Comparison of Ctac and Raven Concealment IWB holster

This is a discussion on Comparison of Ctac and Raven Concealment IWB holster within the Defensive Carry Holsters & Carry Options forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Hey Austin, The holes are the rivets that hold the two pieces of Kydex together. I think the two piece sandwich enables them to make ...

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Thread: Comparison of Ctac and Raven Concealment IWB holster

  1. #16
    Member Array pbanbury's Avatar
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    Hey Austin,
    The holes are the rivets that hold the two pieces of Kydex together. I think the two piece sandwich enables them to make the whole thing thiner at the sides (front and rear of the gun). They are nice heavy rivets, and look to be very well fit and seated. May be a source of weakness, so I will inspect regularly, but rivets do hold some high tech stuff together don't they?

    The various belt loop and hanger thingies then screw through the revets- Raven spaces the rivets to allow additional pieces like mag carriers and light holsters to then also link up via the same screws. Hence they call it a system.

    To answer your question, the holster challenges concealment by adding thickness. Leather and double leather, thick kydex, clips placed over the holster all add thickness to the Rig. What I think Raven does well is use thin kydex, and ensure the edges along the front and back of holster (leading and following edge) curve to the body, thus reducing the overall size of the blocky thing. Leather does this really well too, of course, but I am kinda a kydex guy for this gun and EDC. So to me it is a good choice- so far.

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  3. #17
    Member Array Jaystekan's Avatar
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    WOW pbanbury, Raven should be paying you to advertise their product. nice looking holster. I am in the market for a holster right now for some of my guns. The raven looks interesting. Their website sucks, but maybe after a few more reviews, I may give them a shot.
    Remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

  4. #18
    Member Array pbanbury's Avatar
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    Sorry if I came across overly enthused about this product. I meant to just give some creds and exposure to a holster I found to be on a par with others that more people are aware of, cause I haven't seen much on this company. Of course, that IS the purpose of advertising isn't it?


    Hmmmm, might there be a fee in here somewhere??? Well looking at the website, I am guessing the Co. has a pretty small budget for that sort of thing, so I am SOL again!!

  5. #19
    Member Array BluesStringer's Avatar
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    Hey, I'm glad you were so enthusiastic! If you weren't, I probably wouldn't have checked out Raven and just bought one! Yeah, I read this thread this morning about 8:00 am, and just finished ordering one after a few emails with Jay to work out some special needs I had, which he was more than willing to help me figure out.

    I recently bought a Crossbreed Super-Tuck Deluxe for my RAMI and was so impressed with how comfortable an IWB holster could be, that I set about trying to find one for my Smith & Wesson 4563TSW. I've been pouring over the long list of holster manufacturers in this part of the forum, and had just about decided to just go with another Crossbreed for the Smith, when I started reading some of the threads in this forum while I mulled it over one last time. I admit that I was a bit put off by Raven's sorely lacking website, but I stuck with trying to figure out how to navigate it and realized that, not only could I have a high-quality tuckable IWB, belt-slide AND pancake rig, all for under $100 bucks, but that same holster will accommodate my gun with my TLR-2 light/laser attached. That cinched it, and I ordered it. Jay said to give him two weeks to adapt some Crossbreed-style V-Clips where the standard Overhooks go in the pics above, which will work perfectly with the Belt Man gun-belt that should arrive any day now with the optional Velcro sewn into the entire usable length.

    Thanks for the lead pbanbury! I'm stoked!

    Blues
    "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." -- George Washington

  6. #20
    Member Array pbanbury's Avatar
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    Good luck with the new rig Blues. Let us know how it works out for you.

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array NCHornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by white79bu View Post
    I am looking at ordering a holster but I am looking at the one with the light. It would be for my M&P45 w/ insight ssl-1 light. I am just trying to decide if I want to carry the light or without. Has anyone else thought about carrying a weapon mounted gun for CCW?
    (I already carry a surefire g2z light)
    I myself would never carry a defensive weapon with a light mounted to it. Every bit of training I have received and the majority of what I have read always suggests using your light source in the weak hand, especially when cornering. Why give the dude a target, especially if you have the gun pointed out in front of your chest!! IMHO I feel the whole idea of light mounted weapons to be more of a mall ninja type thing, and they sell because they look cool. I myself wil always prefer a seperate light in my weak hand. For that I prefer my 120 lumen NF-2. But to each his own I am just stating my opinion which you asked for.
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  8. #22
    Senior Member Array sheepdog's Avatar
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    I've been wondering for a long time why nobody could make an IWB/OWB convertible like this. I saw a leather one or two, can't recall who made them, but they looked awkward and I don't even remember who made them...must not have worked.
    Maybe the secret is in the squaring and curving of the holster shape, or the sandwich rather than "taco" style construction, I don't know. I think I'll watch this one for a while. Can anyone that has one tell me how thick the Kydex is?
    What Would Gumby Do?

  9. #23
    Member Array BluesStringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by white79bu View Post
    I am looking at ordering a holster but I am looking at the one with the light. It would be for my M&P45 w/ insight ssl-1 light. I am just trying to decide if I want to carry the light or without. Has anyone else thought about carrying a weapon mounted gun for CCW?
    (I already carry a surefire g2z light)
    I obviously don't agree with the "mall ninja" crap based solely on how and where one chooses to carry their equipment, but I'll tell you why I decided to order my holster so I have the capability to carry my light/laser. For one thing, the Raven is modular, so I can always get just the holster and attach the mounting hardware to it if I find that carrying with the light is too bulky or heavy. For another thing, I already have a bunch of ways of carrying my Smith, only one of which accommodates the TLR-2, and that is not concealable at all. This system may or may not turn out to be comfortable to wear IWB and tucked with the light attached. That's why I ordered the pancake attachment also. I will have the potential one way or the other to carry my preferred weapon with the add-on equipment I've bought for it if and when I want to.

