January 19th, 2008 09:44 AM
Daughter's noise and recoil concerns
She always screams and backs up when she sees spiders.
No, that's not what I meant. She's mildly interested in self-defense, and will be moving away to college in August. She says that even with ear muffs a 9mm hurt her ears, and she doesn't like the recoil. And for finger strength she needed both hands to dry-fire a stock SP-101. We also have a Neos (Beretta's spacegun 22) which she's pretty good with... yet I would like to see her with a heftier weapon.
What are the factors which influence noise and recoil? I'm guessing that shorter barrel=noisier and lighter/thinner/bigger caliber/hotter load=more kick... but I don't know that I could get to what she wants without a silenced Garand chambered for 22 shorts.
My advice was to try foam earplugs along with the muffs at the range, but that in a confrontation she may not even notice the noise. I am guessing she ought to use the 22 for range time, and that (if it fits her hand) I ought to get her something like the Bersa 380 - a smaller caliber, of significant weight, and a substantial grip.
January 19th, 2008 09:51 AM
I would say try the earplugs and muffs as you suggested. It is also possible she has exceptionally good hearing.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
January 19th, 2008 09:53 AM
also , a electronic earmuff might help her. I suspect the noise is more anticipated than real. she expects it to be a really loud bang.
"In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." Thomas Jefferson
Nemo Me Impune Lacesset
January 19th, 2008 10:08 AM
no way to hurry this along..after years of trainin all my kids to shoot i have found time and patience to be the key. She is anticipating the recoil and noise. I would use plugs and muffs. Then let her shoot that darn 22 as much as possible. Make the targets fun..balloons, clay pigeons on the ground, whatever you can. Then move up to a 380 or something light...then up to a 9 ...You gotta go thru a TON of ammo to get her there. Most of us guys didnt just pick up a 9mm for the first gun..I started with a bb gun, then 22 then 410 then 16 then 12 ..for instance...only because we had those avail. Thankfullly I live in the country so we shoot ALOT!lol
January 19th, 2008 10:13 AM
Not everyone will be comfortable carrying a gun. The best gift you can give her might be a can of pepper spray and a women's personal defense class. My girlfriend knows how to use one of our 12 Ga shotguns very well, but she's not comfortable carrying in her car or on her person, and I'm fine with that. She does keep pepper spray on her and knows how to use it and her fists pretty well.
January 19th, 2008 10:23 AM
FWIW, my wife had never shot before and was scared of the gun. As a requirement to continue the relationship I took her shooting. I started her with a Ruger Single Six with a 7.5" barrel and .22 blanks, though I didn't tell her it was loaded with blanks. She got into a grove then I let the cat out of the bag and put some real .22 LR in it. After a while a put the .22 Mag cylinder in it and we progressed from there. She's most comfortable with a 4" S&W M64 now, though she does pretty well with my Glock 22.
The keys to winning a gunfight are first to bring a gun and secondly to take your time, quickly.
Always remember that if your opponent is within range, so are you.
POWER TO THE MEPEOPLE!!!
January 19th, 2008 10:52 AM
For the sound issue, consider treating her to some custom molded earplugs. This is about as good as it gets for earplugs. And she could wear them under earmuffs for maximum protection.
As for the 9mm, the HK P30 has been reported as the softest shooting 9mm ever.
January 19th, 2008 11:23 AM
Healthy Young people usually have very acute hearing.
Originally Posted by Paymeister
I recommend BOTH earplugs and Electronic muffs used together.
I recommend a J frame with standard .38spec. loads.
They usually have light - smooth triggers , and a .38 has more of a "pop"
than a "crack"
-SIG , it's What's for Dinner-
know your rights!
"If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
January 19th, 2008 11:29 AM
as said above--AND practice.
- know the difference
is a fancy name for crappy fighter
You have never lived until you have almost died. For those that have fought for it, life has a special flavor the protected will never know
January 19th, 2008 11:54 AM
I always use plugs and muffs, and I'm not afraid of the noise. It just hurts my ears. My advice would be to have her keep shooting the .22 until she's completely comfortable with that, then maybe try a big heavy 9mm or .38 with the lightest loads you can find. It may seem counterintuitive, but a steel 1911 in 9mm might be a good choice to absorb recoil and give her a very light trigger pull. With a short trigger, flat MSH and slim grips they can work well even for someone with small hands. there are lowered and extended thumb safeties available too.
“Freedom is the sure possession of those alone who have the courage to defend it.” ~Pericles of Athens
Primary Carry - Colt Commander .45 in a Brommeland Max-Con V
January 19th, 2008 11:55 AM
I have some silicone molded earplugs. They are $$$, but do dampen the sound in a way foam plugs can't. A pair of mufflers on top helps too. Are you shooting at an outdoor range? Indoor ranges tend to freak me out a little too.
Guns are loud and will damage your hearing if you don't wear adequate protection. I wouldn't doubt that many members here have slightly damaged hearing from a lifetime of shooting or military. I guess if you need to use a gun in self defense, the small loss of hearing is minor compared to a large loss of life.
"a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.
January 19th, 2008 12:11 PM
I wear adaqute protection,it doesn't hurt my ears(I'm 21.) BUUUUTTT I have ringing in my ears,and permanent hearing damage,......so I don't think thats an issue for me.
As far as recoil, maybe a heavier framed .38SPL with lighter loads?
My fiancee doesn't mind recoil,so I can only give so much advice as the only female expereince with firearms is that she LOVES .40S&W, .357SIG,...etc...she likes "hot rounds".
"To blame a gun for a mans decision is to foolishly attribute free will to an inanimate object"- Colion Noir.
January 19th, 2008 12:12 PM
Have you tried any of the subsonic 22lr rounds? They also make 22lr rounds with primer only. They might be useful for revolver use. Check out:
22LR 20gr Aguila Colibri Solid Box (50 rds)
"a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.
January 19th, 2008 12:25 PM
She says the 22LR doesn't bother her, so we don't need to lighten the load there. I think I'll concentrate on lots of "splodey" targets, making sure the gun is handy, and doing the cleaning on it for her. We live out in the country, so she could blow off a couple of magazines waiting for the coffeemaker, for instance.
Thanks, all! Keep the advice coming!
January 19th, 2008 12:27 PM
Stay away from the DAO J-Frames and Sp-101s, if she doesn't like the gun SHE'S NOT GOING TO SHOOT IT!
And for finger strength she needed both hands to dry-fire a stock SP-101
The Bersa Thunder .380 is still pretty light, my Colt Mustangs are smaller but heavier and have softer recoil.
The first gun that comes to mind for her is the Beretta Cheetah, it's a heavier double stack or single stack (pending on model) .380 and can be fired from C&L for a nice trigger pull, and has a not too heavy recoil spring, so slide manipulation should be OK. But you should possibly get her a grip master for helping with her grip strength.
As for the noise, everyone is dead on, have her double up using plugs and muffs.
Were you shooting in-door? If so It's a VERY good idea to double up, as the acoustics of shooting indoors has always bothered me too and I generally double up with plugs and muffs.
Also, make sure that her muffs are fitting properly and that there's no gaps between her ears and the cups of the muffs.
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