HK or SA
This is a discussion on HK or SA within the Defensive Carry Guns forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; I carry a Full size 1911,I personally find this to be the best SD pistol there is,for me nothing feels better in my hand,aims better ...
March 1st, 2010 03:04 PM
HK or SA
I carry a Full size 1911,I personally find this to be the best SD pistol there is,for me nothing feels better in my hand,aims better or shoots better.The only drawback is,it is heavy,so by the end of the year I will have enough to purchase my new piece.I had planned on getting the SA Operator Champion in 4" with rail.Then I saw an article on HK's USP and went to there site, WoW what a nice pistol both the compact USP or 45 are both awesome and now I'm wondering if I should leave 1911 camp and go with HK.I've tried to find a place that rents these to see how they shoot but no luck.Anybody here that has owned both the 1911 and HK that can give me feedback.I'd like to hear a 1911 person and what he thinks of the HK in comparison to the 1911.Thanks for the help as usual!
March 1st, 2010 03:20 PM
What HK pistol are you considering? For what purpose? (concealed carry, IWB, OWB, home defense, range use...)
HKs are great guns. I will say, in general the full size USPs are bulky and I wouldn't consider them for IWB. Don't expect the trigger to be as good as on your 1911. IMO the SA/DA triggers on the USPs isn't as good as the SA/DA trigger on any given Sig either. The grips on the USPs are kind of large (and some people whine about the checkering although it doesn't bother me), so make sure it fits your hand and you like the balance.
Too bad you don't live closer, I'd let you shoot my USP 45 Tac.
"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
March 1st, 2010 03:25 PM
Definitely look at the HK 45 and 45c as well. It's sort of a Generation II USP. A biut narrower slide profile, less aggressive checkering, interchangeable backstraps.
I really, really like mine.
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March 1st, 2010 03:28 PM
I really wanted an HK45 or a P30 in .40 (badly) but after standing there and playing with them for a while but I couldn't see paying almost double what I paid for my XDm in 40.
I know that's no help but my point was I didn't see anything extraordinary that would have made me spend the extra money. I would love to have one but can't find anything that wows me.
Although, if I ever find that winning lottery ticket in the parking lot, I will have at least one of everything HK makes.
March 1st, 2010 04:31 PM
i have never fired the 1911 only handled them in the store. Personlly i don't care for the feel of the 1911. I own an HK .45 auto full size and love it to death. It is a bit heavy for everyday carry though so i am going to be getting a p2000sk for EDC duty. HK makes a great gun that both feels and funtions extremely well. After my experience with HK i probably won't ever buy another pistol not made by them.
I have shot glocks, sigs, Beretta and Ruger. The HK stands above the rest IMHO and i will gladly pay the extra to have them.
March 1st, 2010 04:57 PM
I don't own a 1911 yet, just molested a few in the stores. That said I drink the HK koolaide.......I love it!!! LOL!! Right now it's the only gun I own. I liked the 45c and 45 more than the USP and USPc. I cary mine AIWB in a el cheapo uncle mike's for now. Check out this link (keep in mind they are from the HK forum. Grain of salt an all that)
HK45 versus STI Spartan
It's not a SA but I hope it helps.....
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March 1st, 2010 05:15 PM
HK makes a great gun, but nothing will ever compair to your 1911 once you have the bug. If you want a lighter weight 1911, there are lots of alloy framed 4" and 3" ones out there that are very light.
I have the kimber aegis II ultra (similar to SA EMP), which is a 9mm 3" barrel alloy frame 1911, and i LOVE it.
if you go the HK route, understand that
1) the trigger cant compaire to a 1911
2) its 2x as thick
3) it holds more ammo
4) slightly different grip angle
5) very different feel
6) still isnt a 1911
7) still is a great high quality gun
because i know the kimbers best.. here are a few 45acp 4" barrel 1911 alloy framed guns to look at:
yet another note: ok, looks like tons of SA are alloy framed too
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(Murder begins where self-defense ends)
March 1st, 2010 06:23 PM
This is accurate. I own a USP fullsize in .40; it is a great OC, duty or range gun but I really wouldn't consider it for CC. It is simply too large.
