The .22lr as a self defense round and my options?
This is a discussion on The .22lr as a self defense round and my options? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; What's up guy's, I've been away for a month or so.
Ok, here's my problem. I'm trying to get my wife to carry(at least most ...
August 28th, 2008 03:36 PM
The .22lr as a self defense round and my options?
What's up guy's, I've been away for a month or so.
Ok, here's my problem. I'm trying to get my wife to carry(at least most of the time) and here is what I've come up with.
She has shot my .40 a couple of times ( 6or7 rounds) and has put about 35 rounds through a Rossi M88 .38 but never any +p.
Well I had a chance last weekto get a no-lock new 642 , and quickly made a swap on my Rossi for a $700.00 dog kennel that I needed. I think I came out ahead on that one
I got her to put maybe 20 rounds through the 642 before she was tired of shooting.She didn't do bad but she can't help to jerk that trigger
She wants to shoot it some more before she will consider carrying it, and she needs to.
Under perfect conditions follow up shot's would be slow and that jerk would be a lot worse under STRESS.
So, I ran across a Sig Mosquito at one of my toy stores the other day and you know how things tend to follow you home
I have been wanting a new Sig since my last one melted and the practice price of .22lr is nice.
Well I present her with her new present (Tues.)and the Sig is extremely complicated to her by having more then one button on it
Well I show her the complete operation of everything and off to shoot we go.
Well Sig recommends cci mini-max for it,but I also brought along some Rem Hi-velocity for it(there about the same fps).
First off We never had a problem with any of the cci rounds , but more then half off the rem I shot through it jammed.
So a CCI diet is all it will get from now on
After about 200 rounds she could put 11 in your chest from 15 yds in about 5secs, and she had fun
She wants to shoot it some more but said she would carry it
I'm going to have her put about 500 + rounds through it in the next week or so( and about the same for me)
By that time I'm pretty sure she and I will be confident in it .
The next batch will be CCI Stingers to see if it will eat those, 32 gr. 1600 fps.
Hopefully I can get her to move up to a .380 or 9 sometime in the future but will take what I can get for now.
CCI also makes what's called a Quick Shok that is 32 grs, runs about 1600fps and splits into three pieces on contact (ouch).
Now I have me a 642 bug
Should I stay with the 40gr mini-max 1200 fps or the Stingers 32 gr 1600 fps or the Quick Shock 32 gr 1600 fps that splits(assuming it likes all those flavors) which one would you carry?
Sorry, I will get pics up soon.
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August 28th, 2008 04:45 PM
August 28th, 2008 05:02 PM
I have had remington bulk box jam in all my 22's even 10/22's I shoot the federal bulk box and they feed flawlessly in all my 22's you might give them a try
"Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country,"
--Mayor Marion Barry, Washington , DC .
August 28th, 2008 05:04 PM
Ok folks , first off a J frame simth ( any j frame ) is likely a bad choice for your lady who wants to be protected and not really bother with the whole gun thing . A small reveolver is hard to hit with much less the idiots who put a " hurtyourhaneum .357 in a wifes hands .
Hand your wife dont want a " cute " gun , nor does she want a " good enough for massad " gun . She wants a gun that she can shoot which will put the fella in your house down right now , be that outside your kid's door or outside yours . a .22 will sure nuff kill anyone , its likely not to do it fast enough tho .
Make sure you get full value out of today , Do something worthwhile, because what you do today will cost you one day off the rest of your life .
We only begin to understand folks after we stop and think .
Criminals are looking for victims, not opponents.
August 28th, 2008 05:16 PM
If I could get the 25 rd mag to feed reliably in my 10/22 I would get my wife to use that, 25 rds of .22 is going to hurt a lot!
August 28th, 2008 05:23 PM
I don't have a good answer for your bullet preference options, though if jamming has been a problem I'd give some serious thought to selecting a bullet that is extremely reliable in that gun. Also .22's tend to shoot extra dirty, be sure it's clean.
I think you are right, if you can build her confidence with the .22 then you might be able to advance her gradually to more suitable calibers. My wife is not a shooter, though she does CCW. I bought her a 642 because of the simplicity...... she requested an "un-complicated" gun. I never mentioned that the lightweight frame would have an extra bit of recoil. She's shot it plenty and never mentioned it or complained about it. YMMV. Her little 642 may not be great for 50 foot shots, but it's very doubtful she'll be attempting anything beyond 20 feet. Within 20 feet I don't want to be in front of her at all.
Turn the election's in 2014 to a "2A Revolution". It will serve as a 1994 refresher not to "infringe" on our Second Amendment. We know who they are now.........SEND 'EM HOME. Our success in this will be proportional to how hard we work to make it happen.
