Man that's a trigger... - Page 2

Man that's a trigger...

This is a discussion on Man that's a trigger... within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I'll take it to the local range sometime and hope a certain employee is on duty... don't remember his name but he swears by Sigs ...

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  1. #16
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    I'll take it to the local range sometime and hope a certain employee is on duty... don't remember his name but he swears by Sigs and he could tell if something wasn't right. I'll see if he thinks there's anything wrong with it... That's part of the problem, I'm comparing it to the CZ and the Ruger and not another Sig.

    Heck for all I know I could have mud in there and don't realize it yet hehe.

    Damn this may become a project gun...

    "Hey can you guys work the kink out of this trigger?"

    "Sure, that's only about $125."

    "Hey that's great I'll have a custom Sig for $500..."

    "But man it looks like hell. We'll refinish it for $225."

    "Hmmmm can you hard chrome it, like a satin finish?"

    "Sure, but if you're going to do that, you can't tell me you're not going to get Trijicons installed..."

    "You know you're right, that would be stupid..."

    Hmmmm maybe I should put it away until I've paid off some of my other little projects...


  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Euclidean
    ...I'm trying to pretend like I have to fire every shot in the magazine DA though.
    You say that like that's a bad thing or incorrect. If you carry it, and you have to shoot it to defend yourself, the first, ever so important shot, will be what? DA! If we carry DA/SA, we need to practice DA. It's so easy to avoid DA in practice. You load a mag, rack the slide, and you're in SA. It's conceivable that many that train with a DA/SA rarely if ever shoot it DA.

    Quote Originally Posted by Euclidean
    ...I'm reading all this... I think I'm normal and so is my gun, we're just not used to each other yet.
    Euc is normal? Euc is normal? Oh well, I don't have time and space to debate that. But, that may be some of the problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Euclidean
    ...Seeing as how this isn't a primary CCW piece though, I think it'll be fine to just try it like it is for a while. If it gets to be intolerable, I feel I can easily recoup what I paid for it.
    It will be a CCW if you get a good trigger job.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Euclidean
    I'll take it to the local range sometime and hope a certain employee is on duty... don't remember his name but he swears by Sigs and he could tell if something wasn't right. I'll see if he thinks there's anything wrong with it... That's part of the problem, I'm comparing it to the CZ and the Ruger and not another Sig.

    Heck for all I know I could have mud in there and don't realize it yet hehe.

    Damn this may become a project gun...

    "Hey can you guys work the kink out of this trigger?"

    "Sure, that's only about $125."

    "Hey that's great I'll have a custom Sig for $500..."

    "But man it looks like hell. We'll refinish it for $225."

    "Hmmmm can you hard chrome it, like a satin finish?"

    "Sure, but if you're going to do that, you can't tell me you're not going to get Trijicons installed..."

    "You know you're right, that would be stupid..."

    Hmmmm maybe I should put it away until I've paid off some of my other little projects...
    LOL! "Projects" can spin out of control, that's for sure.

    A new finish, night sights, won't make the gun shoot better; I promise you a good trigger job will. You owe it to your self just this one time. Try it - it will make a difference. It'll change your mind about it's role in your SD plan.

    After shooting my 220 DA/SA in DA only, I discovered I shot it better DA than in SA. I changed my 226 to DAO thinking it would be the same effect - it wasn't. The 220 has got a better trigger system than a 226. Ernst Langdon says so too.

  4. #19
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    To make ya happy Euc ... you a weenie and need to learn how to squeeze a trigger..

    Qk is probley right of course most guns come oversprung now..

    Like stock 1911's to heavy a mainspring

  5. #20
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Okay there's a break in the case. I got a second opinion from someone who has a Sig and he told me in his opinion something weird was up.

    I finally got some time this weekend and I field stripped it. I'm not brave enough to detail strip a Sig but I did get in there with a magnifying glass and bore light. Only I didn't find anything so I switched to my Surefire, which is much brighter.