Originally Posted by NoNameMan
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---Carry options: G26/MTAC, PF9/MiniTuck, PPK/Pocket, USP40/OWB---
---NOTE: I am not an expert. If I ever start acting like a know-it-all, please call me on it immediately.
March 1st, 2010 06:36 PM
Adding to the comparions already made by others, I'd say that the H&K will be more likely to be 100% reliable right outta the box than the 1911. (IMO)
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March 1st, 2010 07:48 PM
i have the champ op and an HK--get the champ op. it's a dead reliable one hole shooter, lightweight and slim.
March 2nd, 2010 02:02 AM
I had a USP .40c, and currently have an HK45. If you like the USP, make sure you at least handle the HK45c before you buy. I love mine. I had no problems with the USP .40c, just wanted to consolidate to .45 acp. Great gun. I love my HK45. It points, shoots great. VERY accurate, and will never fail you.
I also had a Kimber TLE II and got rid of it due to too many problems, most FTE, but had many others. I now use a SA SS Champion as my CCW. I like it. It feels great in my hand, and I can get quicker follow up shots with it. I have had some problems with it after the break in period, and I am about to send it back to SA for some custom work, most in the reliability arena.
Both are great guns, but HK's have some of the best craftsmanship and quality of any handgun Ive shot. They will be as reliable as can be right out of the box. A new 1911 will probably have some issues that need to be tweaked out of the box, but once the bugs get worked out (if any), it is a keeper. I would recommend handling and shooting as many 1911's and HK's as possible before you decide. Its all a matter of preference.
March 2nd, 2010 11:13 AM
HKs have replaced Sigs for my favorite carry gun. They have the same accuracy, reliability and quality workmanship. I would trust them completely.
I also have a 5" and 4" 1911 and for ME they are the most fun to shoot with a much better trigger and probably more accurate than an HK but that would be for bullseye matches not combat. I do not like a safety for carry and while both 1911s are reliable now it took a while to get there.
When purchasing a H&K always leave some money for a trigger job. There is a gunsmith, Bill Springfield, who will adjust and lighten the trigger and return it for $59-$69. He is big on HKs.
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March 2nd, 2010 12:38 PM
I definitely consider myself a 1911 guy. I have a few 1911's, all pretty nice guns (Kimber, Wilson Combat). I also have a H&K USP and 45C. The main competition for my EDC is between a Kimber Crimson Carry Pro and the 45C. I'm having trouble deciding which one to carry (today the 45C, yesterday the Kimber). They are both extremely reliable and accurate guns with a variety of strong features that have made the choice very very difficult. A few of my thoughts below:
First of all, I wouldn't consider a full size USP for daily carry, it is just too big. The 45C is probably the one worth looking at. The 45C is barely wider then the 1911. The grip length is slightly longer on the 45C, but mostly because it has a finger catch on the magazine. The safeties on the guns are obviously different, I don't know that one is superior to the other. Swapping from a 1911 to a HK will require that you get used to the trigger, which is much different (particularly if you carry it decocked.
As far as reliability, I can't agree with some of the other comments about a 45C being more reliable then a 1911. You shouldn't take either gun out of the box and start carrying it before putting a few hundred rounds through them at the range. By that time, both guns will be flawless performers. A nice 1911 may be pickier about the ammo it feeds, but you'd already know what it likes from the range trip.
In your comparison, you should look at some of the nice lightweight frames you can get a 1911 with, while it will probably still net out heavier, it won't be by as much. Overall, this is entirely a matter of preference, both are high quality guns you could count on.
March 2nd, 2010 05:44 PM
I have a H&K P-30 (in 9mm) and a SA Micro in .45.
Man what a tough choice. They are different and both good.
I have often said the H&K is the Mercedes of firearms.
The P-30 fits like it was made for me.
The SA Micro is easy to carry, as it fits close in.
March 2nd, 2010 08:03 PM
I carry fullsize firearms. G22, USP40, 1991A1. USPs carry just fine.
All of the bullet points listed by Freisepferd are true, and the best thing about a USP are expressed in 4, 5, 6, and 7. <g>
If you like it, get it.
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