it creates will tear muscle tissue or it isn't. The research shows that no service handgun cartridge propels the bullet fast enough for temporary cavity to be a factor.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metro 40 View Post
    The .40 and .357 magnum cartridges work just as well or better than the .45. That's real world street experience.
    The validity of "street experience" depends a lot on what exactly we're talking about. Is this a study grounded in rigorous statistics, with a large enough sample size to be meaningful and controlling for factors like "psycological stops", or is it a bunch of anecdotes? Post some links your sources.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metro 40 View Post
    If 'big and slow" worked so great, there would be no need for .45 +P, but obviously there is, if that's the new standard. It's because faster bullets work better, for whatever reason. The .44 is in a class by itself not because it's a .429 bullet, but because it's a .429 moving fast.

    Why drive .45 bullets to +P if it's of no consequence to the human body?
    Ensuring sufficient penetration, particularly when fired from a <5 inch barrel.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metro 40 View Post
    If 300 fps more velocity of the .40 over the .45 doesn't make any difference, then I bet .05 inch won't make any difference either.
    It probably won't make a huge difference, but unlike piling on excess energy, it will make a difference.

  10. #54
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    If 'big and slow" worked so great, there would be no need for .45 +P, but obviously there is, if that's the new standard. It's because faster bullets work better, for whatever reason.
    And or because they sell.
    "The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper

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  11. #55
    VIP Member Array Blackeagle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OD View Post
    And or because they sell.
    That too.

  12. #56
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    I shoot a .45 because I have confidence in the round, and in my ability to place it where needed. If someone is more confident with another round, they should shoot it.

    Shot placement is the biggest factor in the effectiveness of any handgun round. If you can't hit something important, it doesn't matter what caliber you use.

    Do I think the .45 ACP is the ne plus ultra of defensive rounds? No. I'll take a 12 guage slug for close range work, but as was stated earlier, Pizza Hut frowns on the 870.
    The .45 is just the best handgun round for me, now. If I find and acquire a 9mm, .40 or .357 I shoot better with, and is at least as reliable as my .45, I'll carry/shoot that.

  13. #57
    Senior Member Array cockedlocked01's Avatar
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    I like my guns in both 9mm & .45. I find .45 handguns to have a recoil that I can handle better than a .40. I'm talking follow-up shots, here.

    Yes, one can make the arguement for 1 shot incapicity, but for the most part, it's really shot placement.

    For me (& I'm talking about only me on this), my follow-up shots suffer with the "fast" recoil of a .40. I wish it didn't because handguns for .40s are typically on the same frame as for 9mm & are similar in size & weight. Because of that, they're typically smaller, lighter, & with higher capacity than .45s.

    With the right .45, I make follow-up shots quickly & accurately, like my 9mm. I can't say the same for a .40.

    That's why I like .45. That, & a 1911 just isn't a 1911 in 9mm or .40.
    Last edited by cockedlocked01; July 9th, 2007 at 02:59 PM. Reason: Grammar
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  14. #58
    Member Array FknRa's Avatar
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    One thing that stood out to me the very first time I shot a .45 was the recoil. While my 9mm was very controlable the word that comes to mind was "snappy" with my uncles p220 it was more of a "Push" and I was able to control the muzzle flip a little better.
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  15. #59
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    I chose a 45 because I love the full sized frame 1911 style handgun. Same reason I own a BHP in 9mm.

  16. #60
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    I carry a 45 because a 9mm might expand, and a 45 "will not" skrink.
    Keep your powder dry

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