Retention strap - or no? - Page 2

Retention strap - or no?

This is a discussion on Retention strap - or no? within the Defensive Carry Holsters & Carry Options forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Well for years I carried my 1911 in Snick inside the belt holster. I have recently changed to an inside the belt Uncle Mike holster ...

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Thread: Retention strap - or no?

  1. #16
    Member Array TAPS CCW's Avatar
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    Strapless

    Well for years I carried my 1911 in Snick inside the belt holster. I have recently changed to an inside the belt Uncle Mike holster made of kydex. It has tension screws and is molded so that gun clicks in. In the old days you had to do a backward roll over before your holster was allowed in practical competition. I still try to use a holster that will retain the gun without the use of a retention strap. For outside the belt I have several holsters the latest being a Blackhawk CQC with the Serpa retention device. Just click the gun into the holster. You press the large button to remove the gun. It is all part of the draw and you use your trigger finger. Very secure,safe and very fast. The new technology is good and we try to improve things as we go. With enough practice you can become good with any type of holster, the key is PRACTICE!!
    T.A.P.S.
    Tactics-Accuracy-Power-Speed


  2. #17
    Bravo3
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    No straps for me, either.

  3. #18
    Member Array logistar's Avatar
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    Another "Black Sheep"

    Every holster I use for carry has a thumb break - except pocket holsters. I do NOT want that gun coming out of the holster if I fall down, etc. (I can be kinda active at times!)

  4. #19
    Member Array triggertime's Avatar
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    If you're inclined to carry openly, then a retention strap or security 'feature' would make sense. But since concealed means concealed, a retention strap on a concealment holster seems pointless (except for shoulder rigs, of course).

    I'd say that if your gun has the tendency to fall out of its holster, then something is wrong with the holster.

  5. #20
    Distinguished Member Array Gideon's Avatar
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    Okay, I see that most favor no strap, but it seem this has something to do with carrying locked and cocked. I have two questions in this area, having just gotten my first 1911.

    1. Mechanically speaking, is it safer to carry hammer down on a loaded chamber or cocked and locked? I'm not asking which is faster in a bad situation, simply which is mechanically better. Alot of my other pistols have a transfer bar that blocks the hammer so you could beat it and it wouldn't go off. How does the 1911 work?

    2. If you choose to carry cocked and locked, isn't a strap more for preventing accidental discharges than for retaining the weapon?

    Holsters are kind of expensive to get a few different versions so I'm really down to one holster now, but just can decide whether to get it with a strap or not....

    Any thoughts would be apperciated....

    thanks

    Gideon

  6. #21
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    Gideon .... condition #1 with a 1911 platform is IMO safer than condition #2. Not only do you have the thumb safety but also - the grip safety. That latter is something folks often forget. OTOH, if I carry BHP condition #1 then I only have the thumb safety.

    I guess there are cases where a retention strap is regarded as an extra safety but not always by any means, tho with BHP that could be certainly valid.

    In your case, I think decide primarily on whether you want the extra security of a strap - which if thumb-break then something you can practice with and avoid much loss of draw time.
    Chris - P95
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    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


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  7. #22
    Senior Member Array CombatEffective's Avatar
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    I only have retention snaps on my duty holsters. I do have a couple of those Uncle Mike's nylon belt slides that I use on the range sometimes. I use the retention straps with them, but I'm really not using them as CCW rigs.

  8. #23
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    CE - with those duty rigs - do you do much practice on the draw?? I think you'd have to to have that fluid thumb break sorta slick move. I know guys with duty rigs do reckon that with enough practice they are no problem at all.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  9. #24
    Senior Member Array CombatEffective's Avatar
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    I can draw and fire shots on two targets in under a second from my triple retention duty holster. Of course on the quals course or tactics training I am expecting to make a draw. I have the draw stroke so ingrained that draws are not a problem. In fact, several times on the job I have broken leather without ever making the conscious decision to do so. I needed my gun and it appeared in my hand.

  10. #25
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    I have broken leather without ever making the conscious decision to do so.
    Impressive - and of course just as should be Glad to hear it.
    Chris - P95
    NRA Certified Instructor & NRA Life Member.

    "To own a gun and assume that you are armed
    is like owning a piano and assuming that you are a musician!."


    http://www.rkba-2a.com/ - a portal for 2A links, articles and some videos.

  11. #26
    Senior Member Array CombatEffective's Avatar
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    Well, a lot of agencies and shooters only work on the mechanics of shooting. Before budget cuts got us the last few years, our department would bring in a FATS simulator so that we could work on the "mental trigger" of judgemetnal shooting, which in my opinion is as important as the mechanics of shooting. Our now retired chief always told us to concentrate on when a shooter is justified to shoot rather than when a shooter "should" have shot based on a scenario or true life situation. In other words, he didn't want us saying "this is when you should have shot" because that decision will come at different points for each of us. One such discussion took place after watching a dash cam video of an officer involved shooting in when an officer was killed. As we were watching it we were all making comments as to what we would have done and when.

    As result of going through so much judgemental training I believe my mental trigger clicks a bit faster than officers/shooters that haven't gone through it.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by CombatEffective
    I can draw and fire shots on two targets in under a second from my triple retention duty holster. Of course on the quals course or tactics training I am expecting to make a draw. I have the draw stroke so ingrained that draws are not a problem. In fact, several times on the job I have broken leather without ever making the conscious decision to do so. I needed my gun and it appeared in my hand.
    Five shots on two targets from a triple retention holster in under one second?

    If you could draw in 1/2 second, which is lightning fast for a no retention holster much less a triple retention, you'd have to fire five shots in the next 1/2 second, or 0.125 seconds per shot to be under a second. And that's if it takes no time at all to transistion from the first target to the second target. You sure your time is right? I've never heard of anyone coming close to that.

  13. #28
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    I do not have a strap on my bellyband holster. I do use a retention strap on my ankle holster.
    "Americans have the will to resist because you have weapons. If you don't have a gun, freedom of speech has no power." - Yoshimi Ishikawa

  14. #29
    Senior Member Array CombatEffective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tangle
    Five shots on two targets from a triple retention holster in under one second?

    If you could draw in 1/2 second, which is lightning fast for a no retention holster much less a triple retention, you'd have to fire five shots in the next 1/2 second, or 0.125 seconds per shot to be under a second. And that's if it takes no time at all to transistion from the first target to the second target. You sure your time is right? I've never heard of anyone coming close to that.
    Please read my post again. I wrote draw and FIRE shots on multiple targets. I never said anything about 5 shots.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by CombatEffective
    Please read my post again. I wrote draw and FIRE shots on multiple targets. I never said anything about 5 shots.
    So you did - sorry senior moment!

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