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IWB Clip holster VS Versamax type holster

6K views 21 replies 13 participants last post by  tex45acp 
#1 ·
I am trying to decide which one to order...anyone have both?...this would be for a para cco...I want the most concealability...any comments positive or negative would be appreciated...
 
#2 ·
Versamax

I don't think it's possible to go wrong with a VM-II holster. I've got one for a Smith 1066 that is very comfortable and one for a PM40 that is also like not wearing a holster at all. I also just ordered one for a 5" 1911, which brings me to the only drawback with a Sparks holster. The wait is about 20 weeks. I figure the clip on IWB is pretty much off the shelf. If you're like everyone else, you should probably just bite the bullet and buy both. Get the clip type now, and order the Sparks for later. If you're comparing styles, (I just reread the post and think I may have misunderstood the question) the VM style of holster is a lot more stable, stays in position better, and is more comfortable, in my opinion, than any of the clip style IWBs I have tried.
 
#3 ·
Well...I take it by "clip holster" you mean a summer special style IWB?
Like this? Ive heard them referred to as a "stacked loop" holster.

The loops are stacked over the gun/main body of the holster.

This is a VM style IWB or an "offset loop" design holster.

The loops are offset away from the body of the holster.

Many people sware by the SS or stacked loop design and carry with them for years. For thinner/longer guns Id say they are an excellent choice. For thicker guns Id say this isnt the best choice. The loops/gun/reinforced mouth: all on the same plane will make a rather thick and uncomfortable carry setup.

The thinner VM style is more comfortable, more stable and can conceal better with some body styles. This is what I wear and make the most of.

Shoot well and god bless
 
#4 ·
I tried both types initially and went with the VM 2, which I use daily. The VM 2 is comfortable to wear, very thin, holds my compact M1911 very securely and yet it is easy to draw the pistol from it. Stability is great, making it easy to forget that you're wearing it. I don't think that you can go wrong with the VM 2 or it's style of belt attachment.
 
#5 ·
koolop,
All the post above contain good, informative, and correct information - IF you are referring to an off-set belt loop IWB vs one with a clip mounted on top of the holster-body.
There are however holsters (such as Alessi's Watch 6 Dual Talon) which have off-set clips front and rear of the pistol. In this instance there is very little difference, and the choice between kydex or metal clips or belt loops is more one of persoanl preference.
 
#8 ·
I have both like you decribe. A Max-Con V and a Brommeland (I am not sure of the name) older design clip holster that I picked up from erh. I have found that the clip holster has it's place and time that it can be used, it is a bit unstable but not dangerous or anything. I like to use the clip holster when wearing shorts.

The VM-II or Eric's holster posted above or a Max-Con V, etc, are all better choices than the clip holster IMO, but as I said the clip holster has it's place, just limited. I like having both.


Ti.
 
#9 · (Edited)
I want to point out something about the "VM style holster" pics posted by Eric Larsen. They illustrate the absence of the loops directly over the gun part of the holster, but may not accurately depict another point about the Versa Max 2 design, assuming that's the "VM" we're talking about here.

When talking about the Versa Max 2, as made by Milt Sparks, it has a reinforced mouth, which adds to it's thickness when compared to a Milt Sparks Watch Six style holster.

Yes, a thicker pistol gains a bit in concealment with the "offset loops", but also it's important to note that the absence of the reinforced mouth is another contributor to "thinness".

Perhaps I can illustrate my point better with pics from the Milt Sparks website.

The Versa Max 2: Note the extra thickness to the reinforced mouth of the holster when compared to the Watch Six picture.


The Watch Six


Because my goal was to get the thinner of the two for carry of my Glock 26 I went with the Watch Six. The reinforced mouth of the Versa Max 2 holster offers ease of re-holtering, but since that was not a concern of mine as a carry holster, the Watch Six was my choice. And, at $65, the Watch Six was $32.50 less than the VM2.
 
#10 ·
I agree with Jimmy, I do not like a reinforced mouth of any holster. That is a deal breaker for me and if left with the two options I would choose the watch six.

I use a Max-Con V and as you can see it's very thin and fitted to the gun. It is an amazing holster. This show's a side view of the Max-Con V to give you an idea of the difference.




