Not cutting it in the accuracy dept. :(

This is a discussion on Not cutting it in the accuracy dept. :( within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; For about the last month I have been carrying a PT709. I really do like this gun. It is extremely small and thin. Thin enough ...

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Thread: Not cutting it in the accuracy dept. :(

  1. #1
    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Not cutting it in the accuracy dept. :(

    For about the last month I have been carrying a PT709. I really do like this gun. It is extremely small and thin. Thin enough that I can conceal it OWB even in a t-shirt. I have had the gun to the range 4 times so far and put about 600 rounds through it. Yesterday I decided to do a bit of testing. I put a target at 10 feet, fired 7 rounds. Then put a fresh target at 20 feet and fired seven rounds. I did this all the way out to 50 feet. I took about a second and a half pause in between each shot. I then brought the targets home and measured from the farthest hole to the farthest hole on each target.

    My groups were as follows –

    10 - 2 inch
    20 - 3 inch
    30 - 4 inch
    40 - 7 inch
    50 - 10 inch

    I've read a lot of articles about defensive hand guns and accuracy and people shooting 3 inch groups at 25 yards. As you can tell I am no where near that. I had a couple of the much better shooters at the range shoot it and while their groups were better then mine past 30 feet they still weren’t what I would consider impressive.

    So I am considering going up to something with a 4 inch barrel. Specifically something in the 1911 platform. I shoot my Colt 1911 series 80 a lot better then this past 30 feet. I know it won't help a ton but hopefully it would tighten up my groups out past 40 feet. I know that the smaller the barrel the less sight radius and the less accurate most people will shoot the gun but I also know that higher quality guns with higher quality barrels are generally going to be more naturally accurate. What do you think?
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

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    Ex Member Array Ram Rod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
    What do you think?
    What do I think? Go Glock! Well.......you asked.

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    VIP Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    My groups at 25 yards with my RIA tactical is around 3.5 inches. A 1911 is a good choice IMO. It is my EDC.
    Don"t let stupid be your skill set....

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    JMHO.... I am a big Taurus fan the pt709 is a small self defense firearm it is not meant to be a target pistol. I carry a pt145 pro with Hinie sights daily can I drive tacks with it at 10 yards no....can I rapid fire 11 reload and put 10 more COM yes I think sometimes we forget what certain firearms are built for.

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    Distinguished Member Array Siafu's Avatar
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    Want thin? Walther PPS! A true German bullseye machine.

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    kpw
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    VIP Member Array kpw's Avatar
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    Did you bench the gun or just shoot offhand? Intrinsic accuracy doesn't do much good if the shooter can't take advantage of it. I have a hard time shooting small guns well. Put a long, heavyish trigger with a small grip and I can't hit the barn. Guess how much I enjoy shooting my P-32?
    "In a republic this rule ought to be observed: that the majority should not have the predominant power." -
    -- Marcus Tullius Cicero

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    Distinguished Member Array AKsrule's Avatar
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    ------------
    "My groups were as follows "

    10 - 2 inch
    20 - 3 inch
    30 - 4 inch
    40 - 7 inch
    50 - 10 inch
    ----------

    The Odds are enormous that you will NEVER have to shoot beyond 10 yards (30 feet ) to defend yourself.

    If you shoot better groups at a slower pace or with other guns I see no
    compelling reason to change your carry gun.

    -------
    -SIG , it's What's for Dinner-

    know your rights!
    http://www.handgunlaw.us

    "If I walk in the woods, I feel much more comfortable carrying a gun. What if you meet a bear in the woods that's going to attack you? You shoot it."
    {Bernhard Goetz}

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    Member Array NC Buckeye's Avatar
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    A better test would be how long does it take you to shoot X number of rounds into a pie plate at a given distance. Or even better yet X/2 shots in each of 2 plates at different distances.

    If you need to draw the guy you are shooting at will never stand still for 1.5 seconds to let you get another shot.

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    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kpw View Post
    Did you bench the gun or just shoot offhand? Intrinsic accuracy doesn't do much good if the shooter can't take advantage of it. I have a hard time shooting small guns well. Put a long, heavyish trigger with a small grip and I can't hit the barn. Guess how much I enjoy shooting my P-32?
    I was shooting offhand.
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

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    At 50 ft. your groups are 10" out-to-out, that's still COM of BG, what more do you need? I wouldn't worry about it... It sounds to me as if you've got a solid SD pistol, that's easy to carry...
    "Texas can make it without the United States, but the United States can't make it without Texas!".... Sam Houston

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    VIP Member Array Majorlk's Avatar
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    Unsupported with a compact pistol ... ?

    There's nothing the matter with the accuracy. Try shooting over a rest and you'll likely cut the groups in half, at least.

    If you are unhappy with the group sizes, I think you are expecting too much from a light, compact gun.
    An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life. - Robert A. Heinlein

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    If in a real life scenario and you're 50 feet away...run!
    If 30 feet away...you still have time to disappear...
    Closer? You seem to be doing just fine.
    The last Blood Moon Tetrad for this millennium starts in April 2014 and ends in September 2015...according to NASA.

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    VIP Member Array Stevew's Avatar
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    I would not get rid of the gun. I would practice more at long range. But any excuse to get another gun is a good excuse.
    Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around laws. Plato

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    VIP Member Array Rollo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majorlk View Post
    If you are unhappy with the group sizes, I think you are expecting too much from a light, compact gun.
    It seems like every article I read that the reviewers are talking about shooting 3 inch groups from 25 yards.
    -It is a seriously scary thought that there are subsets of American society that think being intellectual is a BAD thing...

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    VIP Member Array varob's Avatar
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    The groups you listed will save your life. That sounds like a good SD to me.
    Don't believe what you hear and only half of what you see!
    -Tony Soprano

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