August 28th, 2008 06:08 PM
Anyone considering using the 22lr as a defensive round in my opinion, needs to practice twice as much and the rest of us. Point being......body shots are questionable...head shots tend to bounce off, or travel around the skull under the skin. Best place to hit and be effective is the throat. Plain and simple...if you can consistently hit a golf ball at 10yds with a 22lr, you can hit the throat on a BG. That alone would be the most effective defensive use of the 22lr. Hittin' them in the eye has been discussed before...but it is sort of a demanding task to complete. Know where your chosen tools will be effective. First on the list would be a highly dependable firearm....next would be a highly dependable cartridge. Nothing wrong with 40gr lead RN compared to hi-vel HP in my opinion.
August 28th, 2008 07:20 PM
Most of the time, a SD situation is resolved without firing a shot. Just having a gun is enough to send the BG on his merry way. In the relatively small percentage of cases where shooting is required, many BGs will quit the attack after being shot at or hit. So in all of these situations, a .22 would be a fine tool.
In a few cases, nothing less than total incapacitation will stop the attack, and with a .22, very exact shot placement is the only way to acheive this. Your .22 will probably allow the police to catch your murderer a few days later when he is forced to seek medical help or they find his body.
If the choice is between a .22 and a pistol in a major caliber, the .22 is a poor choice. However, if it is a choice between a .22 and going unarmed, the .22 is a big winner.
"If we loose Freedom here, there's no place to escape to. This is the Last Place on Earth!" Ronald Reagan
August 28th, 2008 07:25 PM
+1 on the .22 shooting dirty, I have to religiously clean the wifes p22 to ensure reliability.
"In those days, there was a lot more respect for other people and it showed in peoples values.... Today the word value means nothing more than something you get on the $1 menu at McDonald's." -BARK'N
August 28th, 2008 07:25 PM
I have taught many women to shoot. Many of them felt that the recoil, loudness, and the hand manipulations were to much for them to bear at first.
With the proper training, even a caliber like the 9MM becomes easy to shoot.
Most Police Dept's Will recommend no less than a .38 special for self defense purposes. The reasons are many. If one has to shoot in self defense, there are always abnormal circumstances involved. It could be that they are hopped up on Cocaine, or Meth or even drunk. They could be crashing and looking for money for another high. In any case, although I'll be the first to admit that a .22 is better than nothing, it is by no means an adequate caliber for self defense. Sure it has killed many and will continue to do so.
A self defense situation needs a caliber that will stop right now, right then. Since the use of any handgun is a compromise anyway, why use what sits at the bottom of the list?
She just needs the proper training to become proficient with a caliber that is a known fight stopper. If you can give her that training, fine. If you don't know where to begin, find an Instructor to help her out. Do it for the both of you.
Self Defense is not something to take lightly. It can be a matter of life or death.
I would rather stand against the cannons of the wicked than against the prayers of the righteous.
AR. CHL Instr. 07/02 FFL
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August 28th, 2008 07:35 PM
Kahr MK9 or a S&W 640 with regular .38's. Those won't hurt and are mild shooting weapons.
.22 is better than nothing but the failure rate for .22 ammo is terrible compared to all centerfire handgun ammo and the Sig .22 doesn't have the best reputation for reliability. It's also quite a bit larger than the two choices I mentioned and will be that much harder to conceal.
However, if that's her mind, that's her mind.
August 28th, 2008 08:05 PM
Let her shoot the heck out of the .22 at the range and build up some confidence. It will be easy to progress up to a .380/9mm if the missus likes the feel of the semi.
As for carrying today - if it's the 22 or nothing, the 22 it is. Just be sure she has a good method to carry (in a holster, not loose in a purse, not full of dustbunnies, etc). Also, be sure to rotate the 22 ammo frequently (is cheap enough) and be absolutely positive that she can handle clearing a jam.
August 28th, 2008 08:28 PM
I had the same problem, Remington bulk box jams EVERY time and Federal bulk box shoots perfectly.
Originally Posted by dukalmighty
August 28th, 2008 08:30 PM
I would consider having her try a revolver, my wife can't stand the recoil on anything larger than .22 in a semiautomatic, but has no problems with her .38 special.
August 28th, 2008 08:37 PM
A .22 is not my first choice for a defensive firearm, but it IS better than nothing. I carry one daily...not by choice, but because it has to be carried deeply concealed. As for ammo, I would consider the CCI Minimags as long as they are reliable. I know what they can do to a squirrel and a ground hog...the exit wound is impressive.
You can never have enough magazines or ammo.
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