p7 - review and video
This is a discussion on p7 - review and video within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; P7talk.com Reviews: H&K P7 PSP
H&K advertisement :
"As a discriminating hunter or sportsman, you will be impressed with the uncommon performance, advanced design, and ...
September 1st, 2007 10:50 PM
p7 - review and video
P7talk.com Reviews: H&K P7 PSP
"As a discriminating hunter or sportsman, you will be impressed with the uncommon performance, advanced design, and superior quality of HK's p7(PSP) cal. 9mm Automoatic Pistol.
Skillfully integrated into the front of the hand grip is the P7's squeeze cocker which eliminates the conventional double action trigger. No other pistol in the world offers this unique feature! As the shooter grasps the weapon, natural finger pressure is used to depress or release the dqueeze cocker, thereby cocking or uncocking the pisol automatically. The P7's sleek, uncluttered design affords equal ease of handling to both left and right handed shooters along with unequaled speed, safety, and dependability.
At HK, every firearm is designed, tooled and manufactured under our strictest quality control and supervision, ensuring precision and unequaled performance."
Specific information and history:
"The Heckler & Koch P7 is a compact semi-automatic pistol normally chambered in 9 x 19 mm Luger manufactured by the German company of Heckler & Koch. It was designed beginning in 1971 to be compact and have enhanced safety features." CLICK HERE for more on the history of the H&K P7 PSP.
The HK P7 has a distinguished look as well as a very unique design that can be mistaken for no other. It is a single action semi-automatic blow-back operated, interal striker fired pistol that is cocked by squeezing the unique grip cocker with about 12-14# of pressure. With the squeeze cocker held firmly with about 2# of pressure, the pistol fires the same as any other single action automatic. When you release the squeeze cocker the striker is decocked and the weapon will not fire until the squeeze cocker is re-engaged.
Although there is no obvious tactical advantage to this weapon, there is a difficult to describe but distinct fascination amongst shooters and enthusiasts with the P7. I can tell you that I have always wanted one, but i cannot tell you specifically why I have always wanted one. I do not feel it's just because it's something different from other weapons because there are many unique designs that don't appeal to me. The P7 however, is one of those rare weapons that has an irresistable mystique that makes you want to own at least one. With their cult-like following, it can be difficult to find a P7 in good shape for a reasonable price which is why I did not yet own one. While waiting on my flight to take off recently (so that I could unpack my portable dvd player from my carry on bag) I found myself thumbing through the CURRENT CATALOG from CDNN. When I reached the page showing the P7 I felt that I had found the weapon I wanted in the condition I wanted and at the price that I wanted. With that I placed my order.
P7PSP "excellent to new condition" $674
used magazine rated 90% $35
new H&K magazine $55
$20 transfer fee (paid to my local dealer)
I ordered the weapon late on Monday, August 27, 2007. The weapon shipped on Tuesday the 28th, and I had the weapon in my hand on Thursday the 30th.
When my weapon arrived I was thrilled by its overall condition. Although stamped 11/85, I seriously doubt this weapon was ever issued. There is no holster wear at all, and very little indication that its ever even been handled. I browsed the owners manual to become familiar with the unusual controls, field stripped and lubed the weapon, and reassembled it. With everything ready, it was time to go to the range and find out what this little fascinating handgun is really all about.
I intended to purchase 500 rounds of Corbon 9mm +P ammunition in both 115 and 125 grain loads, but having depleted the local gun stores of Corbon ammunition last week in MY PPS REVIEW, very little could be found. I ended up purchasing 160 (80@115 grains and 80@125 grains) rounds of Corbon +P loads which is all i could find out of the three stores here that carry it. I cache this ammunition but do not pull from my emergency cache for practice. Since 160 rounds just isnt enough to fully evaluate any weapon, I headed over to walmart and picked up 500 more rounds of WWB.
It might seem a little silly that I would bother to post a picture of my ammunition receipt, but I find my enthusiasm stemming from ignorance to be quite funny....anyone ignorant to the P7 will not see the humor in someone thinking that they can shoot hundreds of rounds from a P7 in one trip. Those who have experience with the P7 are no doubt laughing at me pretty hard right now.
September 1st, 2007 10:50 PM
At the range:
No matter how "pretty" a weapon is, no matter how expensive a weapon is, no matter what kind of reputation it has the only thing that ultimately matters is what happens when you pull the trigger. A weapon must function reliably in any situation from any position. It must shoot true, and be comfortable to carry and fire. For accuracy and proficiency a weaopn should be ergonomically matched with the shooter.
Click image above to view video.
The above featured video is not formal training, but simply an effort to become familiar with all aspects of my new weapon. I'm still experimenting with different stances for shooting from behind cover, trying to find a happy balance of comfort with agility. I do not yet have a holster for this weapon so I could not begin each drill by drawing the weapon. With no holster i began each drill by holding the weapon angled down with my trigger finger in the ready position. My testing in the past has shown this to be pretty comparable to the time it takes to draw the weapon from an IWB holster under an untucked shirt.
What i like:
The overall accuracy of this weapon is very good.
