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Crazy idea for concealing.....

3K views 33 replies 24 participants last post by  AdamSean 
#1 ·
So I am applying for my CHP in a few weeks, so I will be spending the next 45 days while I wait to figure out how I want to carry my pistol. For reference, I have a Walther PK380. I plan to carry 24/7 wherever it's legal, this includes at work. However, when carrying at work, I must have 100% concealment, this includes no extra magazines or anything showing outside of my belt. So here's my idea.

I am going to add a snap/loop on the INSIDE of my waistband on my work pants. I plan to carry small of back, as being such a skinny person this seems to be the best place for me to conceal. This would allow me to use a tuckable IWB holster and magazine it inside of my pants instead of the outside, which of course would mean my holster would be completely hidden.

Any thoughts on this idea? I still plan to wear a gun belt to ensure my pants are held up well, and I wear shirts that are quite large and blouse well, so printing should not be a concern. My concern is with the magazines for the holster showing, which would instantly give me away where I work. This would be the end of my employment, so it's really a concern for me.
 
#3 ·
At 6'3" 180lbs soaking wet, with a 32 inch waist, that just doesn't seem feasible. I have tried just sticking my pistol in my waistband, with my shirt tucked in and it just doesn't seem like it would work. I have carried SOB out to the car and sat down in the seat for a few minutes before driving away and it seems pretty comfortable. I have literally nothing around my midsection, and no butt to speak of, so any type of concealed carry is going to be an issue.

What do you think of the loops sewn inside of the pants in order to completely conceal the clips for the holster?
 
#4 ·
If you have the gun already, try your idea around your house to see how it works. I would say smart carry if you need 100% concealment at work. CCW is legal but against company policy on company property?
 
#6 ·
Precisely. I have yet to work somewhere that didn't specifically state that firearms were prohibited to be possessed by employees. Virginia recently passed the parking lot law so I can at least leave it locked in my car, but that won't do me any good if some customer decides to get sideways with me because they feel ripped off, or an employee starts assaulting me because they don't want to admit they are wrong.
 
#7 ·
OP, ah, ok.
 
#8 ·
Hmm, I know what you're suggesting, but I would think that your pants and/or the inside loop would sag or cause the holster to sag. Don't know until you try, though. I think another option to consider would be a belly band. You can carry it high (around the solar plexus area), or lower at the waist, and any location on your "body clock" (hip, back, appendix, etc.).
 
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#9 ·
Consider appendix carry with a sturdy gunbelt. The best have a kydex liner (though many look very dressy for work).

SOB will print badly if you bend down (pulling the shirt tight), and people behind you are more likely to stare at your back. When I spot people CC'ing, it's usually when we are in line someplace and they are standing in front of me, especially if they bend down (ex: in line at a store). SOB is also slow to access and offers poor retention in a crowd (try discreetly covering a SOB gun in public).

Appendix is much faster, hides well on skinny people (just looks like a bit of belly or maybe a cell phone), and offers great retention. People facing you don't often stare at your gut, and you will probably notice more quickly if your shirt becomes untucked in the front.

The big downside to appendix is the whole 'gun pointed at important bits, including your femoral aterty' but that's where it's nice your PK380 has an external hammer and long DA pull. Keep your thumb on that hammer when you holster, and you won't have to worry about 'glock leg', especially in the front!

Good luck, and congratulations on taking the responsibility to carry.
 
#10 ·
A gun that small you could just have in your front pocket in a pocket holster.

Small of back is bad - you can't really see how much you're printing, it's easy for someone to pin your arm when you're trying to draw, if you fall you hurt yourself....there really is no "upside" to carrying in that position.

Smartcarry or Bellyband would be much better options to consider.

Austin
 
#11 ·
Doesn't sound like employment is THAT big of a concern for you.

You may wish to ponder which is more likely, needing deadly force in the work place or having something unforeseen such as a misplaced bump into someone or having your cover snag on something and expose your firearm?

Usually when someone is terminated for disregarding company policy it's considered an honesty issue even if it's not breaking the law. What kind of referral would you expect after being terminated?

You may wish to consider other means of self defense while working.
 
#14 ·
I have to agree carrying where you know you are not supposed to is a bad idea. Career wise as stated but also legally depending on the state law. I work in a no firearms environment as well however the company understands how criminals read the no guns sign and refuses to put one up. Legally you would think i could carry however i could still be prosecuted because i knew the policy. I confirmed this with a lawyer before deciding to carry. I signed the policy. It's the same as if i saw the sign and walked right on past it.

Fyi at 6ft 175 lbs i feel your pain however i found pocket carry in a wallet holster works best. I carry a beretta jetfire as a bug in a wallet holster. I put my cards and cash in a very thin clip in a different pocket. No one has ever asked what's in my "wallet".

.tn is an open carry state so my primary rides iwb or owb . I keep it covered most times but if anyone sees its not a big deal.
 