    Lo and behold, with the hammer in the cocked position, I could just barely make out the edges of a dark chocolate stain. I scratched a little bit of it off with the tip of a paper clip. It wasn't mud, it wasn't rust either, I have no idea what it was.

    Decocking the hammer, I could suddenly see more of... well, it.

    Working painstakingly, and using the edge of a sheet of paper to try to determine the depth of the stain, I realized that the reason I'd not seen it before was either I'm the one who put it there, or more likely because if I didn't have a 110 lumen light shining on it, I couldn't really see the stain effectively.

    I have no idea what this substance is or was. The tiny samples I did recover felt like grease, only gummier. I got off as much as I could by manipulating the hammer with one hand and cleaning with the other. I made my way as deep in as I could with the edge of a piece of notebook paper. Each time I drew the paper out, it had stuff on it.

    I sprayed the whole mess down with CLP and waited several hours (read cleaned Mom's pool for 6.5 hours) and went back to it and wiped out all the CLP. Then I gave it the Gunscrubber treatment, then wiped some more.

    I made my best effort at it again today with the same process, and my fingertips are black. I mean no disrespect to our resident officers here, but this Sig was a former police gun and I am confident it was not treated well.

    I think whatever that crap was, I dissolved it or else managed to scrape most of it out because it's WAY better now.

    My theory is, whatever this crap was, it was left in the gun before the gun was sold to the shop that sold it to me, and the visible portion of the deposit was cleaned up in the shop.

    Then when I cleaned it like normal, I either didn't notice it because it's dark and so is the frame, or because the visible portion had been wiped clean by the store.

    Okay so then I shoot a few rounds, and lo and behold the hammer is going back and forth and smearing this crap on the frame like some kind of defective windshield wiper, and suddenly it's getting smeared and gooshed all in the works there and giving me a fit... okay end of theory.

    I have no idea if some goo on the hammer between it and the frame could cause such a problem, but since cleaning it up the trigger is suddenly smoooooth.

    I'm thinking though that at minimum, if I ever press this one into service, I should opt for a professional cleaning.

  6. #21
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    My agency issues P229's and P239's in .40 S&W. My issue gun is the former....my experience with that gun and my agency's prior authorized weapon, a P228, leads me to agree with some of the opinions in this thread on the triggers of Sigs....a bit long and heavy in DA fire, but smooth; and nice and short and very reasonable in SA fire. My big problem is the length of the DA pull....it's too long for me with the standard trigger....I need a short trigger (my old duty P228 had one), but my regional firearms instructor/rangermaster isn't SIGARMS armorer trained....

    ....I wish my agency authorized/issued DAK triggered Sigs....I love those triggers!
    USAF: Loving Our Obscene Amenities Since 1947

  7. #22
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    Euc,

    That is strange; wonder what that could be?

    But, I said the trigger pull you described didn't sound right. It wasn't you after all and that's good because the gun's gonna work better now.

    Will carb cleaner (Gun Scrubber) take it off?

    Of course I'm sure yuu are aware if you use gun scrubber, it takes all the lube off.

  8. #23
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tangle
    Euc,

    That is strange; wonder what that could be?

    But, I said the trigger pull you described didn't sound right. It wasn't you after all and that's good because the gun's gonna work better now.

    Will carb cleaner (Gun Scrubber) take it off?

    Of course I'm sure yuu are aware if you use gun scrubber, it takes all the lube off.
    Actually Tangle I thought about it some more this morning and my thinking was since the problem seems to be gone, the Gun Scrubber was probably what did it.

    I hypothesize since the stuff does dissolve pretty much any cleaning or lubricant I've ever used, that the substance in there was something with a similar composition. I recalled the gummy feeling, and I wonder if someone didn't spray some WD40 or something else like that in there... 3 in 1 oil or something else that a non gunlover might put on a gun.

    I put some Hoppe's #9 into the action and let it set so that it could really drip down in there good and wiped off the excess this AM before putting it back in the safe. I'm not ready to pronounce the problem fixed until I get around to firing it again, which won't be for a while.