Rapid target acquisition and complete control through controlled pairs, follow-up shots, and "double taps" was just viscious. I found that not only was I making A-zone hits faster than with other weapons, but I was hitting very well placed A-zone hits faster than with other weapons. Perhaps I was just having a good day, but on this particular day with this particular weapon I simply could not miss. I purposefully pushed myself for faster target acquisition, shorter target assessment, faster shots and faster follow up shots and each time I was pleasantly surprised that my hits remained consistant and true. It almost felt like I was shooting some type of self guided bullet. Although many of my 1911s may be capable of tighter grouping from a bench, as defensive shooting goes today I shot better than I ever have.
I know as soon as I say this that I will draw much criticism from the hardcore priests of the church of John Moses Browning (inventor of the 1911) but the purpose in publishing this review is to share my honest assessment of this weapon, good and bad. As a member of the church of JMB (not a priest, but certainly a dedicated member) I find it somewhat difficult to say but the truth is the truth so here it is:
I have never found a better trigger in any gun at any price, bar none.
The trigger breaks very crisp and clean at about 3 pounds. Pull is short, there is no over-travel, and most important for me the reset point and the break point are same point....the exact same point. This makes a tremendous difference if you shoot from reset which I do, and I feel this is why my follow up shots and controlled pairs were so visciously consistant and it is the biggest reason why I just couldnt seem to miss with this weapon.
The overall size of this weapon makes it perfect for carry. The slide is slim and rounded, perfect for IWB carry.
I didn't shoot it enough to fully evaluate reliability, but function was flawless.
The ergonomics were perfect. Being used to the 118 degree grip angle of the 1911, I often find European designs (such as the Glock) uncomfortable and unnatural for me. The 110 degree grip angle of the P7 however is a perfect match, possibly even more natural for me than the 1911. Trigger position was very good, I had no problems manipulating the trigger. The slide release is also located in the squeeze cocker, which you simply squeeze to release the slide making for a lightning fast reload. Alhtough different from what I'm used to, the magazine release at the base of the magazine isnt bad at all.
What i don't like:
Due to the blowback design the weapon gets hot.....very hot very fast. I noticed it warming up after two magazines (16 shots) and by 50 rounds in somewhat rapid succession it was uncomfortable to hold which affected accuracy and everything else. I found myself putting the weapon down to cool, and after about 100 rounds I was done. I don't see how the plastic heat shield on the M8 could make a difference when the trigger itself also gets very hot.
I consider the capacity to be low for a 9mm of this size. Although 9mm +P ammunition has come a long way in the last decade (in terms of ballistic numbers), I find a true strength of the 9mm in its capacity. You can get 14 round total capacity in the p7m13, but you must have very large hands to hold it comfortably.
Perhaps the reason the P7 PSP comes with 8 round magazines is because they figure after 8 rounds the weapon will be to hot to hold anyway.
Bottom line: This is not a range gun or an all day shooter, but as a defensive weapon I don't see how it could get much better. When you consider size, reliability, accuracy, trigger, ergonomics, etc. few pistols match up to the P7.
September 1st, 2007 11:14 PM
enjoy that PSP sir. I own three of them, two PSP's and a jubilee issue [ #5* of 500 ] P7M8
I've been carrying the PSP for a few months now, hides and carries well in a vm2 holster. Low rds count in the mag is the only issue I have with the gun but I still carry it as just like you, it's hard to miss and follow up shots are faster than many other guns I carry regularly.
The mind is the limiting factor
Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor
September 1st, 2007 11:19 PM
Natural Selection: Great review, I love to see your reviews they are awesome!
Thanks for the effort and info.
September 2nd, 2007 02:38 AM
Interesting weapon...superb review!
The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
September 2nd, 2007 02:55 AM
"You don't shoot to kill; you shoot to stay alive."
CZ 97B .45
September 2nd, 2007 03:27 AM
awesome review of an awesome weapon...
although i have to say, when I had mine on the range, it wasn't getting that hot that quickly. i let it cool before i put it away though.
Firefighter / EMT - Always Ready. Ever Willing.
~Never do anything that you don't want to have to explain to the paramedics...~
September 2nd, 2007 04:23 AM
September 2nd, 2007 06:18 AM
Great review! Looks like a great pistol.
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The Bill of Rights: Void where prohibited by law.
September 2nd, 2007 08:13 AM
Great review, Nathan.
"The pistol, learn it well, carry it always ..." ~ Jeff Cooper
"Terrorists: They hated you yesterday, they hate you today, and they will hate you tomorrow. End the cycle of hatred, donít give them a tomorrow."
September 2nd, 2007 11:27 AM
I've never felt underarmed with 9 rounds of 147 SXTs in my P7. Heck, I rarely feel underarmed with my 5 shot j-frame...
September 2nd, 2007 01:24 PM
I've never felt underarmed with 9 rounds of 147 SXTs in my P7
Thats what I carry in all my 9mm's as well.
The mind is the limiting factor
Quick Kill Rifle and Pistol Instructor
September 2nd, 2007 02:09 PM
Nice review on the P7 & thanks for taking the time to post your opinion on this weapon.
September 2nd, 2007 02:36 PM
I'm going to have to quit reading this forum. This review makes me want one of these more than I already did. I don't need the pistol. I've been trying to convince myself of any need, and I can't come close. Yet, here I am again looking at the credit card thinking about getting one.
"The only people I like besides my wife and children are Marines."
- Lt. Col. Oliver North
September 2nd, 2007 02:47 PM
Gotta get me one of those thangs!
Why is it that you always find things at the last place you looked?
Because when you find something-you stop looking-Mooch
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