I want to see a copy of the Grendel P30.
This is a discussion on Why not Copy a Rohrbugh? within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Pocket pistols are all the rage now with gun makers producing a new .380 every week. Since both Ruger and Taurus make so many copies ...
Pocket pistols are all the rage now with gun makers producing a new .380 every week.
Since both Ruger and Taurus make so many copies of other manufacter's handguns, many times improving them at a fraction of the cost, let's see a copy of a Rohrburgh.
9mm in a handgun smaller than a Kahr and only slightly larger than a Ruger LCP. I am sure they could produce this gun for a price less than the Rohrburgh's $1300.00
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For one thing, the Rohrbaugh is almost certainly still under patent since it's so new. For another, when you cut corners on such a complicated piece of machinery that is so small, it will definitely affect reliability. You can't lower prices without cutting corners somewhere. The Rohrbaugh works reliably because it's built to exacting tolerances; those don't come cheap, not even with modern CNC machinery.
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The R9 has a very refined frame, grips, and other external "asthetic" components that prove to be very pricey. If a different company (such as taurus) copied the R9 design, they could save uber money by using different materials, such as poly instead of carbon fiber on the grips.
Also, many people perform a complete fluff and buff after purchasing a cheaper pocket pistol. External casting marks are not a concern for me when looking for a new firearm, as long as the important operating mechanisms are not compromised.
I'm married to my Kahr.
Why would you copy a thousand dollar gun that needs a new recoil spring every 100 rounds?
Maybe Sig could copy the Colt Mustang....................that's the ticket!
The Rohrbaugh was designed to be the smallest possible firearm capable of handling the 9mm cartridge.
You buy it with the understanding that you ARE buying a trade-off firearm.
You are buying minimum weight smallest package possible for the 9mm.
If switching out the mainspring every 100 rounds is what is needed then that is really not a major inconvenience.
The reason being that the Rohrbaugh was never designed as a competition, range, or target shooting firearm.
It was designed to be the easiest, lightest "daily carry package" possible for the 9mm.
It was originally intended to be shot little and carried a lot.
Some will argue...Why should I spend a Thousand Dollars Plus for a gun that I can't shoot the heck out of?
The answer is:
If that is what you want it for ~ you shouldn't buy one.
But, if you were a business man and wanted a nice, light, flat, TINY, powerful 9mm handgun that you could always have with you & one that could easily be casually slipped into the handkerchief pocket of your suit coat...it would be a firearm well worth the investment.
For what it's worth, Rohrbaugh recommends spring replacement around 200 rounds, according to my owners' manual.
And there you have it.But, if you were a business man and wanted a nice, light, flat, TINY, powerful 9mm handgun that you could always have with you & one that could easily be casually slipped into the handkerchief pocket of your suit coat...it would be a firearm well worth the investment.
Why wait for a copy of the Rohrbaugh that will be inherently cheaply made (which is why the OP wants a copy), when you can buy one right now that is the pinnacle of compact design and reliability in a 9mm.
I've had mine a few months and it has ended up being my primary carry pistol, not just a "tiny" pistol that I could take with me when I dressed too light to carry something bigger.
As far as the replacement of the recoil spring, the current springs are recommended to be replaced every 200 rounds. But here's some facts to consider:
1. A new recoil spring costs $5.00. The two hundred rounds of SD ammo you'll shoot to reach that number will cost between $100 to $200. So what's the problem with the cost of a spring?
2. Every, and I mean every ultra-compact semi-auto in any "heavy" caliber should routinely have it's recoil spring replaced in order to insure it's reliability. The reason for that is not because the springs used are "cheap", but because a very short recoil spring takes a whollop that larger pistols with longer springs don't have to endure. It's the physics of springs and all that stuff.
Imagine having a pogo stick used by a 50 lb. 9 year old as compared to one used by an overweight, 220 lb. adult. Which pogo stick (spring) do you think would need replacement real soon?
3. As has been mentioned, the R9 is not a range gun, or a plinker, or a competition pistol. It's a hybrid, self-defense pistol pure and simple.
In order to build a pistol that compact that will fire 9mm and be reliable when you need it, compromises in design have to be made.
If the only "drawback" is that a $5 recoil spring be replaced every couple of years, then so be it.
When I bought my R9s Stealth, I ordered half a dozen recoil springs at the same time. Those six springs will very likely last me years and years...
Everybody wants the best for the cheapest, but as one of the "businessmen" referred to in the above quote, I found that my Stealth is a very worthwhile investment and worth every penny.
Best yet, I was able to buy one right now and not wait for some copy-cat company to water it down and make it cheaper all the while "advertising" that their product is "just like" the finely tuned Rohrbaugh.
I've never been a sucker for a cheap sales pitch, and I see no reason to start now.
Just suck it up, man. Spend the money and get the real thing.
One problem I see with the Rohrbugh: with the super short barrel, ballistics are only marginally more than what you get from a modern high performance load in a P-3AT or LCP in .380.
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They don't get much smaller than the Rohrbaugh 9mm. Mine was pretty accurate at CQB thru 25 yard distances.
What we've got here is failure to communicate.
Maybe because the man was near genius, and deserves to make a living off his idea. If you want to play in his league, pay the dues, otherwise KelTec makes some small guns.
I'm not a lawyer or a LEO, just a pantload with a computer.
Yeah, as others have said, the recoil spring thing is not a big deal - $5 and just takes a minute to swap out. And it isn't a question of materials, it is a question of exacting tolerances. That kind of careful machining and the quality necessary for withstanding the stresses involved costs money.
I have one of the earliest ones - serial number in the low 200s. Have shot and carried it off and on for years. I actually shoot my 642 better, so tend to carry that more when I want just a small pocket pistol. But when you need a lot of power in a really small package, you cannot beat the Rohrbaugh.