You have a good question/thoughts about something that doesn't typically come up. At one time I wore boots (dress and work) all the time, in fact I've spent much time working horseback as well (cattle). In thinking about the situation you described I believe you typically aren't expecting to need some sort of quick draw rig, you'd just like to be armed while on horseback and have a secured weapon if need be. It's unlikely you're going to get "horse-jacked" and need a quick response. Personally speaking I would enjoy running my horse over a BG attempting to take it.
A couple of ideas on my part:
Ankle holster down inside your boot, I would think would be pretty secure and comfortable? That way the weight at the top of the boot won't matter. I think comfort could be an issue, while walking or riding you're going to feel the presence of that gun on every step. Think "rubbing".
Google "kangaroo carry", it's a clothlike band you wear under your shirt, and around your chest, that is somewhat like a shoulder holster. Pretty comfortable.
Saddle holster for a ranch rifle?
Nylon pocket holster, is fairly padded and I'd think be comfortable in your pocket. The one I use, would work while riding horseback (cheap Uncle Mikes and Ruger LCP). I never notice it in and out of vehicles or 4-wheeler. I don't ride anymore, but I can't foresee a problem riding with my little rig.
I knew I saw it some place and it took some time to find but I think it is pretty slick, Boot Gun..., only thing I think I would do different is have them bring the leather up alongside the gun like on the crossbreed supertuck's so the gun doesn't rub against your leg.
I could not find anywhere if MT is an open carry state.
If it is,,,,,,,,,
Why couldn't you just use a drop leg holster with a snap to hold the pistol in place?
If you are in as rural a place as you say, who the H.E.Double Hockey sticks would care?
I just used an old holster and put an extra loop of leather through the belt loop part and hang it around the horn...
Today I picked up one of those pistol pockets that velcro onto the door of your safe. I think these will work. I appreciate the various ideas but I'm still looking for something that is dedicated to the boot. When you are in a working ranch situation like this you don't hang things from your thigh. The riding can be fast with ropes involved. Anything that can possibly hang you up you don't do. I know that from very painful experience. The saddle horn is a possibilty if, again, it is out of the way. You don't want to be trying to dally around your pistol. Plus, there will be times at rodeos, the sales barn, etc... when you are around a crowd and outside carry would draw too much attention. I didn't even bring this up on a couple hunting forums I frequent because most of the horsemen there are packers. For them having something attached to their body or to the saddle makes sense. And I do carry at times on my belt. If I was in Griz country I would sure as heck have one on the saddle or on the belt at all times, but I am in a portion of the country being effected by the oil boom and my main concern is transient types. One day I rode up on what I thought was a discarded tarp lying about 50 yards into one of my pastures. As I approached the tarp opened up to reveal a meth addict with a cigarette in one hand and a tall energy drink in the other. This was just after daybreak and the temperature was in the low 20s. I just happen to be on a stretch of highway where people leaving the oil patch can run out of gas at my place because I live just outside of a fair-sized town but going north it is 80 miles to the next gas station. Being close to town I also jump in the truck to run errands and don't want to be worrying about carrying open in places where Montana law doesn't allow it: like a bank or post office. All of my vehicles have a weapon of some sort, so in many cases the AirLite in my boot would not be my primary. Anyway, I'm going to play around with these velcro pockets and see what I can come up with.
Okay, here's my report: the little pocket pouches designed for gun safe doors work great IF you have pull holes in your boots and IF you wear boot cut jeans. You can make them work without boot cut jeans but getting to the weapon is going to be slow. With pull holes (instead of pull straps) and boot cut jeans these pocket pouches act like they were designed for 17" cowboy boots. I might try posting photos if I want to challenge such a technologically involved task.
This was a very interesting thread ! Pictures are needed Lazytl. I have been working on this very problem for literally years. I have found that I want the holster INSIDE the boot (outside is too floppy and insecure) but not on the INSIDE of a leg (pressure/rubbing against saddle parts and horse...outside the right leg works best). I know, I KNOW all about the deep concealment aspect of this. I have tried ankle holsters (too deep in boot to access or movement down from gravity), clip holsters (okay but not that secure), rawhide ties to boot pulls or thru the boot by cutting holes, cutting off the top of the boot, ect ect ad nauseum. Where I am at now is stitching a holster to the inside of the boot top with a pad of sheepskin between the holster and my leg. Issues arise when the boot ages and begins to sag (from the weight on that side). Nothing is perfect but this works reasonable well. Don't get me started on chap problems....I once tried sewing a holster inside a pair of thick half chaps (belt with buckle at the knee and flap above the belt covering the knee cap), one day and a pair of ruined pants sent me back to my pop's old chaps. PANTS are another issue all together. Levi Big Bells used to work great but the 70s are over and never coming back. Levi's boot cut work. Riggs Ranger pants work. Some of Carhartts work. Being inside the boot helps with the bulge in the pants leg but being on the outside of the leg is a concealment issue..... Everything is compromise and shop for the gun concealment. I carry a J Frame smith or Charter Arms Pug 44 Special in the boot. What I do would not work for many, but works for me. You are thinking it thru and I commend your thoughtfulness. I would be very interested in seeing pics of your rig and hearing your thoughts on the issues since I have been there and am still working on it. Side note: when riding fence I wear a cross-draw rig also, but working stock you are right...nothing on the horn, nothing on the waist.
