I don't understand why people assume any type of ammunition won't disable an attacker effectively. Consider the basics. You have a hard material (lead,metal,etc.) that is coming at a human being at least 700 FPS in most cases. That would hurt! I wouldn't want to get shot with a pellet out of a pellet gun much less a projectile out of some sort from a firearm. I don't buy a whole lot of stock in folks that say such and such wouldn't be powerful enough to disable an attacker. The key to the level of disablement is all about bullet placement such as throat, eyes, etc. I mean sure a .357 or .44 would do the job, but you could even carry a .22, .25, or .32 and still be fine.
....ever get hurt really bad?
Your brain has an "auto-shutoff" for excruciating pain for a while after you get damaged. It's a beautiful thing.
Lot's of other things come into play as well. Thing's maybe a medic or doctor could explain better. I am neither. I am the guy they have to patch up constantly. I know pain. (I have the medical file to prove it)
...and no I have not been shot, thank god.
My point is, don't put ANY faith into pain even slowing anyone down.
I'm not saying you can't get it done with any round out there. Just that the bigger and more jagged your projectile is, the more likely that you will damage somthing key to your opponent's physical structure, breathing capability, or immediate massive blood loss.
BTW, i carry a 9mm, my wife carries a .380, so.....no big bore bias here.
I'm just saying what i know.
would like to hear from any of those who have (most unfortunately) been on the wrong end of a bullet.
Gunfighter, have you ever been in a gun fight?
Trying to effectively hit the throat,eyes,etc when someone is charging you, shooting at you, trying to KILL you is an excellent way to meet your maker.
Consider the basics.
If some thug wants to display your scalp on his wall, chances are excellent that he will be higher than a kite, drunker than Cooter Brown, madder than Satan himself, or perhaps he just wants to kill as many people as possible before killing himself. He may be on a 4 day cruise on Meth, and may actually find pain( his and yours)a pleasurable experience. He may be on a such an adrenaline high that he could fall off a 3 story building and walk several miles on two broken legs.
And you wanto engage this dude with a .22 or other pipsqueak round and you think it'll be just fine?
To each his own. Good luck with your next encounter.
Because real life encounters have shown many people do not instantly drop from gun shot(s). If any caliber would instantly incapacitate humans why do PD's and military use larger caliber guns?
I would suggest you start a google search on stopping power, one shot stops and such.
The body has a way of shutting pain off. Not everybody will experience this but it does happen. I broke both of my legs at once and there was very little pain involved until the paramedics were removing me from the van. I wassn't on anything either. If an attacker was on something then the likelyhood of a one shot stop is dramatically reduced with the smaller caliber round. I choose to carry large bore pistols for this reason.
I have been shot and it hurt a lot, put me on the ground instantly, but it wasn’t in a gun fight.
Have you ever been in a fist fight, had a few good punches landed on you and you just barely feel it? But when someone accidently bumps you in the nose, head, eye, whatever it hurts much worse?
Hmmm, I don't think your argument would hold water with the Deputy in my old department who lost his life because the well placed shots of 9mm Ranger SXT's from both him and his partner did not put the bad guy down fast enough. None of the bullets that were COM or in the THROAT penetrated beyond a 1/2". Fortunately, one of the bullets managed to spin around the neck under the BG skin and pinched a nerve in his neck and paralyzed him, which ended the fight. The BG died from lung falure due to his lungs being unable to evacuate the fluid that accumalated in them. He did not die from a fatal bullet wound.
Yea, I would say that caliber and performance are a huge consideration. That department changed its policies afterwards and said no more 9mm's or equivalents.
I think he's trying to tweak everyone here, just to see the reaction. Or perhaps he's completely new and has never read anything here or on any similar board, or any articles at all. I guess that's possible.
Handgun calibers, large ones in fact, are not good at stopping someone with one, two or several hits. I read once about a guy who absorbed 17 9mm rounds and still severely beat one of the police officers who was shooting him.
It all depends on what drug the bad guy has in his system, his muscle mass, his level of adrenalin in his blood stream, if he is an Emotionally Disturbed person (Crazy people do not perceive pain in the same way sane people do) if he is drunk or not and, honestly, his level of simple mean-ness.
There is no guarantee that a .357 magnum round will stop someone who really is charged up and coming at you. But I sure would rather be launching .357's or .40's at them than .22 or .25's.
All things being considered, a handgun is really only suited to help you fight your way to your rifle.
I've actually seen a clip of a cop on a dashcam shot an x-boxer in the chest with a 40 that jammed afterwards and the BG never flinched but kept chasing the cop til backup got there
When you're under attack, you want to try to immediately stop the BG from attacking you. A small caliber bullet may kill the BG but death may be a long time coming. Sure, it makes a hole in him and he may bleed to death, but in the meantime, he could still be hurting you or your loved ones. A larger caliber bullet, fired into Center of Mass, will create a large wound channel through organs and create a dynamic wave to disrupt other nearby organs to such an extent that one shot can completely incapacitate him and take him out of the fight, right now.
For reliable one shot stops, you probably need a rifle or a shotgun. In handguns, police experience shows that .40's and .45's deliver one-shot stops 90-95% of the time. 9mm and .38 spl about 80%. .357 Magnum somewher in between those. With anything smaller than 9mm, plan on using the whole magazine, then running away. (Suggested Calibers & Loads)
When you're injured, the only way to naturally stop the pain is either the rush of the moment (good for maybe 15 minutes) or going into shock. Otherwise, you're in it for the duration. I know from personal experience. The pain lasted for well over two hours before I had the best feeling I've ever experienced: no pain! Two syringes of morphine have that effect. (And I never even touched alcohol or smokes so I had no tolerance to narcotics.)
Ever made a well placed shot at a deer, have it torn up badly internally, yet it still runs 1/4 mile before it drops?
Guys, you're missing the point. I see your point of view, but lots of times you read threads on the internet and they say don't use small little rounds like a .22 because they wouldn't stop an attacker. Read ballistic charts on .22 ammo. The average energy of a .22 is roughly 350 ft. lbs. Do your research. A 9MM has roughly 352 ft. lbs, a .380 has roughly 200 ft. lbs. and a .38 Special has roughly 250 ft. lbs. Before being too quick to debate this issue consider the fact a .22 is a firearm round. You can easily find multitudes of reports of people killed by small caliber bullets. I love my guns just as much as you guys, and for the record I carry 2 .40 cal pistols loaded with Hydra-Shok bullets, a .380 with HP ammo, and a .32 derringer with silver tip HP ammo. Do I carry a .22? No. However, you can't debate the fact it would not kill someone. Heck, there are stories where people fall off mountains and live, get attacked by sharks and live, etc. There are always exceptions. But show me documented proof that noone has ever been killed by a .22 and I will admit I was wrong.