USP v. USPc (45's)

USP v. USPc (45's)

This is a discussion on USP v. USPc (45's) within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Okay, here I am in North Florida for Christmas with the in-laws. Temps in the 20's at night and wonderful (compared to Miami). On the ...

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Thread: USP v. USPc (45's)

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array ExSoldier's Avatar
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    Question USP v. USPc (45's)

    Okay, here I am in North Florida for Christmas with the in-laws. Temps in the 20's at night and wonderful (compared to Miami). On the way out of town yesterday, I stopped in the next county up from my home to pick up my new gun, the H&K USP 45 standard size. Three 12rd mags came with it. My wife got me (I'm not supposed to know) a "Concealable" model holster from Galco.

    Well, first off, it was the wrong model. I specified the LEM and I got the variation ONE. Next thing I noticed was how B-I-G the durn thing is. About the size and heft of the Glock M21. That's unloaded. I put 12 230gr Golden Sabers into the mag and it felt like I was holding the Rock of Gibralter in my hand. I could only imagine the weight PLUS a spare loaded mag, all sitting on my hips. Next, the trigger pull is just a TAD bit longer than my finger can comfortably reach. OTOH, in my hands (both) in a firing grip, I can just sense it's accuracy. It feels really good in a Weaver stance.

    My buddy who got it for me, said to carry it over the holidays (it was signed over to me by the transferring FFL) and if I wanted something else, we could just send it right back, and I wouldn't have to pay any shipping or handling fees.

    So now I'm thinking about the USP compact, with the LEM trigger and night sights.

    Anybody know about this gun in a 45? How does it compare in size to the full size? Can somebody post a pic of them side by side? More importantly, will the compact fit into a holster made for the bigger version? Otherwise, I guess we could exchange the holster for the other size.

    I also understand that the compact does not have the recoil reduction system of the bigger version. What's the recoil of the compact in comparison to the larger version or say to a 45 of similar size? I'm not at all recoil sensitive, just wondering.

    Does anybody know of the reliability of the compact? A lot of folks I know have said that if there were any gun "ready for WAR" right out of the box, it would be the USP. I was wondering if that also applied to the compact?

    Since I'm not at home and sharing this computer, I'll have to just come back and check the thread, because I won't get the e-mail alerts.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    XD45 Man! I bet it'll be the answer to your prayers!

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    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    ill wait till i see the xd45 and get a feel of it before i can tell anyone to buy it .. Certainly not like a Hk and Hk's have good resale value

  4. #4
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    I dunno, his problem is that it's too big right? Or is it more the weight?

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    Sorry I can't help with a side-by-sde comparison. I've gotten my hands on a full-size .40, and it wielded like a brick. The compact is "large" for a compact, but at least it's smaller than the full-size. I don't have too much trouble concealing my .45 compact.

    I've found it to be the "softest" shooting .45 I've ever gotten my hands on, which is why I tote it instead of a 1911 (runs from Bruce). It's also no problem one-handed. So if my teeny little wrists and hands can handle it, I'm sure your man-hands will be just fine.

    My USPC has been extremely reliable.

    I found a size comparison here.

    **added: I changed my link for a better size comparison.
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    "Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa

  6. #6
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    Hks are fairly Big and the compact doesnt seem too much smaller in 45 at least to me they didnt

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    The compacts are not much smaller at all. I like the longer site radius of the full size. Also , if the DA trigger pull is too long, what will the LEM trigger pull be like? I have not handled a LEM version. I wore my HK USP .40 full size and a spare mag. all day today, and have for quite a while. If ya get a good holster it is very comfortable. I find my DA pull a bit long, so my first shot may go a bit left(LH Shooter) . As far as compact reliability , never saw a hiccup with my girlfriends Compact.

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    Thanks to Betty, I found an answer in this quote from the article link:

    The full-size USP and the Compact are not just "chopped and channeled" versions of each other; they are different in proportion, shape and contour. First, the slide is longer, both in the barrel-length direction and in the slide behind the ejection port. The triggerguard is larger. The grip portion of the frame is larger and not as comfortable as the Compact to hold and shoot. The Compact is smaller in circumference, and I find it to be more comfortable to shoot despite its smaller size. Also, the magazines are not interchangeable. The Compact was shipped with steel magazines while the Standard had polymer magazines. Neither would fit in the other.