Horsetrader, when I saw your user name I figured we'd be tracking the same trail. You make an excellent point on the holster having to be on the outside of the leg. That is a problem but I think my little safe pouch can be altered. One fellow suggested a Bianchi Model 6D ATB Waistband, but he did not mention if he was horseback often or not. I pack a Smith Model 317 AirLite for this purpose so my weight problem is not quite as bad as yours. I have a young cowboy friend who is a chaps maker and former Marine Scout/Sniper. I might run this past him and see what he thinks. I hate to say it, but one solution would probably be custom boots. Pricey, but they could be made with reinforced uppers and a built-in pistol pocket. Benny Binion once talked Paul Bond into making sheepskin-lined cowboy boots for when he was up here in the winter. Knowing the late Mr. Binion, I'd be surprised if he hadn't thought of a way to solve this problem. If you have a chance to play with one of these pocket pouches let me know what you think. I think the lightest revolver possible is necessary. I'm not ready to stick a semi-auto in my boot.
I have known people that carried like this,they swear by it
Originally Posted by ncsteveh
Bianchi Model 6D: leather is thin, but the clip doesn't do it for me. Been on my back unexpectantly and don't want the holster to move an inch......last time: the dog ran under Buck and well you know how those stories go.......
Custom boots: hate to see you take this route. Pricey and you got to come up with the money everytime you wear out a pair. Don't know about you but I like keeping things simple and as inexpensive as possible. Good USA boots are pricey enuff without going to custom boots.
I'd run the problem past your chap maker friend for a possible fresh solution.
Yep, lite revolver is necessary. I also am not ready for a locked and cocked pistol in my boot. Though I have been known to lust after a Kahr PM45 (for obvious safety reasons) recently.
Guess maybe I have "settled" on a partial solution to the boot gun problem. What I have is working for me at the moment and a series of compromises have already been settled into. Do let me know what your rig becomes.
Mr. stuart and ncsteve, somehow I missed the bootgun information above. That is along the lines of what I'm thinking. Thanks for passing that on. I may need to go to a shorter boot. One problem with high top boots is the gun is up where the boot-cut jeans start to narrow.
Horsetrader, I've owned a number of custom made boots because I have unusually narrow feet. I haven't owned any lately because they have become prohibitively expensive.
Measured both my pair of boots: 12 inches and 13 inches. And yeah, boot height makes alot of difference in getting that pant leg up and a grip on the smokestick. Miles City, huh. Know it somewhat. I got alot of blood relatives living and dead between Miles City and Buffalo, South Dakota.
LazyTL: One thought here is that you might give Wilson Boots in Livingston a call, and see if they could make and sew a soft leather holster pocket into the shaft of your boot. They do pretty good work--I have several pairs of their boots, but like you and horsetrader have commented, custom boots are really $$ these days (I have a foot that is a little mis-shaped from the horse-wreck and the resulting bolt in the foot--makes finding good boots an expensive proposition)
I think the problems with the Bakken oil boom are just beginning, and I think you are really wise to think this through now. Just a thought here, unless you are very bow-legged, when sitting IN the saddle, your inner leg is going to be pressed against the fender of your saddle, in order to pull your pant leg up, you may have to move your foot out of the stirrup: for faster and easier access, split the outside seam of your pant leg from the bottom up and sew small velcro patches along the seem, that way, if you need it in a hurry, you pull the velcroed seam apart and there you are.......
Oh yeah, don't forget to train the horse to stand still when you shoot from the saddle:image035:
Greetings Chaplain, as you may know, Wilson Boots originated here in Miles City and I knew old Carl Wilson. We do have a bootmaker here in Miles City again -- Kevin Eisle (spelling on last name could be wrong) -- so if I am having a pair made it would be better to do it here where he could work with me through the process. The problem is, he has about a two year waiting list, and part of that reason is because he specializes in boots for people like you: those with medical problems.
Thank you for your 30 years of service. I bet you are glad you're not a chaplain in today's political environment.
If I'm horseback I'm not real concerned about needing my weapon in a quick-draw situation. I have spent 57 of my 59 years in a saddle and being horseback gives a person good situational awareness. A man on horseback is a bit imposing and if I'm horseback my two cow dogs will be with me. They're not much of a threat, except to cows, but they do cause people to think twice. As a rancher I've used handguns from horseback quite a little, namely .22s filled with birdshot to handle bad bulls and aggressive studs. Often one is in as much danger from your saddle horse in those situations. A Model 317 really barks and I don't care how much training some horses receive -- they are simply sensitive to noise or are timid by nature.
I may also try a small belt and holster around the boot that would put the gun just above my ankle. Horsetrader has probably tried that and everything else. As discussed, the problem with it outside of your boot are twofold: getting it hung up in a rope, rein, or other obstacle; and, having it come loose and losing it. I've lost a lot of things in the hills but I really don't want to lose a $700 revolver.
At the risk of being self-promoting, you might try going to Amazon and doing a search on one of my books: THE BREAKING OF EZRA RILEY. With what I can sense through your profile you might find it interesting. Blessings.
When I bought my last pistol, a guy next to me purchased a taurus revolver and asked the counter guy for a holster exactly like this, to put in his boot.
Seems like there is an opportunity here for a holster maker.