Tactical Response: Any Thoughts?

This is a discussion on Tactical Response: Any Thoughts? within the Defensive Carry & Tactical Training forums, part of the Defensive Carry Discussions category; Originally Posted by suntzu Sorry, still trying to see how in the terms of self defense you need to have a person (not just a ...

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Thread: Tactical Response: Any Thoughts?

  1. #16
    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Sorry, still trying to see how in the terms of self defense you need to have a person (not just a person, but a HIGHLY SKILLED instructor, with credentials equal to or exceeding many who question his actions) without body armor there so you get the "feel" of shooting (difference between "feel" and "stress innoculation") with live rounds around real people. SWAT. SOCOM, HRT, yup. How many self defense scenarios entail taking out a BG standing 1 foot from a GG (Just a bit farther than 1 foot, of course if you've not met, nor trained with TR folks, how could you know other than to take as gospel, what others say. But, then again, the You Tube video shows an example)? But what ever flots peoples boat.
    Just a marketing stunt so folks go home and tell them what a cool thing they did. (Yup, lots of boats get floated each year. Many of the boats are/were rookies like myself, just trying to learn and many of the boats are "experienced" MILITARY, SWAT, HRCC folks just sharpening their skills and making sure there isn't some lil somthing that might be beneficial to them, over and above their extensive training they've already had) (As far as it being a "marketing stunt", I guess all of us have opinions, I know I've voiced mine here on numerous occassions, and some opinions are more accurate than others)

    Suntzu...your experience credentials are obviously (at least I would bet on it) much more extensive than mine. It seems that sometimes, those with more experience, are quite set in how they feel training should be conducted, and at what experience level certain parts of training should be presented based on student experience/background. Sometimes folks then tend to lose some of the "Open minded acceptance" of training conducted that differs from their perspectives. That's what makes our exchanges of information on here so very valuable, both for the experienced and the noobs. If you have a chance, consider some training with Tactical Response...They have MANY other offerings, other than the "photographer in front of the students" course. You might be surprised, providing you keep an open mind...By the way, I enjoy and respect the majority of your posts on here Suntzu. Thanks for sharing YOUR valuable knowledge and experience...JMO
    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

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  3. #17
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by First Sgt View Post
    Suntzu...your experience credentials are obviously (at least I would bet on it) much more extensive than mine. It seems that sometimes, those with more experience, are quite set in how they feel training should be conducted, and at what experience level certain parts of training should be presented based on student experience/background. Sometimes folks then tend to lose some of the "Open minded acceptance" of training conducted that differs from their perspectives. That's what makes our exchanges of information on here so very valuable, both for the experienced and the noobs. If you have a chance, consider some training with Tactical Response...They have MANY other offerings, other than the "photographer in front of the students" course. You might be surprised, providing you keep an open mind...By the way, I enjoy and respect the majority of your posts on here Suntzu. Thanks for sharing YOUR valuable knowledge and experience...JMO
    I admit I am set in my ways. And I have never really commented on Mr Yeager nor his school as far as if the training is good. I have heard many good things. Hope I didn't come across insulting to anyone interested in his course of instruction. Just a pet peeve of mine LOL. Remember: Safety first
    But seriously. I have seen folks injured in training acidents and I would hate to see a freak accident and have somebody get hurt. Yes I knw chances are small in this situation but like I said and you did: I am set in my ways and safety has always been important t me. My first job was a crewmember on OV-1 Mohawks before SF. Aviaition is very safety conscious and they lose lives every year. Stay safe everybody.

  4. #18
    Senior Member Array Chad Rogers's Avatar
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    Nothing wrong with replicating some of the reality of the two way range in my book. But it's not for everybody....
    tcox4freedom likes this.
    "People who take an Internet handle of a great warrior, are usually the first to go fetal when crunch time comes." - Me

  5. #19
    Ex Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    I admit I am set in my ways. And I have never really commented on Mr Yeager nor his school as far as if the training is good. I have heard many good things. Hope I didn't come across insulting to anyone interested in his course of instruction. Just a pet peeve of mine LOL. Remember: Safety first
    But seriously. I have seen folks injured in training acidents and I would hate to see a freak accident and have somebody get hurt. Yes I knw chances are small in this situation but like I said and you did: I am set in my ways and safety has always been important t me. My first job was a crewmember on OV-1 Mohawks before SF. Aviaition is very safety conscious and they lose lives every year. Stay safe everybody.
    So I was right your jaded...

    To be honest the camera man down range is a little out of my comfort zone, but I am keeping an open mind to his teachings. While I might not agree with all of what he has to offer, I am thinking about taking one of his classes.....

