Range mishap has me rethinking BUG. Your thoughts?
This is a discussion on Range mishap has me rethinking BUG. Your thoughts? within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Right now, I carry a HK P2000SK in 9mm, DA/SA (v3) with Doubletap 124gr +P ammunition.
While the P2000SK has been ultra reliable, I'm familiar ...
December 29th, 2011 04:19 PM
Range mishap has me rethinking BUG. Your thoughts?
Right now, I carry a HK P2000SK in 9mm, DA/SA (v3) with Doubletap 124gr +P ammunition.
While the P2000SK has been ultra reliable, I'm familiar and comfortable with typical tap-rack-click drill and have performed it with a number of firearms under different occasions. Overall, while I don't claim to have a huge amount of skill, I feel like I understand the basics and feel comfortable executing them.
I shoot at a range that has dynamic steel targets. I really like this feature and they have different programs they can run including one where targets randomly pop up, then go back down which really highlights your limitations coming from shooting static targets only.
The only downside is you have to buy the range frangible ammunition.
This month, I did a 600 round session on the steels and I encountered a mishap that really shook me up. Not the event itself, but rather, what it would mean if it happened if you were actually defending yourself.
Basically what happened was one of these range loads (which are probably re-loaded brass) split, or ruptured inside the breach. The round fired fine, but the rupture caused the round to expand and failed to eject. REALLY fail to eject. I could not work the slide more than about a 1/2 inch.
I ended up asking the Range Master for help. He showed me how to get more force by holding the slide firmly with one hand and jamming the other hand into the back-strap simultaneously which provided enough force to open the slide.
But.. The round was still stuck in the breach, and he had to use a rod and tap the round out.
The whole time from my first attempts to eject the round and realized I couldn't, to after we got the round out, I was very uneasy with the thought that if this happened in a defensive situation I'd be SOL.
OK, I know that this is probably re-loaded brass of questionable quality and it is unlikely this would happen with premium defense ammunition, but it still makes me go "hmm" and made me think for the first time about carrying a BUG.
Your thoughts on any and all aspects of this are appreciated.
December 29th, 2011 04:19 PM
December 29th, 2011 05:03 PM
Anything no matter how good or dependable it is can break for what ever reason. And that time can be when you need it most, this is one of many reason why I carry 2 XDsc. If the first one stops working (out of ammo or malfunction) for what ever reason I go to the second one.
It's gotta be who you are, not a hobby. reinman45
"Is this persons bad behavior worth me having to kill them over?" Guantes
December 29th, 2011 05:05 PM
Your thinking seems to be on the right track to me. Anything mechanical can fail.
Personally, I like options. That situation didn't leave you with very many options at all.
A small auto or j-frame in your pocket would have been a great comfort at that point.
"Mind own business"
"Always cut cards"
December 29th, 2011 05:16 PM
A BUG is never a bad idea!
You can educate ignorance, you can't fix stupid
Retired DE Trooper, SA XD40 SC, S&W 2" Airweight
dukalmighty & Pure Kustom Black Ops Pro "Trooper" Holsters, DE CCDW and LEOSA Permits, Vietnam Vet 68-69 Pleiku
December 29th, 2011 06:41 PM
I have carried a BUG for the reasons mentioned, then again, how many extra pairs of glasses am I going to carry (and I am far more likely to damage or lose my glasses than have a firearm not fire in a SD situation). Are you more likely to need an extra battery for your cell phone or a BUG?
What happens if the spare tire goes bad. Contrary to the regular thought process carrying a firearm is like having a spare tire. It is there for emergencies. Do you carry a spare for your spare? How more likely are you to have a flat tire than a SD situation. A BUG is not really carrying a spare, it is carrying a spare for the spare.
I carry for confidence, and if you can't be confident with one firearm, if the law allows, carry two. At the same time, I don't like to go places where I feel a strong need to carry one gun, let alone two.
PS - If you are a LEO, I would carry a BUG :).
