Bulman Leather

This is a discussion on Bulman Leather within the Defensive Carry Holsters & Carry Options forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Has anyone here had any recent dealings with Bulman Gunleather? If so, have you had any trouble communicating with him via email and or phone. ...

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  1. #1
    Member Array sdr7871's Avatar
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    Bulman Leather

    Has anyone here had any recent dealings with Bulman Gunleather? If so, have you had any trouble communicating with him via email and or phone. I can't seem to get the man to call me or return an email.Any advice would be greatly appreciated.....

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    Senior Member Array dgg9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sdr7871 View Post
    Has anyone here had any recent dealings with Bulman Gunleather? If so, have you had any trouble communicating with him via email and or phone. I can't seem to get the man to call me or return an email.Any advice would be greatly appreciated.....
    Good timing. I placed an order for a holster right around New Year's, so it's been 9 months. Over the last week, I left a message or two on the phone -- no reply. Yesterday I emailed, so we'll see if that gets answered.

    But I'm not sure what phone contact will do. Usually if you manage to catch these guys on the phone, you'll get the automatic "oh yeah, your holster is in the pile right now -- it'll be out next week" line to get you off the phone, and of course you won't see it next week.

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    Senior Member Array slimjim's Avatar
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    I placed an order back in Aug. Was able to reach him via telephone after a few attempts. Was quoted 5 months wait time. I sent him an email a few weeks back asking a question unrelated to my order and have yet to hear back from him. From what I've observed lately, I'm planning on waiting much more than 5 months.

    An account of one man's recent experience taken from Glocktalk:

    9/14 - Ordered $330 worth of gear via his website and paid in full via PayPal.

    9/14 - Sent a follow-up email 9/14 asking a few questions and asking for payment confirmation.

    9/17 - No response to the email - Resent it from different email address (hotmail).

    9/18 - Called - no answer and could not leave a voicemail due to "Mailbox is Full" error.

    9/21 - Called again - same voicemail problem.

    9/24 - Called again - this time, was able to leave a voicemail and I asked that he call me.

    9/25 - Called again - left another voicemail asking that he call me TODAY otherwise I would be forced to send this transaction to PayPal resolution.

    9/26 - Filed a request for resolutions via PayPal resolution center.

    (updated later)

    10/01 - Called and left another voicemail and sent follow-up emails from 2 accounts.

    10/02 - Still no contact...Upgrade the for resolutions via PayPal resolution center to a full fledged claim.

    Sorry...but no sign of a heartbeat for weeks is enough for me to want my money refunded. I am sure he makes a fine holster, but...
    Last edited by slimjim; October 11th, 2007 at 07:07 AM.

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    Member Array stevep's Avatar
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    i paid for a 'high ride' thru paypal last January and waited till 2 weeks ago to call him and ask about it. He stated the order was misplaced and would make it that weekend and ship it monday...i was gullible enough to believe him. well its been 2 more weeks and i still have not seen it. i guess another call is in order.

    *ordered on 1/30/07
    *called 9/28/07 and was told it will be shipped on the 1st of Oct.
    *this is the 10th of Oct. and still waiting

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    Member Array stevep's Avatar
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    i just found out from paypal because i did not file the resolution request within 45 days they will not help recover funds. this is a lesson to never use paypal for something not to be delivered before 45 days ie holsters with a 6 month wait time.

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    Member Array sdr7871's Avatar
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    Well, I suppose this an inherent "theme" with "custom holster" craftsmen. I must say I am somewhat disappointed in the lack of "customer care and service" they give.(Yes, I understand I am generalizing) Allow me to expound. Having served in the retail industry for 27 years I believe I can speak a thing or two about customer service. What we are witnessing here is a lack of business acumen and awareness of a customers expectations. I do indeed get the sense that these "craftsmen" truly believe they are doing us "customers" a favor. They would expect us to tolerate poor service and lack of communication because they are " craftsmen" and their work takes much time. How dare us to demand simple straight forward answers to our questions! The gall of us "customers" to even question their integrity or sincerity! Mr. Bulman and others(you know who you are).The time has come for the complacency and apathy on your parts to END. We are the ones that keep you in business.WE are the ones that extoll your work to others so youmay garner more business. Do not attempt to insult our intelligence anymore with excuses and inane laments. Deliver the products that have been ordered in good faith and do so in a timely fashion. If you have issues then simply COMMUNICATE with your customer. Sounds fairly simple right? Well then...... get to it OK?

