Some Thoughts On Point Shooting

This is a discussion on Some Thoughts On Point Shooting within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; 01/16/2011 Some Thoughts on Point Shooting By Roger Phillips Suarez International Specialist Instructor Recently there has been a decent amount of anti-point shooting talk in ...

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 28

Thread: Some Thoughts On Point Shooting

  1. #1
    Senior Member Array Sweatnbullets's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Posts
    728

    Some Thoughts On Point Shooting

    01/16/2011

    Some Thoughts on Point Shooting

    By Roger Phillips Suarez International Specialist Instructor


    Recently there has been a decent amount of anti-point shooting talk in some circles. While some of this talk comes from people that do deserve a good deal of respect, I feel that it would be wrong to not address some of the misrepresentations that have been made in order to cast a bad light on point shooting. The way that I look at it is, it does not matter how elite you are, if you are going to dismiss the accomplishments and skill sets of the elite that came before you, you have put your comments into the position to be judged by others, the same way that you have judged others. The bottom line is that point shooting as been used successfully by some of “the elite of the elite” for a very long time. It is a combat proven skill set used by some of the greatest gun fighters this world has ever seen, people such as Col. Askins, Jelly Bryce, Bill Jordan, Col. Fairbairn, Col. Sykes, British SAS, and Darby’s Rangers, just to name a few. To suggest that these men did not know how to get it done would be extremely presumptuous.

    I am going to give a point by point counter to some of these recent anti-point shooting statements and misrepresentations, my comments are in bold.

    Read more here
    http://www.warriortalknews.com/2011/...-shooting.html

  2. Remove Ads

  3. #2
    Senior Member Array Matthew Temkin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    nyc
    Posts
    707
    I love when people say, " I want to maintain distance--get both hands on the gun--use my sights at all times, etc, etc".
    Well, I will take it a step further and state for the record that I never want to have to fire a shot in anger.
    Funny thing about bad guys--they really don't give a damn about our wants and may force us to do things that we do not want to do.
    Hopefully they will not force you to do somethings that you never wanted to train/learn/prepare for.
    Which is why I practice all types of pistol shooting, from zero to 200 yards.
    Including point shooting.

  4. #3
    Administrator
    Array QKShooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Off Of The X
    Posts
    35,302
    Hey Roger...I just got that in E-mail VIA Suarez & I was going to copy and paste it here. You beat me to the punch. Good read.

  5. #4
    Ex Member Array Kerby's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Norfolk Va 23518
    Posts
    491
    Very good read! thanks.............

  6. #5
    VIP Member Array Old School's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Florida Treasure Coast
    Posts
    3,211
    Good read that re-enforces my training. Thanks for posting. The first photo at the beginning of the article illustrates why keeping your trigger finger along the side of the pistol helps you to point at the location of the target you desire to hit prior to engageing the trigger. That is one of the reasons people with limited training hit their targets at close range, they just point and shoot.
    "Violence is seldom the answer, but when it is the answer it is the only answer".

    "A nation of sheep breeds a government of wolves".

    http://www.woundedwarriorproject.org/

  7. #6
    Member Array chivvalry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    454
    Every time I run a shoot house with a pistol I end up point shooting whether I want to or not. You simply are not fast enough if you attempt to use the sights for every single shot. Close range and fast action lend themselves very well to this.
    "I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
    You are not paranoid if They are actually out to get you, however, They probably are not and you probably are.

  8. #7
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,867
    Anytime we allow ourselves to lock into a "mental box" mindset, it retards our capacity for learning and progress. There have been times I have been guilty of boxing myself in, and had to reconsider my ideas as compared with others on some issues we have discussed on this forum.

    Instinctive shooting is something I have always believed in. I grew up seeing it's benefits put in use by my grandfather. At one time in my pursuit of self defense handgunning and rifle skills, I took a long critical look at instinctive shooting in the SD arena, and I still believe it is a vital skill to strive for, and from my studies on it, I believe that more often than not, this is what happens in SD type shootings.

