Reminded Once Again: Check Magazines & Ammo...
This is a discussion on Reminded Once Again: Check Magazines & Ammo... within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hello. Over the last four decades I have come across defective factory ammunition right out of the box that should have never left the factory. ...
February 7th, 2010 01:03 AM
1951 - 2011
Reminded Once Again: Check Magazines & Ammo...
Hello. Over the last four decades I have come across defective factory ammunition right out of the box that should have never left the factory. In some instances, primers were seated upside down or completely missing, cases were crushed or the bullets themselves were visually out of spec.
Here are two Federal .45 ACP 230-gr. Hydrashok cartridges. It is pretty obvious that the one on the left is not as Federal intended when it somehow slipped out and was purchased in a box of ammunition. (This picture was taken several years ago and the cartridges shown were not a "rushed production" items. Many will recognize them as Hydrashoks using a truncated cone shaped bullet than the more rounded one used in current Federal Hydrashok ammunition.)
Though certainly not common, I have seen defective factory rounds from practically all manufacturers, not just Federal. While a little unnerving, I guess that when hundreds of thousands (or more) of cartridges are being manufactured, some that shouldn't slip by, do, despite quality-control checks.
My point is not to try and "defame" any reputable ammo makers, only to suggest that it is perhaps a wise thing to check each and every cartridge intended for "serious" use such as home defense or in a carry gun...and in all magazines dedicated for such purposes.
I routinely do this with all ammunition intended for such purposes, be it for rifle, revolver or semiautomatic.
A few weeks ago, I shot my SIG-Sauer P220 DAK, cleaned it upon returning home and locked it away in the safe. A day or two ago, I opted to load it up for home protection as well as for concealed carry for about a month in order to do a follow-up article to one done on the gun a year or two back.
My normal .45 ACP "carry ammo" is usually Remington 230-gr. Golden Saber, Winchester 230-gr. Ranger JHP or Federal Classic 230-gr. JHP (since I have quite a bit of the stuff around.) I usually pick whichever I happen to have enough rounds from an already-opened box to handle 8-shots in the pistol and 7 more in a spare magazine for it. (The current magazines will hold 8; I simply prefer my single-stack .45's to hold the same number of rounds as my 1911's and since I have 7-shot magazines by the score for them...)
When I carry a .45 auto, it is usually loaded with one of these three 230-gr factory JHP's. From left to right: Winchester Ranger, Federal Classic and Remington Golden Saber. Remington's 230-gr. Golden Saber is easy to spot as being slightly longer and usually measures right at 1.23" on average.
I began loading a couple of magazines for my P220 DAK SAS ("SIG Anti-Snag) .45 pistol with Golden Sabers. This round has proven to feed smoothly in all of my 1911-pattern pistols as well as this and my other P220 as well as one I recently sold. The magazines were brand new ones.
The ammunition "jammed" in one of them". LOA for the Golden Sabers was the usual 1.23" on average. I checked the LOA of cartridges from the box these came from against others having a different lot number; both had the same average LOA.
The problem appears to be the length of the cartridge along with the width/shape of the hollow point in some of the current 8-shot SIG-Sauer stainless steel factory magazines. (Not all but some. In my admittedly statistically-invalid case, the figure would be one out of four such magazines or 25%.)
This is the magazine in question. It is marked "SIG SAUER P220-1 45" on the lower left side and "Made in Italy" on the other. (I figure it was manufactured by Mec-Gar, a favorite maker of quality magazines by myself and many others.)
Though it didn't happen all of the time, Golden Saber cartridges would hang up tight and failed to feed when cycled by hand. (Later on the same day, I determined that they failed to feed as well in firing...but ONLY in that one individual magazine.)
Here you can see the "nose-dived" Golden Saber. In this particular instance, it was the last round in the magazine but this stoppage also occurred with differing numbers of cartridges still in the magazine.
Here is a view of the same problem from the top. The "inward curved" front of the magazine (about the 2 o'clock position) does not appear to be a "ding" or other than intended from the manufacturer. My other stainless 8-round P220 factory magazines are the same way and function fine with the same ammunition.
Having said that, I believe that this inward curve to be at the core of this magazine's function-problems with this ammunition. I cannot measure how much it is curved inward compared to other magazines but I suspect that it is very slightly more. I cannot see it visually when comparing this magazine to others of the same line. However, this inward curve is less noticeable in my old blued factory 7-shot magazines...of which all that I've tried so far (10) have worked flawlessly. FWIW, the "problem magazine" worked 100% with:
24 shots using Winchester Ranger 230-gr. JHP
24 shots using Federal 230-gr. Classic JHP
24 shots using Federal 230-gr. Hydrashok (truncated cone)
24 shots using Federal 230-gr. Hydrashok (current style)
24 shots using Hornady 230-gr. TAP (XTP)
My point is not to criticize Remington, SIG-Sauer or Mec-Gar. It is simply to suggest not taking any product's functioning or "dimensional correctness" out of the box for granted. This problem-combination just happened to be the latest I experienced.
Such "unintended consequences" could be aggravating at the least on a range trip or tragic in the extreme in a deadly force situation.
February 7th, 2010 01:47 PM
Not to get into the "spring-stress-relief" or it don't matter chatter, again: Awhile back, I decided to empty some magazines, after reading some gun magazines and forum posts, only to find my very-first broken magazine spring. Yes, it probably would never have mattered. Yes, I would have probably never needed to load it during an attack. Yes, I was lucky to discover it. AND, I should unload and check these and other magazines again, my friends.
February 7th, 2010 01:50 PM
I've also found visually defective rounds in factory ammunition. I guess they cant QC everything. I do a visual check of my mags every once in a while. My pistol stays loaded with the same mag 24/7, so I check them when I go shooting before and after my session.
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
February 7th, 2010 09:28 PM
My brother's son was shooting his HK USP (full-size) and stopped to show me three rounds of Remington "bulk" .40 cal. FMJs where the bullet had been deepseated at the factory. I advised him to check all the rounds in the 250 pack before trying to load them and also to try chambering a few rounds and then ejecting them unfired to see if the bullets would drive themselves deeper into the case during the feeding cycle (they didn't) therefore, the rounds were defective from the factory. Always at least look over your ammo before loading it into a magazine.
February 7th, 2010 10:32 PM
I have seen this in 9mm. Had a picture at one time, but I can't find it now.
three rounds of Remington "bulk" .40 cal. FMJs where the bullet had been deepseated at the factory.
Miyamoto Musashi, The Book of Five Rings
You should not have any special fondness for a particular weapon, or anything else, for that matter
February 7th, 2010 10:35 PM
On my last shooting session a couple weeks ago I had my Glock 19 fail to fully chamber a round. After ejecting it, I found that the case was about ½ mm or so too long. It was Winchester White box 115 fmj.
By paramedic70002 in forum General Firearm Discussion
Last Post: August 1st, 2010, 11:19 AM
By BuckeyeEric in forum Defensive Ammunition & Ballistics
Last Post: October 6th, 2009, 05:29 PM
By eldorado in forum Related Gear & Equipment
Last Post: February 13th, 2009, 10:13 PM
By rugerp95 in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
Last Post: January 25th, 2008, 11:31 PM
By Chris17404 in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
Last Post: December 21st, 2006, 08:37 AM