Ti
 
#11 ·
I have both the VM2 and the Watch Six. I find the VM2 much more comfortable and a better fit for the pistol. The Watch Six is horsehide and very stiff/hard, and I had a hard time drawing my pistol out of it when it was new. It took forever to conform acceptably to the pistol, and I rarely use it. I don't see any difference in concealability between the two, but the price gap is significant. YMMV.
 
#13 ·
TBob said:
and I had a hard time drawing my pistol out of it when it was new.
Here and in other forums, I've often seen that type of comment and even instructions for how to "break-in" a holster. Personally, I must be very lucky, since of the four new leather holsters I've purchased, all have been a perfect fit from day one; just the right amount of retention and a smooth draw! And, they have not "loosened up" over time such that there is any problem.

As for me, the Watch Six has turned out to be my best buy so far when it comes to carry. I do however see a lot of very positive comments about the Max Con V and will likely go that way for a future buy. I have one question about that holster if Gary Brommerland would comment--what is the function of the leather piece/flap that extends below the muzzle end of the holster? Thanks.
 
#15 ·
I have one question about that holster if Gary Brommerland would comment--what is the function of the leather piece/flap that extends below the muzzle end of the holster? Thanks.
JimmyC, I can't speak for Gary, but I can quote his website.

Designed in 1990, The MAX - CON III ( Maximum Concealment Holster III) was one of the first IWB holsters designed specifically for compact autoloaders. At that time, most existing holster designs were simply cut-down versions of those intended for full sized weapons. The result was a tendency for the shorter guns to somersault over the belt. This was because they did not have the weight of a full length slide to off-set the weight of the magazine in the grip. The MAX-CON III solved this problem by relocating the belt loops to the side of the mouthband, rather than below it. This placed the weapon substantially lower in the belt and resolved the top-heavy condition found in earlier designs.
Although it’s profile may seem a bit unusual, each curve of the "tail flange" has a purpose - to avoid nerve “pressure points” and prevent the holster from “digging” into the body. These contours are anatomically compatible with the muscle groups in the hip/thigh area in order to enhance comfort.
If you look on his site you see that the holsters for compact pistols are the ones with the extensions. As seen by his explanation above this accomplishes several things. It keeps the grip area from leaning away from the body and keeps the muscle area beneath the muzzle from having the muzzle dig into them. It speads the contact point eliminating the digging in and the lean at the top at the same time. In full size pistols the muzzle is further down and they naturally spread the load thereby not requiring the extension.

I'm sure Gary will give you a better explanation later, but wanted to provide at least a partial answer now. If he gets to answering too many questions his customers might get upset. They already think he should be making holsters 24/7.:yup:
 
#14 ·
The dual clip/loop type holster like the VM2, the Watch 6 and Eric's COM style holsters are SIGNIFICANTLY more comfortable. Especially if you carry something large like a Government Model 1911 or a Glock 17.

They lay flatter and the gun doesn't rock so it doesn't move forward or back on your belt.


I carry my Kahr MK9 in one of Eric's DC Special holsters (like the COM only with metal clips instead of leather loops) and I can easily forget its there.


If you're stuck on the Milt Sparks holsters, I'd go with the Watch 6 over the VM2 because I don't think a reinforced mouth on an IWB holster is a good idea (we're trying to go THIN here) and the Watch 6 is much more economical ... however before I'd recommend the Milt Sparks, I'd recommend one of Eric's holsters. http://www.hbeleatherworks.com/

Here's my DC Special.
 
#16 ·
George...thanks, what you say certainly makes sense. Sorry I was too lazy to check out the Brommerland website, I simply reacted to all the positive comments here about that Max Con V. I'll be needing a holster sooner or later, so that's likely to be my next buy.
 
#17 ·
No problem, Jimmy. It's what I do. I am a reference librarian and finding answers is what I do. I have a great memory for detail and remembered having read the paragraph on Gary's site.

I don't have one of Gary's holsters . . . yet. I have a Mark Garrity and one from Kevin at K&D, Eric Larsen's New York Pro has caught my eye and that may be my next purchase. I am currently waiting on two from K&D they are just about due any day. I'm sure that Gary and Eric will get to know my bank account in the next couple of months. I'm going to get something for the S&W 1066, even though it will never be a frequently carried piece. There are always new guns to get holsters for, so most of our holster makers will get some of my money I'm sure.

