XS sights - Page 3

XS sights

This is a discussion on XS sights within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; After 14 months (!) of waffling upon seeing the new XS Sight video (#2) I just now went ahead and pulled the trigger. Colt Officers ...

Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 64

Thread: XS sights

  1. #31
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    6,781
    After 14 months (!) of waffling upon seeing the new XS Sight video (#2) I just now went ahead and pulled the trigger.

    Colt Officers ACP & Defender - Big Dot / Tritium F&R
    NE-0003s-5

    - Janq
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing


  2. #32
    VIP Member Array KenpoTex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    SW Missouri
    Posts
    2,193
    make sure to let us know what you think after you get some trigger-time with them.
    "Being a predator isn't always comfortable but the only other option is to be prey. That is not an acceptable option." ~Phil Messina

    If you carry in Condition 3, you have two empty chambers. One in the weapon...the other between your ears.

    Matt K.

  3. #33
    Member Array ShackleMeNot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    117
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigsauer View Post
    I would ask you the same for the big dot over the standard.

    My experience is that the big dot does not give any speed advantage while the standard dot in fact DOES add a slight edge in the accuracy for medium to long range shot placement. I am basing this on my own personal experience with both dots as used in a side-by-side comparison test of my own as they were installed on two identical Glock 17 pistols.
    I have run thousands of Force on Force drills and scenarios with Glock 17s using stock Glock sights, Big Dots and Meprolights. I do not own a set of small dots so I can't test them but smaller sights often get lost under stress. The bigger the dot the better as it is more likely to be seen and therefore used.

    The Standard Dot Tritium. We have it around because no matter how logical and sound the Big Dot system is you just canít convince everyone as to its advantages or that you really can shoot accurately with it. The Standard Dot Tritium gives them a better front sight so they will have some improvement. We sell quite a few of them to the gamers who want a better front sight but shoot in a world where the targets are generally static and clearly marked as to which ones are hostile and which ones are not.
    XS doesn't even believe in their own small dot for a fighting sight.
    Shay Van Vlymen - Instructor Tactical Response

  4. #34
    Ex Member Array Creature's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    343
    I have run thousands of Force on Force drills and scenarios with Glock 17s using stock Glock sights, Big Dots and Meprolights.
    means nothing if you haven't used the standard dots, so I wonder why you even mentioned it.

    It is a pointless argument regardless...the results of my own personal testing were in favor of the standard dots.

    So go with the big dots and be happy if you think they will give you the edge.

  5. #35
    Member Array ShackleMeNot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    117
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigsauer View Post
    means nothing if you havent used the standard dots, so I dont know why you even mentioned it. It is a pointless argument...the results of my own personal testing were in favor of the standard dots. "Manufacturer's results" are, as a rule, bogus because it is all about inventory and how to move the product.

    So go with the big dots and be happy if you think they are faster.
    I never wrote that they are faster. You should reread my post.

    Go for what works for you. But your sample size of one is simply an anecdote.
    Shay Van Vlymen - Instructor Tactical Response

  6. #36
    Member Array ShackleMeNot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    117
    Nice ninja edit. Glad I quoted your post.
    Shay Van Vlymen - Instructor Tactical Response

  7. #37
    Ex Member Array Creature's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    343
    I never wrote that they are faster. You should reread my post.
    Have you ever actually even used the standard size sights?

    I was simply pointing out that, by your own admission, you have never actually compared the two sights together. Your post about the thousands of force on force scenarios you have conducted really added nothing to the conversation. Until you have actually done a side-by-side test, the "big dot being more likely to seen" argument is purely conjecture on your part. Bigger just is not better all the time...sometimes what seems likely in theory just isn't so in reality. If you haven't actually compared the two sights on the same platform side-by-side for yourself, basing your choice on what the manufacturer claims probably isn't a good idea. As for the medium to long range accuracy, the standards dot definitely has the edge.

  8. #38
    Member Array ShackleMeNot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    117
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigsauer View Post
    Have you ever actually even used the standard size sights?

    Yes.
    Shay Van Vlymen - Instructor Tactical Response

  9. #39
    Ex Member Array Creature's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    343
    Yes.
    Okay...so I guess I have to ask the question since you didn't offer it:

    Based on your experience with both sights, how much faster was the big dot over the standard dot?

  10. #40
    Distinguished Member Array fed_wif_a_sig's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Denton, TX
    Posts
    1,376
    I'm a big fan of the XS Big Dots. Just had a pair custom installed on a Walther PPK/S and ordered a set for the "house" gun and will install them on all my non-issued firearms (and wish I could install them on the issued ones).

    The main point for the Big Dots is that they allow you to pick up the front sight faster and as I age and use glasses more and more, the ability to pick up a big hawnking front site is a plus.

    Oh did someone already mention that the "Guru" (aka LTC Jeff Cooper) had them installed on his 1911? Well the front one was anyways.

    As far as them not being not precise for some, in combat shooting we all get wrapped around a one hole group (which I can and often do) but when it comes to a real shooting, I am more than happy with any shot group that is under 6 or 8 inches.
    Steve
    "Respect all ... Fear none!!!

  11. #41
    Ex Member Array Creature's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Virginia
    Posts
    343
    Quote Originally Posted by fed_wif_a_sig View Post

    As far as them not being not precise for some, in combat shooting we all get wrapped around a one hole group (which I can and often do) but when it comes to a real shooting, I am more than happy with any shot group that is under 6 or 8 inches.
    I completely agree with this notion. I am not wrapped around the idea of one ragged hole from five or six rounds from a combat handgun. Just as long as my hits are in the vitals, that is all I am looking for in a set of "speed" sights.