  6. #20
    VIP Member Array First Sgt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    I admit I am set in my ways. And I have never really commented on Mr Yeager nor his school as far as if the training is good. I have heard many good things. Hope I didn't come across insulting to anyone interested in his course of instruction. Just a pet peeve of mine LOL. Remember: Safety first
    But seriously. I have seen folks injured in training acidents and I would hate to see a freak accident and have somebody get hurt. Yes I knw chances are small in this situation but like I said and you did: I am set in my ways and safety has always been important t me. My first job was a crewmember on OV-1 Mohawks before SF. Aviaition is very safety conscious and they lose lives every year. Stay safe everybody.
    Totally understood..You weren't insulting at all....Someone alluded to you having been sick..sooo...Hope all is either well, or getting better...Take care Sir..
    Sometimes in life you have to stand your ground. It's a hard lesson to learn and even most adults don't get it, but in the end only I can be responsible for my life. If faced with any type of adversity, only I can overcome it. Waiting for someone else to take responsibility is a long fruitless wait.

  7. #21
    VIP Member Array suntzu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by First Sgt View Post
    Totally understood..You weren't insulting at all....Someone alluded to you having been sick..sooo...Hope all is either well, or getting better...Take care Sir..
    Just a tummy bug. You know , feel like doo doo for 24 hours then just fine after. I hardly ever get sick. But gave me some time to work on my book.

  8. #22
    Ex Member Array Harryball's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    Just a tummy bug. You know , feel like doo doo for 24 hours then just fine after. I hardly ever get sick. But gave me some time to work on my book.
    Look forward to it. Advanced copy would be nice. Hook a brotha up....

  9. #23
    Distinguished Member Array Hoganbeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by suntzu View Post
    I wouldn't train there but would make a donation for body armor for his cameraman.
    Actually, I think he is the camera man.

  10. #24
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    OV-1D crewmember.....

    Hi, everyone......new to this forum but a member of a few other weapon forums. While I personally have not done much training (Front Sight 2 and 4 day rifle, 2 day handgun back in 2001!) I have been getting the bug to get back on the horse, so to speak, and have been looking for courses and reviews of courses. This being one such case. While reading the reviews on this thread I noticed a former OV-1D Mohawk member, Suntzu. Not many of us out there! I was in from '84-'87 based in Stuttgart as a 96H......a "T.O.". Maybe we know some of the same people? Give me a shout back on this thread when you can......if it is alright with the administrators of the board.

  11. #25
    Distinguished Member Array tcox4freedom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chad Rogers View Post
    Nothing wrong with replicating some of the reality of the two way range in my book. But it's not for everybody....
    I agree. Back in the day, I trained with military, LEOs & civilian groups. But, it's not for everybody and should be done with extra caution. I have an instructor friend that trains some of his advanced students this way; and I recommend people take these courses for some of the lessons that can come from the experience.

    I like some of the TR videos on YouTube. But, I don't think I could put up with Yeager for more than a few minutes. Our personalities would most likely clash in a very BIG way!

    However, I might like to attend some of Gabe's or Thunder Ranch one day.

    -

  12. #26
    Senior Member Array KBSR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by First Sgt View Post
    Well said! I've taken his Fighting Pistol course and highly recommend it to anyone who has a sincere desire to learn to run their weapon and defend themselves and their loved ones. Check out Login To: GetOffTheX Forums and read the subforum Tactical Response Course Reviews by the folks that have taken Fighting Pistol. I think you will find the course sells itself based on student AAR's.

    Go with an open mind and be prepared to work your tail off...Here's MY AAR from Fighting Pistol...

    Fighting Pistol/ Shelby, NC/ March 23/24, 2009. Taught by James Yeager and Jay Gibson.

    I first heard about Tactical Response on another gun site. I checked it out, joined Get Off the X and started reading. I weighed the feedback that was given through course reviews by Alumni and my thinking wheels started turning. I researched info on other schools/courses/instructors, weighing the pros and cons of “the Others” vs Tactical Response. Bottom line was, I decided that Tactical Response offered exactly what I needed, a course to mold me from the ground up in how to protect myself and my family and potentially others. Yup, even a 60 year old can do it. I made a commitment to Tactical Response and myself and took the plunge.

    I arrived the night before and was met by Jimmy Ellis, an Alumni of Fighting Pistol, and the host of the course in Shelby. I thank him for his hospitality, both before my arrival and after my arrival. Things only got better! On the first day, it started with meeting and having breakfast with James Yeager, Jay Gibson, and Scott (another student). Then off to the range. I was extremely nervous as this was my first training course. The instructors introduced themselves and then each student did a brief intro/background on themselves. Surprisingly, the experience level ranged from me the “first timer rookie” , to students that had trained with other instructors, military, etc. In other words, experienced folks. Safety Safety SAFETY was emphasized from the get go. Then before I realized it, the course was off and running.