    Now, I can understand the concern about using a weapon-mounted light and it creating the perfect sight-picture for the BG to shoot at in a dark environment. If that were the only consideration in a shooting scenario that I could envision myself being involved in, I would agree that they're a bad idea. Obviously, it's not the only scenario though, and for me at least, the laser is what I'm more interested in than the light. I don't know a human alive who can acquire a target with their naked eye faster than they can with a laser, especially if they have to concentrate on using a flashlight with their weak hand at the same time, and holding it away from their body to fool the BG into thinking they're standing where they're not. I'm not suggesting that's a "mall ninja" way to train. It's perfectly valid if that's what you're most comfortable with, as is my belief that acquiring the target in the shortest possible amount of time is more important than training to trick bad guys into thinking you're standing where you're not.

    Bottom line, I couldn't care less how "cool" my light/laser looks mounted to my gun. Who would I be trying to impress with my "coolness" anyway? The gun stays concealed after all, especially in a mall! I would answer the question that white79bu asked by saying that if you are at least as, or more, confident with your proficiency in using a weapon-mounted light or laser than in your ability to acquire a target with two different pieces of gear in two separate hands, go for it, and disregard and dismiss out of hand any suggestions that you're less concerned with protecting yourself and your family than you are with looking "cool."


    Blues
    "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." -- George Washington

  10. #24
    Member Array pbanbury's Avatar
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    Sheepdog, I will get out my micrometer when I get home tonight. For now, I can only say it is thinner than the norm, more like what it used on a knife sheath. Not very precise, so stand by. Jay at Malabar Front or at Raven Concealment could give an answer if you contact him via their "crappy website", I think it at least has a contact link. I know he doesn't spend much time at all on forums.

    I do know when I go from pancake OWB to IWB to on the belt it is a good, solid hook-up. Again not as much as my Blackhawk, but the objectives are different, and the IWB option is not there. In pancake mode it is very difficult to get off the belt, almost like the Blackhawk (which just about requires taking off your pants!). In full belt loop OWB mode it is the same as Blackhawk, only closer (much) to the body. The set up I don't have is the pancake hook ups, that supposedly pull the whole thing in even tighter. This is a concealment first rig, as Jay will tell ya.

  11. #25
    Member Array white79bu's Avatar
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    I think I am going to order a holster that will work with my weapon light. I just feel more comfortable with the weapon light than I do with holding the flashlight. I have trained both ways and the weapon light just works for me. Plus I kind of fiqure if I can carry the weapon light comfortably it's just another tool I can use if I need to protect my family. I am looking at buying a set crinsom trace laser grips in the future just for faster target acuiring.

  12. #26
    Member Array pbanbury's Avatar
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    Sheepdog, my calipers measure the kydex at .0525, which is roughly 1.3mm, or between 1/16th and 1/20th of an inch. Thin, but not flexible. As You can see from the pics it molds very very well- look close and you can see the grooves on the slide release lever coming through, as well as the dimples where the back side of the breakdown lever is.

    Paul

  13. #27
    Senior Member Array sheepdog's Avatar
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    Thank you, Paul. That gives me a go-by.
    What Would Gumby Do?

  14. #28
    Member Array BluesStringer's Avatar
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    Haven't gotten it yet, but below are two pics of my finished Raven holster. Jay sent them to me for my approval before mailing them out. He made the V-Clips on a one-off, special order basis and wanted to make sure they would suit my purposes. Can't say for positive until it gets here, but my instinct tells me it'll work out just fine. Anyway.....



    "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." -- George Washington

  15. #29
    Member Array ev239's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BluesStringer View Post
    Haven't gotten it yet, but below are two pics of my finished Raven holster. Jay sent them to me for my approval before mailing them out. He made the V-Clips on a one-off, special order basis and wanted to make sure they would suit my purposes. Can't say for positive until it gets here, but my instinct tells me it'll work out just fine. Anyway.....

    In this last pic I can see where you'll have problems with the clip sticking way out from the bottom of the belt announcing itself. A good velcro clip should only have the velcro part as long as the width of the belt and no longer otherwise it'll either stick down below the belt or above the belt too much.

    BluesStringer, you may find yourself taking a saw to your new clips to cut off the excess.
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  16. #30
    Member Array BluesStringer's Avatar
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    Nah, the holster came today and the length of the V-Clips is not the problem. They're actually shorter than my Crossbreed by a millimeter or three. There are a couple of other problems with the V-Clips however, but I'm not going to post about them until Jay has had a chance to make it right, which I have little doubt that he will do his best to do.

    Aside from that though, the holster itself, as well as the two alternate mounting adapters, are all top-notch. The slide mount draws the gun as close to my body as any holster I've ever tried, and the draw from that method is fast. Combined with my new Belt Man belt, the weight is distributed such that I really can't discern any difference in the way an OWB holster with my RAMI in it feels and this one with a much bigger, heavier gun plus a fatter-than-most light/laser, a TLR-2. The Kydex is very thin as pbanbury said, and the rig itself is lighter in weight than any other holster I own (and damn, I got a bunch of 'em!), yet the retention is excellent as well.

    The V-Clips worked well enough that I could try it on and walk around the house with 'em for a little bit, and again, at first blush, it seems like it will be as comfortable as my Crossbreed, which is saying a lot! I'll report back as I've had a chance to use the slide and pancake mounts a bit, and definitely let y'all know if, and how, the V-Clips make it into the use-rotation.

    Still glad as heck that pbanbury was so enthusiastic about Raven. Even if we can't work out the V-Clips, I'm still thrilled with the purchase.

    Blues
    "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." -- George Washington

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