    I was also impressed with Betty's pic of the draw sequence from concealed under a T-shirt to a speed rock position. Of course, hers is a 40 and the 45 will be a tad larger, but then I'm a "tad larger" (lol) than Betty! With a slightly smaller frame size, I should have no problem with the LEM trigger pull and my reach.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

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    Exclamation Both

    Quote Originally Posted by Euclidean
    I dunno, his problem is that it's too big right? Or is it more the weight?
    Too B-I-G and too heavy. Geeze, it feels like it should be towed on wheels!
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  10. #10
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    its not tat heavy Ex lighter than a 1911

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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by Bud White
    its not tat heavy Ex lighter than a 1911
    Perception is everything. Because the 1911 is SA, I can reach the trigger much easier and it's not double stacked (except for the PO). I find it difficult to believe that a double stack H&K is lighter than a single stack 1911 when both are loaded.
    Former Army Infantry Captain; 25 yrs as an NRA Certified Instructor; Avid practitioner of the martial art: KLIK-PAO.

  12. #12
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    Ok Hk weighs 1.65#'s Empty
    the 1911 loaded Springer 2.37 #'s Empty

    so the 1911 weighs almost 3/4's of a pound more all ready

    According to midway a box of speer self defense ammo weighs in at 1 pound

    so add little over 1/2 pound to the HK your at

    Around 2.45#'s

    In 1911 ill go 1/2 # also

    make it 3.17 #'s so Hk is still lighter even dropping a few round wont put ya in same weight range

    Now as to trigger length of pull i understand what your saying a personal preferance

  13. #13
    Senior Member Array older gunner's Avatar
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    Ex, Since you're re-evaluating your situation, let me throw another thought at you. Now, I don't mean to start a war here, but have you really carefully considered a .40 cal? You can deliver 165gr to 180gr slugs at over 500 ft-lbs of energy from several ammo manufacturers. Those ballistics equal a .357 mag round, which has always been considered a premier defense round. I know the .45 supporters will defend their choice admirably, and I'm not denying the effectiveness of the .45 cal, but I feel the .40 can be just as effective and gives the advantage of larger capacity.
    I'm 6' and 230 lbs, and can conceal both my USPf and my USPc, but the compact is very easy to carry and conceals excellently with a Galco NSAII400. I have an IWB for the full size from Ray's Holsters here in Largo. The compact will fit, but not as well as I'd like. It is slightly loose, so I don't mix the holsters.
    Since you are in a slight quandry, why not at least handle a .40 compact and give it a real looking over. I'm satisfied the .40 cal will perform well for any defensive need. Good luck and Merry Christmas.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Array rfurtkamp's Avatar
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    I tried both the USPc and fullsize in 45 - the compact just didn't feel right for me but the fullsize was like they'd built it to my specs. A lot of folks complain about the size, but it's functionally no bigger than my Sigs.

    My one complaint when firing is I can feel the magazine weight drop - loaded, the mag represents a sizable percentage of the platform's overall weight. It's disconcerting if I think about it. If I'm shooting it, I don't care.

    It and the S&W 4506 are the only 45ACP handguns I've stayed in love with for any length of time.

    I'd rather keep my Sigs, as I'm comfortable with them and know what I'm getting, but if I wanted a 45 for carry it'd probably be the USP unless Sig finally did a hi-cap 220.
    Driver carries less than $45 worth of remorse.

  15. #15
    Senior Member Array firefighter4884's Avatar
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    Ex,

    I own my USPc in .40 and I've shot the range .40 USP. I definately perfer my USPc, but that could just be because of the amount of wear and tear on the range gun. I'm not sure.

    --Jim
    Firefighter / EMT - Always Ready. Ever Willing.

    ~Never do anything that you don't want to have to explain to the paramedics...~

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