  12. #42
    VIP Member Array Janq's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    6,781
    Update:

    My Colt 'Defender' arrived late yesterday from Colt with the XS 'Big Dot' I'd ordered installed.
    This sight is the truth!

    Later tonight I'll post a stand alone thread on this with my own initial findings and preliminary testing of it via 2hrs. of dry fire practice side to side against other sight types (Novak combat and Bomar style target sights) under various lighting conditions including timed transitioning against three fixed targets with just me moving. The results of my testing were interesting as in relation to the Novak and Target sights in specific while XS beats them both by a great margin.

    Quick and bottom line position though:
    1) I really like this sight!;
    2) The 'Big Dot' front sight makes total 'duh' type sense and is very functional once you get opportunity to handle it IRL;
    3) The rear sights design is IMHO excellent for as applied use.
    This is NOT a 'bullseye' grade extreme overlapping shot to shot to shot to shot type accuracy sight...if you want that then stick to Bomar style 'Target' sights;
    4) I'm very glad that I listened to the advice of the mfr. website and those of you here at DC.com, and did not get the 'Standard' small dot front sight version. In this specific case bigger and much easier to see/find is better;
    5) I wish I had not waffled on this for so long. In fact I wish I had bought these sights years ago.

    - Janq

    P.S. - I am for the record not in any way associated with XS Sights. I bought mine from XS at straight retail and sent my gun along with the sights off to Colt to have them cut the slide and install the sights for me while also doing some warranty repair and adjustment/checkup work.
    "Killers who are not deterred by laws against murder are not going to be deterred by laws against guns. " - Robert A. Levy

    "A license to carry a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman." - Florida Div. of Licensing

  13. #43
    Member Array Locopelli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    65
    Welcome to the fold Janq.

  14. #44
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    OK
    Posts
    3,468
    Small XS update that may or may not be of interest:

    The plain white dot (Standard and Big) has been changed. The "old format" was roughly a 45* sloped face with a gloss white epoxy paint; the "new style" has become a roughly 20* degree face with a PVC ball epoxied in place.

    IMHO, XS has voided the original advantage of the express sight concept. In it's original format, the dot caught virtually any ambient light- tritium was unnecessary, since if the target was visible one would have adequate light to see the dot, the steeper angle of the sight face made this possible.

    The "new style" is little different than a Marble's GameGetter rifle front bead. In short, the PVC is less reflective; the steeper angle, in conjunction with the +/-3mm protruding bead, creates a shadow over the lower half of the dot when transitioning from low-bright(er) light environments. IOW, about 1/2 of the dot "grays out", leaving one with an inadequate, ghosting front.

    I've used XS since they first came out (around 1996, IIRC) and have been a strong proponent of the system. However, personal experience is that the "24/7" sights do not show nearly as well in daylight or low ambient light as the plain epoxy white(though they are better than most traditional 3-dot sets). This is personal experience; eveyone's eyes will have varying responses to lighting conditions.

    My fear is that new management has realized that they can make more $$ with tritium sights, and provide (though they surely do not recommend)Standard dots more cheaply with the new designs. If all else fails, I have a Dremel, model mitre-box, and a 1/8" ball-end carbide bit...but I shouldn't have to be "re-evolutionizing" $60 sights. FWIW...

  15. #45
    VIP Member Array Rob72's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    OK
    Posts
    3,468
    Quote Originally Posted by fed_wif_a_sig View Post
    Oh did someone already mention that the "Guru" (aka LTC Jeff Cooper) had them installed on his 1911? Well the front one was anyways.

    As far as them not being not precise for some, in combat shooting we all get wrapped around a one hole group (which I can and often do) but when it comes to a real shooting, I am more than happy with any shot group that is under 6 or 8 inches.
    Yes, Cooper had one of Ashley Emerson's Standards placed on his personal piece, and lauded it accordingly!


    I'm not trying to convince or convert anyone, but I will offer a different point of view, in relation to my previous post. 6-8 inches is shotgun spread.

    We typically think of the personal defense scenario within 10 yards, without friendlies to the front. What if that isn't the case? I tried the Big Dots sometime ago, and realized I wasn't content with the consistancy I was getting with them. I've never been a "one-holer", but if I can't keep 3" or less out to 15 yards, there's a problem with the firearm, I'm having a really bad day, or a combination of the two.

    If I came home, interrupting a robbery/assault, and a 5'8" BG had my 5'9" daughter in front of him, across the living room, that Big Dot displaces a ******* lot of space. Just something to consider...

Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Sponsored Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Red Dot Sights
    By mr.stuart in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: December 4th, 2010, 09:27 AM
  2. WTB:XS big dot sights for G27
    By TheisHolsters in forum Member Buy, Sell & Trade
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: May 5th, 2009, 11:34 PM
  3. XS sights
    By Bill MO in forum Defensive Carry Guns
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: February 27th, 2009, 09:49 PM
  4. Night Sights or your Favorite Sights?
    By Rybord in forum General Firearm Discussion
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: November 13th, 2008, 09:02 PM
  5. BRIGHT SIGHTS ghost glow paint for sights
    By artz in forum Related Gear & Equipment
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: November 11th, 2006, 01:38 PM

Search tags for this page

3 dot sights vs xs sights
,
colt defender with xs sights
,
colt officers xs
,
hk p2000 xs sights
,
shay van vlymen
,
whats the difference in 1 and 0 xs sights
,
xs 24/7 or regular big dot sights
,
xs big dot sights kimber
,

xs sights colt officers

,
xs sights on a kimber
,
xs sights on ppk
,
xs sights standard dot p226
Click on a term to search for related topics.