Drawing Against The Drop (DATD)

[RicT]

Excellent observations.

There are a couple videos on TFF depicting both the batting and the disarm/takedown.

Guantes,

Could you point me to these? I don't see them in the "Self Defense Tactics & Weapons" section, and I can't see any way to search on that site for just videos...

[DefensiveCarry.com]

[Guantes]

Can do stand by for a couple.

[Guantes]

RickT,
In the Other weapons & Tactics, in the Tactics section. On page 3 is a thread, "Officers Try To Shoot Me". It has the vieo depiciting parrying and on the second page of that thread is a video of the disarm.

[RicT]

RickT,
In the Other weapons & Tactics, in the Tactics section. On page 3 is a thread, "Officers Try To Shoot Me". It has the vieo depiciting parrying and on the second page of that thread is a video of the disarm.

Guantes,
Sorry to be a pest, but....are we talking about "TFF" being "The Firearms Forum"? Because I don't see any "Tactics" section, I don't see "Other weapons & Tactics", and if I try to search on that title, nothing comes up...

RicT

[Guantes]

Sorry. Threat Focused Forums

[RicT]

Terrific, got it; thanks!

[oakchas]

Black oak, If you look at post #17, you will see the weapon indexed on the inner elbow (click on the thumbnail pic for a better/bigger view) the inner elbow is now a "pivot point" for the barrel of the gun... which can sweep from side to side, like a gas guage on it's pivot. Not the best position for a revolver... will work better with a semi automatic (IMO). But, in either case assures your off arm is not in the line of fire.

[Black Oak]

I think that you guys are over thinking a simple problem.

Get your gun out fast and shoot the guy a couple of times in the chest.

If that does not work, then shoot him a couple of times in the head. Never mind worrying about blading, indexing or any other of the trainer buzz words. They sell product. They do not win gun fights.

Tom does it just right here. Fast and violent.

Although out of character for a hired killer. If a real hired killer saw his brief case walking away, he would have shot both of the bad guys in the back, and not bothered to trap them into a gunfight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmKR6evZRQQ

[Guantes]

I think that you guys are over thinking a simple problem.

Get your gun out fast and shoot the guy a couple of times in the chest.

If that does not work, then shoot him a couple of times in the head. Never mind worrying about blading, indexing or any other of the trainer buzz words. They sell product. They do not win gun fights.

I beg to differ with you on a couple counts.
Have you ever been in a gunfight with a gun stuck in you face? I have and some of the "buzz words" are what helped me win.
I'm not selling anything, I'm giving it away.
As I said befor, do as you wish and good luck.

[Black Oak]

I was not clear. That was a reply to oakchas,

not Gauntes

[Guantes]

You don't get to pick who responds to a comment on forums.

"you guys", would appear to have included myself.

[Black Oak]

Guantes,

Well Okay then.

You can be included if you like.

[Guantes]

Thank you, sir.

[Bill MO]

I think that you guys are over thinking a simple problem.

Get your gun out fast and shoot the guy a couple of times in the chest.

If that does not work, then shoot him a couple of times in the head. Never mind worrying about blading, indexing or any other of the trainer buzz words. They sell product. They do not win gun fights.

Tom does it just right here. Fast and violent.

Although out of character for a hired killer. If a real hired killer saw his brief case walking away, he would have shot both of the bad guys in the back, and not bothered to trap them into a gunfight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmKR6evZRQQ

I have to agree with Guantes and "beg to differ" on your statement. I suggest you try it your way with airsoft and see how it turns out before you face a real gun to try it on. If you are fast and draw without moving you may get the BG shot but he will shoot you too. (Both dead) Even try it Tom's way, 2 on 1 and see how good you are. TV makes it look easy. (My guess #2 shoots your A**) To make it work in the movie #2 had a hung-up draw, don't count on that in real life.

Even doing it Guantes way everything has to go to plan or you are shot. And I think Guantes will agree and has said so. Only for those times when you think you are shot anyway.

[oakchas]

Black oak,

I was trying to answer the questions you posted to Guantes regarding "indexing." You were asking for clarification. You did not understand Guantes' description ("failure to communicate").

"Tom's way," from A MOVIE, might work against one. As Bill points out, might not work against 2.

Guantes also linked to another site showing open handed defense against a gun in the chest (which apparently was using blanks). The defender was able to move the gun before a (trained) LEO was able to get off a shot. Guantes added an easy, simultaneous "side step" which most everyone calls "blading" (which presents a narrower target for the BG). And the reason for the "indexing" is to avoid shooting your own arm, the one that slapped away the BG's gun.

I agree, get your gun out quickly, and shoot.

And, the only reason it appears "over thought" with Guantes' method, is that he didn't do it in a video. If Tom's action in the movie were "scripted" you can bet it would have taken a lot of text to explain how the action scene was to occur:

Raise hands, a little higher with the left.... swat gun away, across BG's body, with the left. Reach to rear with strong side hand, unholster... (now, if you pause the video right here, you will see that the BG's right hand (the one with the gun) comes back around to his right, crossing Tom's body... in the real world... If the BG was pulling the triggger on that sweep... Tom might very well be dead.) CUT!

In any case, Drawing Against The Drop it is a risky move... but, if you can act quickly, you can lower the risk an Nth of a point, and maybe even prevail. IMO, you will not be successful, unless you practice with some frequency.