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    Senior Member Array Slim_45's Avatar
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    Well my solution for this problem is that i would NEVER order anything from someone like this. He has my money & i have nothing, screw that

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    Distinguished Member Array jarhead79's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sdr7871 View Post
    Well, I suppose this an inherent "theme" with "custom holster" craftsmen. I must say I am somewhat disappointed in the lack of "customer care and service" they give.(Yes, I understand I am generalizing) Allow me to expound. Having served in the retail industry for 27 years I believe I can speak a thing or two about customer service. What we are witnessing here is a lack of business acumen and awareness of a customers expectations. I do indeed get the sense that these "craftsmen" truly believe they are doing us "customers" a favor. They would expect us to tolerate poor service and lack of communication because they are " craftsmen" and their work takes much time. How dare us to demand simple straight forward answers to our questions! The gall of us "customers" to even question their integrity or sincerity! Mr. Bulman and others(you know who you are).The time has come for the complacency and apathy on your parts to END. We are the ones that keep you in business.WE are the ones that extoll your work to others so youmay garner more business. Do not attempt to insult our intelligence anymore with excuses and inane laments. Deliver the products that have been ordered in good faith and do so in a timely fashion. If you have issues then simply COMMUNICATE with your customer. Sounds fairly simple right? Well then...... get to it OK?
    Please don't group all holster makers in the same stereotype. There are many craftsmen that do business in the manner in which everyone wins. Your guidelines pretty much sum it up, in my opinion.

    I can list off makers that communicate and deliver, but that's not my place. But don't black all our eyes.

    Nate
    www.ubgholsters.com short wait times. Use 'defensivecarry' as a coupon code for a discount to your order.

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    Member Array sdr7871's Avatar
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    Sir, It is not my intention to "blacken" anyones eyes. Perhaps you and your business would be best served by distancing yourself from such people that bring disgrace upon your profession.Then again, Maybe you sir as a "peer"(that obviously) understands our position can exert some influence on those that shame your craft and bring about a change that will benefit all. If you truly care for all of your brother craftsmen then speak out to those that are wrong in their practice and show them how a good business man gets the job done. We that have paid our monies and have waited extraordinarily long times for our goods implore someone such as you to take up our cause.What say you sir?....

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    whw
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    Quote Originally Posted by jarhead79 View Post
    Please don't group all holster makers in the same stereotype. There are many craftsmen that do business in the manner in which everyone wins. Your guidelines pretty much sum it up, in my opinion.

    I can list off makers that communicate and deliver, but that's not my place. But don't black all our eyes.

    Nate
    I would appreciate a list of the good guys, because I'm soured on the, "don't call me, I'll call you" response. So much so that I'm going to start ordering from a big corporation that can deliver on what they advertise. I would rather have a holster that is of lesser quality than one that costs a lot of money and is never delivered.

    whw

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    Member Array SiG239's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevep View Post
    i just found out from paypal because i did not file the resolution request within 45 days they will not help recover funds. this is a lesson to never use paypal for something not to be delivered before 45 days ie holsters with a 6 month wait time.

    cancel through your credit card/bank?

  13. #12
    Member Array Piglet's Avatar
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    sdr7871 said:

    The time has come for the complacency and apathy on your parts to END. We are the ones that keep you in business.WE are the ones that extoll your work to others so you may garner more business. Do not attempt to insult our intelligence anymore with excuses and inane laments. Deliver the products that have been ordered in good faith and do so in a timely fashion. If you have issues then simply COMMUNICATE with your customer. Sounds fairly simple right? Well then...... get to it OK?
    I have to say that I sympathize with both sides on this issue. I currently have something on order from another maker and have been waiting for a very long time.

    For one thing, I can certainly understand your frustration. The situation you and I are experiencing is, as you have observed, getting to be very common among custom leather makers.

    The simple fact of the matter is that many of these makers have simply bitten off more than they can chew. Starting months ago, I would guess, they continued taking orders that they knew, or must have at least suspected, would back them up so badly that they would be way behind schedule.

    Then, once they started becoming significantly behind schedule, another extremely serious problem manifested itself - people's impatience. Customers started to call and email doggedly, trying to find out "when it's going to be done". From what I hear, the number of these communications from customers is way beyond what I would have first imagined; so much so that the holster makers, were they to answer everybody's messages, wouldn't be making any holsters at all! It would require all their time to explain themselves to us.

    Here's a quote from Brommeland's website:

    As many of you are aware, we experienced a period of time in which our supply of leather was interrupted and as a result, we are running very behind in our deliveries. The problem is being TREMENDOUSLY compounded with "is it done yet?" phone calls and emails - so many of them that our production is now down well below 50% of what we can normally accomplish.