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#15 ·
I am not going to say anything about if you should or shouldn't carry at work. That you will have to decide. I will say of all the choices available IMHO the small of the back is the worst. Get knocked on your back or slip and fall on your back and it can easily be very bad on the spine.
Put an unloaded weapon in place and lay on the floor on your back and you will see what I mean.
Pretty much deep conceal is the way to go ( for work ) either a cell pal or smart carry. You could go without a shirt and nothing would show. After work you could switch to whatever you like.
I will say that if something happens at work and you fire, you're fired.
Remember the two hunters that were being chased by the bear?
One asked if they could outrun the bear.
"Nope, I just have to outrun you."
So a good option for the no weapon at work, could be practice ducking and running 3 times a week. You're Doctor will be happy with your new found health interest in exercise.
 
#16 ·
Unless your life is in danger and I MEAN FROM GREAT BODILY HARM,OR DEATH KEEP YOUR GUN HOLSTERED,getting in a verbal argument and somebody says I oughta kick your ass does not give you an opening to pull a gun,do it and you will not only lose your gun and your permit,but won't be buying any guns in the future if convicted of Aggravated assault etc.
 
#18 ·
Thanks for all of the advice. In my job I am directly responsible for making sure employees get paid for their work. Sometimes I have had to take money away because of mistakes they have made that I had to pay another technician to correct. This is company policy, so I don't have a choice in the matter. I have on more than one occasion had a technician confront me and become very irate and combative over this, its just the nature of the business. I am one of the most calm people you will ever meet, my wife jokes that the house could be burning down and I would still be as calm as ever. I absolutely would never use my firearm to "end" a heated argument, but I have nearly been assaulted without even saying a word. Unfortunately this behavior is quite common in my area of work in general, and while I have zero desire to get in a fight with anyone, it is a real possibility. I have changed firms recently so I am going to feel out the situation here before I decide to carry. For now my pistol will remained locked in mynglovebox while I am working. I doubt if I will actually go through with carrying at work, but I always am exploring my option for doing so.

I follow the doctrine quoted below in my daily life. I simply want to be prepared should that fail.
 
#20 ·
Thanks for all of the advice. ... I absolutely would never use my firearm to "end" a heated argument, but ... while I have zero desire to get in a fight with anyone, it is a real possibility. ...I follow the doctrine quoted below in my daily life. ...
Shadow, good to hear. My words may not have been warranted. Seems your desire for someone to 'admit they were wrong' was more along the lines of getting them to accept company policy docked pay rather than a desire to win an argument. Whew. Apologies if I overstepped myself.

... I have zero desire to get in a fight with anyone, it is a real possibility. ...
The other thing to consider is that an employee is unlikely to use fisticuffs to kill you: sure, he may want to punch you in the nose and may actually connect, but the setting isn't quite the same as insulting someone at a biker bar. Small comfort and a thin reed to put one's trust in, but in the balance it may be a factor to consider.
 
#19 ·
I can LEGALLY carry at my place of employment but am prohibited by company policy. I follow my employer's wishes. I will not risk the well being of my family by risking my employment. I carry everywhere else, and Texas did protect it's CHL holders with parking lot laws last year. That's my choice, and everyone must make their own.
 
#21 ·
Carry position:

Concealment; in each of the desired carry position try and go through a normal range of movement at home to determine how it "prints". The deciding factor for me not to SOB carry is if I have to lean over say to pick up a heavy object off the floor or the 1st shelf at the grocery, it will print really bad to the point any fool could see that your are armed. To me this is the worst case scenario regardless of how you carry from the sides on back. For the most part I lift as if I have a back brace on (good for your back anyway).

Another item for consideration is retention, to me the further back from 3:00 adds to the complexity. Either way please get some training here you can a lot by simple body positioning.

Lastly comfort, personal preference here for sure and SOB might win out.

For me 3:00 wins however I have to carry 3:30, driving or sitting for extended periods @ 3:00 is uncomfortable to painful.
 
#24 ·
The way it usually goes is this.
I notice an issue with the work, as part of my job is also quality control. I approach the technician, and usually say something like, "Hey Billy, would you mind looking at this Camaro you worked on? It seems like the door is not shutting quite right. Billy looks at the vehicle, says everything looks fine to me, I check it over again and still have the same issue. I approach Billy again, and say, " I appreciate you taking a look at that issue, it seems like the door is still hanging up a bit when opening." From there is when the problems arise. Billy accuses me of being "too picky", says the customer will never notice, things like that. I take the vehicle over to Dan, who refuses to work on the vehicle because Billy has already worked on it. At this point I involve the manager and let him know what I have done up to this point. It is at this point the manager goes to Dan and gets Dan to fix the problem. I am instructed by my manager to make the necessary changes to the repair order to pay Dan for his time while taking that away from Billy. Billy gets his pay sheet at the end of the week, and next thing I know he is in my face screaming. In this case Billy is a 65 year old man with a temper.

Luckily I no longer work with Billy or for that company, but I am working in the same business in the same area. I think I will take the advice of most people here and just leave my pistol in the car. Open carry is legal here in VA, so I don't have much need or desire to conceal otherwise. The main reason for getting my CHP is so that I can open carry, but not have to worry about accidental concealment.
 