    I did try it again about a dozen times and it was slick and fairly light, consistent with the trigger pull on my CZ and better than the pull on the Ruger.

    Breakfree + Gunscrubber in my experience will clean all sorts of crap out of your gun, so I could have easily done something else that helped. I'm betting the previous owner seldom if ever cleaned it or didn't clean it with the proper products, but it just kept going anyway because hell, it's a Sig.

  9. #24
    Member Array Dave James's Avatar
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    "EUC",, sounds like your on the right track,, I have had Officers turn in theirs for the same thing,, normally found that they had not used the approved lube, and it was causing the action to gum up,,, two ways we where able to clean them just short of a complete strip down,, pop the grips off and laid it in an ultrsonic cleaner,, and the "Dunk-It" cleaner sold by Cylinder and slide....

    ONce we hammer into their heads not to use stuff like Hoppes, or cooking oil all was fine

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Euclidean
    Actually Tangle I thought about it some more this morning and my thinking was since the problem seems to be gone, the Gun Scrubber was probably what did it.

    I hypothesize since the stuff does dissolve pretty much any cleaning or lubricant I've ever used, that the substance in there was something with a similar composition. I recalled the gummy feeling, and I wonder if someone didn't spray some WD40 or something else like that in there... 3 in 1 oil or something else that a non gunlover might put on a gun.

    I put some Hoppe's #9 into the action and let it set so that it could really drip down in there good and wiped off the excess this AM before putting it back in the safe. I'm not ready to pronounce the problem fixed until I get around to firing it again, which won't be for a while.

    I did try it again about a dozen times and it was slick and fairly light, consistent with the trigger pull on my CZ and better than the pull on the Ruger.

    Breakfree + Gunscrubber in my experience will clean all sorts of crap out of your gun, so I could have easily done something else that helped. I'm betting the previous owner seldom if ever cleaned it or didn't clean it with the proper products, but it just kept going anyway because hell, it's a Sig.
    LOL! That all sounds right to me. WD-40 on a handgun - scary.

    Better than a Ruger? I've always been impressed with Ruger triggers so your Sig must have a pretty good trigger now.

    I've got an old police trade-in Sig 226. It has the finish worn off the right side of the trigger so the LEO that had it was right-handed and must have shot it a lot. It's got the best trigger in it I have ever seen and I can't figure out why unless a lot of shooting helps a lot.

    A buddy took that Sig to Blackwater when we went and shot 2500 rounds through it in a week (cleaned every day) and didn't have a single problem. Well, he did holster it cocked a couple of times.

  11. #26
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    it was hardened grease When i moved into a apartment while looking for a house i stored most of my handguns at mom and pops so that year they didn't get used much ..

    I only had about 3 handguns then so i kept a 1911 for home defense and cleaned and lubed my p-90 ruger with rig ..

    Well next year we got the house and it was time to shoot again ... The rig had turned solid i could barely retract the slide took me over 2 hours to clean that up..

    And it was about the color Euc said a brownish kind of looks like rust color.. I still use right sometimes as a general lube but not for storage

  12. #27
    VIP Member Array Euclidean's Avatar
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    I think that would make sense Bud. I did fire it just a little bit, and cleaned it again with the Gunscrubber/CLP/Hoppe's, and no problems. I even took it to my mom's house and took Dad's air compressor to it.

    It's made a huge difference cleaning that crud out of there. IT was really weird because before the first couple of pulls would be smooth and crisp and then it would bind up, and now it's like that every time you pull the trigger.

    If it was grease that would explain why the cleaning was so effective - the Gun Scrubber dissolves that stuff pretty readily.

  13. #28
    VIP Member Array Bud White's Avatar
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    Im telling ya that stuff that did it to me was like clay

  14. #29
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    If it's improved, repeat that process a few times over the next week, dry firing between cleanings.

    Make sure it's gone. ;0
    Driver carries less than $45 worth of remorse.

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