S&W 642 (no-lock) with .38 Spl +P 135 GR Gold GDHP
Glock G31 & G33 with .357 Sig 125 GR. SXT Winchester Ranger
December 29th, 2011 10:39 PM
It was range ammo, not your carry ammo.
Range sessions are not like ccw encounters.
Everything fails at some point.
Stuff happens and then you die.
My preference is to go without a bug.
December 29th, 2011 10:52 PM
This pretty much sums it all up for me.
Originally Posted by Thanis
"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
December 29th, 2011 11:06 PM
I have a spare tire, AND an air compressor in my cars. I have GPS, AND paper maps. I guess I am a "carry a spare for a spare" kinda guy...
Yes, carry a BUG. Every male should be able to carry at least a LCP in their off-side pocket.
NRA Life Member; Range Safety Officer
Glock 30, 19, 26; Ruger LCP (2), LCR, Mini 14; Remington 870; Marlin 336 .30-30
December 29th, 2011 11:09 PM
Seldom if ever would I carry a BUG...that's just me.
I'm comfortable with how I'm armed.
"That I cannot do."
"Give this to, uh, Clemenza. I want reliable people, people who aren't going to be carried away. After all we're not murderers in spite of what this undertaker thinks."
Certified Glock Armorer
NRA Life Member
December 30th, 2011 12:32 AM
If you can carry it, heck yeah cuz stuff happens. If you decide to, practice transition drills till your sick of them...
December 30th, 2011 01:33 AM
During my LE stint, I probably saved my partner's life (or from a severe wound) using my BUG after he was out of ammo and my service revolver had been knocked away while both of us were individually fighting off a couple of methed-up speed freaks during a domestic call gone terribly wrong; but that was an active, long-running LE event that would seldom ever be the case in a critical self-defense situation.
I still carry my BUG on many occasions when I'm dressed to do so - because I'm just used to it. However, when I realistically consider any critical situation where I am suddenly under such an immediate "life or death" threat to legally justify using deadly force, I'm going to be totally screwed if my weapon has a malfunction because there won't be any time to go for a BUG before that immediate threat does me in.
My advice is to carry only a high quality weapon with a widely reputable, time-proven dependability (unless you prefer to trust your life to a "bargain brand" POS to save a few bucks), frequently put the trophy-inspection and work the action on your carry weapon for any sign of the slightest possible problem or unusual wear, keep it frequently and meticulously cleaned whether you've fired it or not, use only high quality factory ammunition, and pray it works if you ever have to use it because there will probably be no time for a "second chance".
December 30th, 2011 02:51 AM
Get a revolver...problem solved
And so when man and horse go down beneath a saber keen, or in a roaring charge of fierce melee you stop a bullet clean, and the hostiles come to get your scalp, just empty your canteen, put your pistol to your head and go to Fiddlers green. U.S Army Cavalry
December 30th, 2011 11:31 AM
Yes, carry extra mags, and a BUG, and extra mags for the bug, and a BUG BUG, with extra mags, and then pack a pair of skates so you can get the heck outta Dodge when all else fails.
Sorry, couldn't resist the sarcasm. Everything fails eventually.
Retired USAF E-8. Avatar is OldVet from days long gone - 1979. Oh, to be young again...
Paranoia strikes deep, into your heart it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid...
"For What It's Worth" Buffalo Springfield
December 30th, 2011 12:47 PM
That is the reason that when I only carry 1 gun,,,, it is
a J frame S&W 38,,,, love autos ,,,, but they do fail
more than a wheelie. I have got lazy ,,,, should have 2
guns more consistently; a 5 shooter does have its limits
“I have a very strict gun control policy: if there’s a gun around, I want to be in control of it,”-Clint Eastwood
Better to have a 380 in your pocket than a 45 at HOME.
When seconds count, police are minutes away.
December 30th, 2011 12:56 PM
Ain't this about the truth? Never felt that uncomfortable going about my daily business that I desired to carry 2 guns. If I did, I would just stay home behind locked doors, and shut the blinds.
Originally Posted by OldVet
Ignorance is a long way from stupid, but left unchecked, can get there real fast.
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