    Please bear in mind that we normally have 2-3 hundred orders at any given time, plus new folks calling and asking product questions every day as well. If each of our existing customers called us with an "is it done yet"? call every two weeks, that's 30 calls a day, plus new customer inquires. Plus emails. Plus PM's. We simply can't do it all.
    So, he goes on to say,
    "please be advised that all "is it done yet"? emails will be deleted without response."
    Though it could be argued that such a situation (by no means limited to Brommeland - several others seem to be experiencing something similar) is at least somewhat the fault of the holster maker (if only through their failure to somehow communicate to their customers what may be perfectly legitimate reasons for the delay - communication that I have to believe would eliminate some of the calls and emails, since the customers would finally understand what was going on), it is undeniable that they cannot answer all these messages and still fill any orders. So I understand, though I'm not happy about it at all.

    However, in my opinion there definitely is something that these makers can do to relieve the pressure somewhat. Why not do what Matt Del Fatti does, and post on your website the month from which you are building orders? Provided you holster makers fill orders in the order in which they were received (is this the case?), wouldn't this serve to soothe customers whose orders are way behind schedule? Even if they aren't happy that they won't be getting to their order for a while, at least they'll hear something from you, even if it's not a personal message of any sort but just a general advisory! But we have to hear SOMETHING!

    Please note that I'm not talking about the guy who order 6 months ago, and was given an estimate (and I realize it's just that, an estimate) of 4-5 months delivery. I'm talking about the kind of people who ordered over a year ago, having been told maybe 3-4 months, and have heard nothing for a long time, and whose messages are not being returned.

    Several weeks ago I attempted correspondence with another custom maker whose product I have been waiting for for well over a year, to no avail. A couple emails, about a week apart, followed by a letter, went unanwered. So, instead of angrily barraging him with messages, I just stopped. I am confident that, even though it's bothersome for me to get no response, he got at least one of my messages (the letter if nothing else), and he's aware of my order. This is all I really wanted, because I had become worried that the order had become lost, since I know of several people who ordered after did and yet have already received their holsters from him.

    I know that there's really nothing I can do now. Just have to wait.

    Bottom line: How things came to such a pass may be discussed to no end: there are probably both lame excuses and honest explanations such as the legitimate material/supply problems we hear about from time to time. But we have to cut the makers some slack and let them work, instead of asking them to spend the time typing or talking.

    At the same time, as you have said, as customers we must be able to get some idea of how all we are going to find out anything about the status of long overdue orders. It is only fair. Otherwise, how long do they expect us to wait? What is reasonable? I have to believe that once you've waited 3 or 4 times as long as estimated, even the most harried and overworked craftsman will agree that the customer is owed some kind of update.

    So, on behalf of all those who feel as I do and acknowledge the current catch-22 situation, I have this to suggest/ask/beg of those custom makers who find themselves backed up with orders and also overwhelmed with communication from customers:

    Please, though I know you can't personally answer every call and email, could you at least find some way to publicly post, on gun forums or your website, some kind of occasional, overall status updates regarding "where you currently are" in your order queue. Could you just say "currently building orders from month/year", or something like that? Just a little something so we can get a rough idea of how long it's going to be.

    The thing that frustrates me is not the holster's taking far longer than predicted by the maker when the order was placed; it's feeling as though I've dropped off the radar as far as they are concerned. When months and months have passed without any word, particularly when one hears on forums about others receiving holsters that they ordered well after you did, there is a real concern that maybe your order has been lost, or slipped through the cracks or something. Even a little communication, in any form, would help! If the holster maker posted something that said "making orders from January 2007", and you ordered in October 2006, then that might give you a heads-up that there might be a problem. If the maker posted that he's having trouble with his sharkskin supplier, then if your rig's shark it would at least give you an idea of what could be wrong, and set your mind at rest.

    Okay, I'm getting down now!

    I hope I didn't get carried away. I mean everything I say in a friendly way - I just want to get some relief and answers for both sides here, the leatherworkers and customers.

    P.S.: Saw that I misread the guy from Glocktalk's situation, so I deleted my comments about it. Sorry for that, I should read more carefully.
    Last edited by Piglet; October 11th, 2007 at 12:03 PM. Reason: grammar, for clarity

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    Senior Member Array slimjim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whw View Post
    I would appreciate a list of the good guys, because I'm soured on the, "don't call me, I'll call you" response. So much so that I'm going to start ordering from a big corporation that can deliver on what they advertise. I would rather have a holster that is of lesser quality than one that costs a lot of money and is never delivered.

    whw
    In my experience, the following have delivered in a reasonable fashion. (without stating whom I have ordered from)
    1) UBG Holsters
    2) Fist
    3) Kramer
    4) Mika

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    Senior Member Array FlyboyLDB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    In my experience, the following have delivered in a reasonable fashion. (without stating whom I have ordered from)
    1) UBG Holsters
    2) Fist
    3) Kramer
    4) Mika
    Add Crossbreed to the list.

  16. #15
    Member Array dougja's Avatar
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    d&dgunleather.com ... man of his word, good communication, fast shipment, quality product, expensive :) It's so true...you get what you pay for.

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