One of the really great things about Combat Carry is the opportunity to interact with these guys who make the holsters. Another is that they recognize each other as artists and even recommend each other for certain types of holsters. A real exciting part of Combat Carry is seeing the new holster artists getting their start. Some as a hobby, some as a part time interest, and others with the view to doing it full time. Rhome at Desbiens Gunleather is one who comes to mind. It's hard to believe that he was asking for advice just a few months ago. The thing that made me glad to be a part of CC then was he got it from guys like Gary, Mark, Eric, and Matt Del Fatti. Where else does that happen?
 
#18 · (Edited)
Well...great thread. I dont say that lightly either.

One thing you guys brought up are the different methods of construction..ie, horsehide vs cowhide and reinforcing the mouth. Horsehide is very much like Kydex when thicker HH is used and its wet molded. Its amazingly tough, well beyond what is needed for an IWB holster IMO. A reinforced mouth is something some prefer and some dont. Thats the glory of all that is available today from many of the top makers out there...if you can think of it, the odds are you can have it.

When I described the Pro or Summer Special style holster are a stacked loop design, even with a clip, it puts the belt attatchment over the gun.

The DC Special shown earlier than I make is a "clip" holster with 2 offset clips. It rides and carries just like a Com 3 and trust me!, It doesnt slip or move on you. It can leave marks on your belt if used for a while. Its just the nature of using very strong clips and is a trade off when you want the ease of installation that the design provides. Heres one for a Les Bear 1911........just for reference. BTW..thanks for the kind words Zundfolge!!!!



I couldnt agree with you more about the makers here and their willingness to help. It goes far beyond just posts here and there with advice or referring another maker that better suits someones needs, when the situation arrises.

Each maker mentioned has been pummelled by phone calls from me over the years and has helped beyond measure....and it always sounds like they are smiling on the other end of the phone!

Where else can that happen among people in the same industry......Even though they are literally my competition at times, they are always my friends first. Especially that MaxCon guy.......god he's gonna love that one! ;o)~

Shoot well and god bless
 
#19 ·
With the waiting times for a custom holster, certainly there is enough business out there for more makers to enter the market. I think that would be healthy for both maker and consumer, matching supply up more closely with demand.

Further, I'm starting to be one that is more mindful of holster selection, and choice is good.

I've kind of fallen in love with the look of the K&D Eagle Defender of P95's, that OWB with the embossed eagle...I think I have to have one of those!

And, that Max Con V is looking pretty good.

Ah, these things are as addicting as the guns themselves!
 
#20 ·
I've kind of fallen in love with the look of the K&D Eagle Defender of P95's, that OWB with the embossed eagle...I think I have to have one of those!

And, that Max Con V is looking pretty good.

Ah, these things are as addicting as the guns themselves!
Welcome to the club, JimmyC. They are works of art and you just can't help but like great art. I can think of lots worse addictions.
 
#21 ·
IIRC, one of the holster makers...I believe it was Gary B...call the "flap" a Sciatic Flange. I've been using an AKJ IWB with my Glock 26. Boy, when that little jewel hit the right spot... Let's just say that I've been sucking down ibuprofin and moving gingerly. (Yes...the nerve aggravation is a pre-existing condition.) If that "flap" would alleviate that issue, I'd say "make it bigger!"

Michael
 
#22 ·
The dual clip/loop style holster is the most comfortable for me. I suffer from the dunlap disease (belly done lapped over the belt) and spreading the connection points apart makes it wrap around my waist and thus making it more comfortable to wear. I speak from personal & costly experience. I have tried more styles than I care to admit and I am here to tell you, the right holster is worth its weight in gold. Here are a few of mine that are extremely comfortable.
Milt Sparks Versa Max 2 for my 4" 1911.


Brommeland Max Con V for my Springfield XD-45


Tucker Heritage IWB for my Ruger SP-101 Revolver


HBE LeatherWorks COM 3 for my S&W K Frame Revolver
 
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