    I was/am a true novice with a pistol. This course was for me AND for the experienced shooters. The basics were covered. Proper holstering, grip, draw, reholstering, sight alignment, sight picture, trigger control, loading, unloading, ready positions, general shooting guidelines, and more. In other words THE BASICS that I needed to build upon. Then, the shooting began. Stationary shooting, moving and shooting, shooting from kneeling position, supine position (on your back), getting up and continuing the fight, and much more. Learning acronyms like F.A.S.T., M.O.V.E. and their IMPORTANCE to your survival. The three types of malfunctions were demonstrated and proper clearing techniques were taught. DAMN those orange dummie rounds! I must practice practice practice. But, it forced myself and everyone else to learn to do things the right way. MOVE MOVE MOVE. Don’t get caught up in standing there and clearing your malfunction while the BG shoots your butt, MOVE MOVE MOVE!! And then, if you have to reload, either due to dropping your magazine in clearing a malfunction, or being out of ammo, then reload the right way. "Pat….get your replacement mag out FIRST, drop your empty mag, get that elbow in, gun up, TAP, RACK, FIGHT. MOVE MOVE MOVE." I think I shall hear Yeager in my sleep.."MOVE PAT….DON’T F..KING STAND THERE!!! MOVE"…There was soooo much covered on day one, that my mind was reeling at the end. Back to the hotel, grab some supper, and get that homework done.

    Day two, this old man took two Aleve, rolled out of bed and crawled to my clothes and got ready for the range. James Yeager talked about Mindset, Tactics, Skills, the legal aspects of deadly force, and being mentally prepared for the choices that you MAY have to make at a moments notice and the consequences of your choices.…I will not go into the lecture other than to say, it was riveting, educational, attention getting, and is guaranteed to make you reevaluate YOUR commitment to training, protecting yourself, your family, your life, and being forever alert. Then more shooting. Utilizing cover and concealment. Shooting from “up close and personal” distance. Oh..let me NOT forget those damn Allen Dots…SIGH!! "Take a breath, relax, squeeze, SLOWLY SLOWLY SEE THE FRONT SITE SLOWLY SLOWLY…." Practice Practice Practice. I promise Jay, I’ll learn to hit those damn dots or hurt myself trying.

    So much was covered in two days, but in the end, I have the self satisfaction in knowing that I am much better prepared. I am proud of my accomplishments and have other things that I need to continue to work on so that eventually I can have that same feeling on them. I have developed confidence in knowing I can learn and master these skills. I will I will I will. None of this would have been possible without the patience, knowledge, and skills demonstrated by James Yeager and Jay Gibson. These guys are true professionals and committed to teaching their skills to others. If you are not doing something correctly, they will correct you, show you how it’s done, and will continue to insure you perform correctly. All of this is done without presenting any kind of condescending attitude, but with an attitude of “I want to give you the skills you need to survive!” I thank them for their patience. AND, every now and then Yeager told a joke that was funny! Thanks James and Jay. I firmly believe that whether you are a rookie, or at higher level(s) in your training and skills, Fighting Pistol is a course that ANYONE can learn something to improve their abilities. If you haven’t made a commitment to yourself, then DO IT NOW and take Fighting Pistol.
    Pat Northern, USAF Retired

    "Situations will arise which are not of your own choosing. You must be fully prepared to meet them with confidence, no matter what they may be..." Leonard Hector Grant-Taylor 1942
    That was a helpful AAR. Thank you Sir.
    " But if you are authorized to carry a weapon, and you walk outside without it, just take a deep breath, and say this to yourself... Baa." Col. Dave Grossman on Sheep and Sheepdogs.

  13. #27
    Member Array kdydak's Avatar
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    I have taken Fighting Pistol, Advanced Fighting Pistol, Fighting Rifle, Advanced Fighting Rifle and Immediate Action Medical classes from Tactical Response. I would HIGHLY recommend all of the above classes.

    These classes are probably not for everyone. If you go in with a mindset that you are the best and know everything about fighting with guns you will probably have a very unhappy experience. If you go with an open mind you will learn much from your failures in training.
    First Sgt likes this.

  14. #28
    VIP Member Array blitzburgh's Avatar
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    If anybody in South Carolina knows of a decent, respectable, reputable, "trainer" in the area, could they please mail me with info. Now that I can afford to attend something of this nature, I'd really like to before I head back off to Pennsylvania.
    "Rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God." - Benjamin Franklin
    "Experience: that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn." - C.S. Lewis

  15. #29
    Distinguished Member Array tcox4freedom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blitzburgh View Post
    If anybody in South Carolina knows of a decent, respectable, reputable, "trainer" in the area, could they please mail me with info. Now that I can afford to attend something of this nature, I'd really like to before I head back off to Pennsylvania.
    I do. But, you have to attend several of his basic classes before you can attend any of his advanced stuff. So, it wouldn't do you any good.

    -

  16. #30
    Senior Member Array Weeg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blitzburgh View Post
    If anybody in South Carolina knows of a decent, respectable, reputable, "trainer" in the area, could they please mail me with info. Now that I can afford to attend something of this nature, I'd really like to before I head back off to Pennsylvania.

    What type of class?


    If you are willing to drive north (NC), I know a place/outfit...very user-friendly, top-notch instruction.

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