25 yard groups

25 yard groups

This is a discussion on 25 yard groups within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Training with your carry weapon (type and load), at 25 yards, standing, free hand, 5 shot group. How tight do you keep them?...

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Thread: 25 yard groups

  1. #1
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    25 yard groups

    Training with your carry weapon (type and load), at 25 yards, standing, free hand, 5 shot group.
    How tight do you keep them?


  2. #2
    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    I don't train at 25 yards. Never have, never will unless it's with a rifle. I train for self defense and to me that is 10 yards and in....25 yard shots are for play...JMO
    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

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    Distinguished Member Array Tally XD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by First Sgt View Post
    I don't train at 25 yards. Never have, never will unless it's with a rifle. I train for self defense and to me that is 10 yards and in....25 yard shots are for play...JMO

    Agreed. Why train with a handgun at rifle distances? Keep it within 30 feet for S/D
    I am consistently on record and will continue to be on record as opposing concealed carry.
    - Barack Obama Chicago Tribune, April 27, 2004

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    Member Array rickmn50's Avatar
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    I don't train at 25 yards either. Mostly 30 feet and some up close stuff at 15 feet. If you can get 25 yards of space between you and the BG you should probably be able to evade and escape. At least that is what they would say at your trial.
    Best Regards from Minnesota,

    Rick

  5. #5
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    Tally XD says:

    "Agreed. Why train with a handgun at rifle distances? Keep it within 30 feet for S/D"

    Reasons:
    1. I believe it's the responsibility of anyone carrying a weapon to master that weapon - being able to get every bit of accuracy that the weapon is capable of.
    2. As you train more difficult shots, you become a better marksman.
    3. Training at distance (which 25 yards is NOT) improves shorter range accuracy.
    4. Training at distance improves the speed in which you get a good sight picture at shorter range.
    5. Almost any shot taken with a hand gun is better taken with a rifle - that doesn't make a 25 yard shot "rifle distance."
    6. You cannot have advance knowledge of the shot you'll need to take. Being prepared is a key element in survival.

    Okay...who among you that trains seriously would share what your 25 yard 5 shot groups look like?

  6. #6
    Member Array ATXFather's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickmn50 View Post
    I don't train at 25 yards either. Mostly 30 feet and some up close stuff at 15 feet. If you can get 25 yards of space between you and the BG you should probably be able to evade and escape. At least that is what they would say at your trial.
    I can hit 25 however all "Training" is done at 10 and 15 because if I have 25 yard im gone!!
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  7. #7
    kpw
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    At 25 yards and out, I'm prone or supported kneeling and I've never measured a group... just looking for COM hits. If somebody goes loony with a rifle, slim or not, I want a chance. From what I've read over the years, it can and does happen. Besides, it's just plain fun to do.
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  8. #8
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    There are those of us who only have range resources past or at 20 yards and that is how we train. As carguy said, training at greater distances helps with closer shots, trains for the rare distant shot with a handgun and has other benefits.

    I'm not sure what's supposed to be "the perfect" group but I can usually keep my group within 5-6 inches. As long as it is grouped center mass I'm happy with those longer shots.

    I do think it's important to train up close and personal as well whenever possible just so that you know what distances are what and can better adjust to close targets but if you have trained for distances you should find the transition an easier one.

    Also, moving and shooting, reloading and other IDPA style training is a great benefit to any concealed carrier even if it's just to put you under mock pressure and teach you the finer points of what you theoretically should know.

  9. #9
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    Lima, that's pretty good. I like your "range diaries". Cool stuff, nice work.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Array RebelRabbi's Avatar
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    You absolutely never need to shoot your pistol further than 10 yards unless there is someone at greater than 10 yards shooting at you or other innocent people. Seriously, learn to use your sights correctly. Most halfway decent shots can stay in the kill zone at less than 10 yards with no sights on the gun. A calm mindset and superb technical skills help to level the field against the BG's.

  11. #11
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    Rabbi...did you just say you train at 25 yards, or not? If yes, what sized groups do you shoot?

  12. #12
    Distinguished Member Array nutz4utwo's Avatar
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    I shoot at all distances.

    Very few people can keep all (or even most) of their shots inside a paper plate at 25 yards. Even in slow fire on a Saturday morning with no pressure. Shooting a handgun accurately requires constant practice so why not practice?
    "a reminder that no law can replace personal responsibility" - Bill Clinton 2010.

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    At 75', I'd be more worried about hitting something I didn't want to hit, then actually hitting what I was aiming at.
    Don't believe what you hear and only half of what you see!
    -Tony Soprano

  14. #14
    Member Array carguy2244's Avatar
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    A responsible shooter should practice until he/she is capable of consistent 8 inch groups at 25 yards. There are no excuses for carrying a weapon, and not being competent with it.

  15. #15
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    I don't understand why people are so surprised about shooting at 25 yards. When I was on a military pistol team years ago, slow fire was at 50 yards, and timed and rapid fire were at 25. Most of the guys on the team usually managed to group most of their shots in the 9 or 10 rings, using the standard (NRA) targets for those distances.

    Oh, and that was one-handed, unsupported with rimfire (.22), centerfire (usually .38), and service (.45) weapons. All 3 being used during the firing of a National Match Course!
    Rick

    EOD - Initial success or total failure

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