October 9th, 2008 11:25 AM
OK so most people agree that the .45 GAP was an exercise in Gaston's ego to get his name on a cartridge and/or an answer to the question nobody was asking. However, of the few people I have talked with that have shot this cartridge, they say it is very accurate and pleasant to shoot. They say it makes as much sense to them as .357 SIG does. It doesnt seem to have a very....at least vocal following, on here. Anybody have an opinion?
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October 9th, 2008 12:11 PM
October 9th, 2008 12:19 PM
I'm not 100% sure about this BUT I had read that the 45GAP in its hottest loading only matches 45ACP ballistics at standard pressure. Once you get into the +p range (which is able to utilize the extra space of the ACP brass that the GAP obviously lacks because itís a shorter casing) the 45ACP yields better ballistics.
Originally Posted by Tangle
October 9th, 2008 12:22 PM
October 9th, 2008 07:23 PM
If that 1911 .45 gap had made the market I would have a .45 Gap
October 9th, 2008 10:51 PM
I had a Glock 37, which is in 45 GAP and loved it. The only reason I got rid of it is the cost of ammo and lack of availability. I had to mail order all my supply of it. If I ran out running to wally world was not an option. If it wasn't for that than I would still have it.
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
October 9th, 2008 11:11 PM
And thats the big problem with it. I think the GAP is a solution looking for a problem.
Originally Posted by mike_1
October 10th, 2008 12:21 AM
The .45 GAP has almost identical ballistics to the .45 ACP.
Here's an example. I'll post the fastest "safe" 230gr FMJ load for both cartridges as listed on ReloadAmmo.com:
230gr FMJ @ 850fps over 5.8gr WSF powder, overall length no more than 1.070 in. 369ft/lb muzzle energy.
.45 ACP (non +P):
230gr FMJ @ 850 fps over 6.1gr Unique powder, OAL no more than 1.260 in. 369ft/lb muzzle energy. (identical to the GAP load)
.45 ACP (+P):
230gr FMJ @ 927fps over 8.7gr No 5. powder, OAL no more than 1.260 in. 438ft/lb muzzle energy.
Now, in all fairness, .45 GAP was designed to match normal-pressure .45 ACP loads, so comparing .45 GAP to .45 ACP +P might not be a perfectly fair comparison. However, .45 ACP is more versatile because of the wider range of bullet velocities available.
This page has a good comparison between .45 ACP and .45 GAP:
.45GAP (.45 GAP): Comparison with .45 ACP +P Ammo
Now let's look at ammo prices.
Surprisingly, the price of FMJ ammo seems to be about the same ($350 for 1,000 rounds on Ammoman.com), although hollowpoints are definitely cheaper for the ACP than the GAP.
However, the real difference, I think, is in ammo availability. Although during "peaceful times" .45 GAP is stocked at most sporting goods stores, in any kind of civil unrest I think you'd have a much easier time finding .45 ACP than .45 GAP.
So to review...
.45 ACP is more versatile, more powerful, more widely available, about the same price for practice ammo, and a little cheaper for defensive ammo.
.45 GAP is smaller and allows for a smaller-framed pistol, but has less power and versatility, could be harder to find during rough times, and can be more expensive.
Not much of a contest in my mind. However, that's just my two cents and I'm always open to contrasting opinions.
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October 10th, 2008 02:29 AM
I think you hit the nail on the head as far as why this round was ever developed... to put the power of a 45 cartridge into a 9mm sized pistol. Until VERY recently, if you wanted to carry a pistol chambered in .45, you had to settle for a bigger, heavier gun over a similar one chambered in 9mm/40 S&W. What the 45 GAP did was give manufacturers the ability to use the same frame for all their "big" calibers and gave shooters the ability to use a larger round in a smaller, lighter pistol. The problem is we are creatures of habit, we've gotten use to the 45 ACP (it has been around for 100 years now) and the GAP doesn't offer any significant change over the ACP rd. There are also so many guns chambered for the 45 ACP that unless there is some dramatic change, most people will simply say why change when the current round works.
Originally Posted by Tangle
Personally, I think the GAP is a fine round and will perform as well as the ACP all things being equal. The advantage the 45 GAP has over the 45 ACP - and the reason I can see the round sticking around - is the ability to use the GAP in smaller pistols than possible with the 45 ACP. While I doubt it will ever replace the 45 ACP, I think it will find it's nitch like the 10mm did after the 40 S&W came along, especially among people wanting smaller, lighter pistols for concealed carry that still have the full stopping power of a 45.
"... Americans... we want a safe home, to keep the money we make and shoot bad guys." -- Denny Crane
October 10th, 2008 09:46 AM
I particularly don' t care for small pistols or Glock so won't be making use of the .45 GAP. Most folks aren't like me so it probably has a place in the overall scheme of things.
October 10th, 2008 11:42 AM
The NYSP switched to the GAP about a year ago, they have had several shootings that I know of, most if not all were 1 shot stops with 200 grain Gold Dot standard pressure cartridge. I believe several other SP agencies have or are going to switch. The data base is small, but at least it looks interesting....John
October 10th, 2008 02:05 PM
My EDC is a G38 in .45 GAP and I love it. The G38 is as accurate as my 1911's, and I shoot it almost as fast. The recoil of the 230 's is mild, the 185 and 200's can have a bit more snap but very controllable.
I purchased a GAP gun because I live in California which has a 10 round maximum mag capacity law. The thought of buying a 15 round gun and putting nurtured 10 round mags in it makes me sick. I went with the G38 rather than the G37 because I shot it better.
The +p argument in regards to the comparison to ACP is mute in my book, as I never use +p loadings in my ACP guns. If I want a faster bullet, I step down in bullet weight, +p 230's are hard on guns.
My only complaint about the GAP round is local off the shelf availability.
I love my GAP.
October 10th, 2008 02:14 PM
Originally Posted by john452
I'm more of a fan of 357 SIG for Highway Patrol Agencies due to it's barrier penetration capabilities.
As far as a 45 sized bullet, I'll stick with the old ACP due to it's availability and the variety of ammo available.
October 10th, 2008 07:40 PM
.45 ACP vs .45 GAP?
I looked...not impressed...not much of a space saver...not as easy to find...more expensive.
All my carry pistols...expensive enough...already have thousands of rounds...plenty effective...easy to find.
When I travel, I can grab 2-3 pistols and a couple boxes of the same .45 ACP ammo......works for me.
Stay armed...don't want too many calibers to stock, and I like my good 'ole .45's...stay safe!
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October 10th, 2008 11:04 PM
I like 357 Sig. Never shot 45GAP. The only thing that turns me off is real basic. Price... Sure all ammo is going up, but those two can get pretty pricey.
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