  9. #8
    Distinguished Member Array kelcarry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    charleston, SC
    Posts
    1,865
    I am far from an expert in anything firearm. I am just a guy who purchased his first firearm because I find infinite disgust in my federal government and do not trust anything they do. I am Jewish and I will not be a sheep like Jews were in the 1930's when they seemed to trust their german government to do the right thing. In addition to that horrible fact, I can only envision the use of my firearm within a fairly close distance for self defense; to me imminent danger of death or great bodily injury will only be known to me within relatively close eyesight and earshot, where the intent of the perp would be evident. Anything that prevents me from discharging my firearm immediately gives the perp that much more of a fraction of a second to do what he intends to do. That goes for sighting and laser acquisition; point shoot is the only way to maximize any response you can possibly make with your firearm. I may not be perfect and I may do it "my own way" but I practice having the firearm in my hand and immediately discharging it after pointing it at the target. Others can do whatever they feel is correct and others can have all the "play toys" they want attached to their firearms, but if the perp is better than they are and quicker than they are, their play toys will fall by the wayside, just like they will.

  10. #9
    Member Array chivvalry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    454
    Some would say using a laser is simply a fancy form of point shooting. If you are looking at your target instead of your front sight then you are point shooting. Lasers have been proven to, in most cases, increase target acquisition speed and accuracy. That said... I don't train with a laser.
    "I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
    You are not paranoid if They are actually out to get you, however, They probably are not and you probably are.

  11. #10
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,867
    I tried laser vs point and shoot and found that I was slower with the laser, which I can only surmise was do to looking for something , or chasing the dot, before firing. I'm sure experiences may vary, but I am quite confident with strictly instinctive.

  12. #11
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    5,272
    I have little to add, other than I agree re the values of speed and accuracy of the various types of point/instinct shooting.
    I base my opinion on having used it successfully in the real world.
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

  13. #12
    Member Array Greg Foster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Whidbey Island, WA
    Posts
    252
    Next time I'm at the range I'll practice point shooting. Up till now I've always used the sights.

  14. #13
    Member Array chivvalry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    454
    Quote Originally Posted by glockman10mm View Post
    I tried laser vs point and shoot and found that I was slower with the laser, which I can only surmise was do to looking for something , or chasing the dot, before firing. I'm sure experiences may vary, but I am quite confident with strictly instinctive.
    Hmm, perhaps I was misled. I've only used laser a few times and, frankly, didn't get clock times to compare against. My accuracy and groups seemed to be better with the laser but that may have come at the sacrifice of speed to fire. It does seem to be more likely that instinctive point and shoot vs. looking for the dot would be faster.
    "I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
    You are not paranoid if They are actually out to get you, however, They probably are not and you probably are.

  15. #14
    VIP Member Array glockman10mm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kentucky
    Posts
    8,867
    I guess it's something everyone should try. I used to constantly experiment in my training to find out what works the best for me over the most likely encountered scenarios. The laser was fun, and showed the flaws in my presentation and trigger control, but came at the expense(at least for me) of taking additional time to verify the dot. I think depending on what you are trying to achieve dictates the importance of accuracy over speed. For me, hitting the target before he hits me is more important. I can always adjust, reposition myself while firing, but that first bullet in flesh, IMO, will weigh heavily in the outcome.

  16. #15
    VIP Member Array Guantes's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Idaho
    Posts
    5,272
    Here is an article by someone, that some would consider an authority, on, "Ten Essential Skills You Need To Win A Gunfight".
    Note under #5, "A Quick, Smooth Draw", the fact long accepted by many that the one who gets the first hit, most often wins, in a gunfight.


    http://www.policemag.com/Channel/Pat...-Gunfight.aspx
    "I do what I do." Cpl 'coach' Bowden, "Southern Comfort".

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Links

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Similar Threads

  1. Point Shooting
    By TheOhioan in forum Defensive Carry & Tactical Training
    Replies: 74
    Last Post: March 31st, 2010, 04:12 AM
  2. Point Shooting
    By kelcarry in forum Defensive Carry & Tactical Training
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: February 3rd, 2010, 09:44 PM
  3. Point shooting???
    By fernset in forum Defensive Carry & Tactical Training
    Replies: 33
    Last Post: March 4th, 2008, 06:06 PM
  4. Point shooting _ vs _ ??????
    By Redneck Repairs in forum Defensive Carry & Tactical Training
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: June 18th, 2006, 07:08 PM
  5. How many of you use point shooting?
    By Tactician in forum Concealed Carry Issues & Discussions
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: March 2nd, 2005, 02:36 PM

Search tags for this page

chasing the dot shooting

,

how is point (instinctive) shooting different than other types

,

instinctive point shooting

,
instinctive shooting handgun
,
laser point shooting
,

laser vs point shooting

,
point and shoot tac
,
shooting silhouettes targets with thoracic cavity for sale
,
shooting under duress
,

some thoughts on point shooting

,

tactical point shooting

,
tempkin suarez phillips
Click on a term to search for related topics.