#25 ·
If it is legal to carry somewhere than do so. My wife's job has a pro carry policy, which is strange to find anywhere today. I have caught myself before when I see a sign on a business that I am about to enter that says no weapons allowed, I will simply walk back out to my truck and lock my weapon up. When you say I am going to carry concealed you have the responsibility to do so legally. Please don't be the guy, the one person that messes up COW for all the others in your state.
 
#26 ·
Here in VA those signs carry no force of law. I can be asked to leave if someone were to notice my weapon and report me, but I can not be arrested for that. The only time that could happen is if I refused to leave, which would get a call to cops, who would again ask me to leave and issue a $25 citation for trespassing. Were I to be belligerent with the officers, and refuse to leave again, they may be within their rights to arrest me, but I have no desire to do that. I will gladly leave if asked, while politely explaining to the management that they will not see me again in their store at all. Then I would happily write a letter to the owners and let them know I am forwarding it to the VCDL, explain how many members are involved with the organization, and advise them of the potential loss of business.
 
#27 ·
Sounds like it might work, if the material is stiff enough, only way to know is to try it. I know exactly what you are talking about. Pretty easy to conceal wearing a great big untucked shirt, but doesn't work in an office environment. Can't have any clips showing.

Have you tried the "crotch sling" type holsters? They're more comfortable anyway, and no shirt tail to get in the way, unless you want it to. They also don't have to be worn in the crotch area, they easily will work at 4 o'clock. Either that or one of the "T-shirt" or "Bra" type holsters. Not as comfortable, but they do work in that situation.
 
#28 ·
Sounds like your sure going through a lot of trouble to perfect a way of carrying in a place your really not supposed to be carrying. Just leave it in the parking lot locked safely in your car. No need to risk your job or confrontation by an employee. Sounds more like you want to carry just to carry/trying to be badass than carry to protect. Just my .02
 
#29 ·
If you sew a loop into your pants, it would be best to locate it at the belt loop; otherwise you will sag between loops. Unfortunately this will put the holster right between your cheeks, which may be uncomfortable and a little gross.

Depending on the sewing machine you have, it may not be able to handle passing through multiple layers. I would suggest multiple passes with a satin stitch. Something else to think about is how to hide the back side of the stitching. Even with closely matched thread color, you will see a lump of stitching on the outside of your pants where you have sewn the loops. If you do not go through all the layers to the outside, I would not trust the stitching to hold. I also would not trust hand stitching to hold. I would try to place the stitches at the waistband above where a belt would ride, since you are already planning to wear a belt. I wouldn't put it at the top of the waistband, also for support reasons. At the waistband where it joins to the rest of the pants but above that seam would probably be the best location.

Rivets are an option but the at-home rivet kits aren't great in my experience, and then you'd have a bit of metal poking against your skin. Actually the same would be a problem with a sewn in loop. No matter what the loops are made of, they're going to have edges that will rub against your skin and if you use a heavy duty thread, the stitching itself might chafe (The inside of where my belt loops are sewn on my Carhartts do this).

I would suggest a Remora for two reasons:
1, it can be tucked anywhere, installed quickly if you're not going to be carrying all day.
2, it is a useful tool to try different positions and help make the decision for a more solid holster setup. Mine stays put well no matter where I wear it, but I probably wear my pants a little tighter than you.

As for work ... that's your choice, but personally I err on the side of caution and lock it in my truck. Almost every company I've worked for has a no guns policy. Luckily I can carry at the college I attend, because otherwise that is the LAST parking lot I would leave my gun in my car.
 
#30 ·
Yeah I'm not worried about leaving it in my car, and again, I'm going to probably err on the side of caution and leave it in the car anyway. My main point in creating this thread was to get some ideas about the loops sewn inside my pants. Now that question has been answered so I think this thread is done. I didn't at all mean to get into the specifics of what goes on at my job, but that is a turn the thread has taken. Thanks for all the advice.
 
#31 ·
As small as you are appendix carry is your best bet. When a shirt must be tucked in doing it with a smart carry is a great option. When you can have the shirt untucked there are hundreds of options.
 
#32 ·
I open carry everywhere I go now, and before I head out for the days errands, I check to see if any of the places I am going prohibit carrying a firearm. If that is the case, I will leave my pistol at home, go to that one spot, then head back home and re-arm. Typically the only places around here that don't allow carrying are malls, and I avoid those as much as possible anyway. Once I get my CHP I WILL carry at the mall if I have to go there, as it is usually my wife I am shopping with, and we will have our baby girl with us as well. I couldn't stand knowing I could have been carrying and didn't if something bad did happen.
 
#33 ·
My 2 cents: I think you are way over thinking something. First..I would never carry small of my back. IMO it is the worst place to carry and offers no significant advantages. My wife is 110 lbs soaking wet and carries a 228 with no problems concealing.

I am not a big fan of pocket carry but if you are so concerned about being seen that is a good option.

As far as the reasons you are carrying...from what you said it wold be stemming from an arguement. At verbal exchange distances you should really consider other than lethal means in case someone assaults you. Drawing from the small of your back with a person about to assualt you is not the best situation. You most likely will end up getting hit first and then a struggle for the gun.....just saying.
 
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